I would be grateful for advice on my new rescue dog

[indianrunnerduck]

I adopted an 18 month old miniature poodle, 3 weeks ago, following the death of my beloved, 11.5 year old crossbreed.
I am an experienced rescue dog adopter, this is number seven, but I have never had a poodle before, the previous dogs were a lab/collie cross, staffies & lurchers. I feel a bit out of my depth & I am trying to figure out which of the issues are poodle related and which are background related or age related.

He previously lived, as a new puppy from a breeder, with an older person who was unable to look after him, within a year she was hospitalised, with mental health problems & he was taken by the dog warden to a rescue shelter. He had to stay there for six months because his previous owner didn't have the capacity to sign him over for re-homing. I was told that he was very nervous, of almost everything, especially other dogs, but with no aggression. He has missed out on socialisation, learning about everything in the outside world, he pulls like a train on the lead, but mostly because he is terrified, he is scared of almost all outdoor environments, woods, fields, the coast the street & seems to be on red alert, looking over his shoulders, the whole time. I can't let him off the lead yet as I think he would bolt out of fear. When he is inside, he barks at every single noise he can hear outside, really loudly and makes me jump out of my skin. He is generally very excitable. He also has separation anxiety, which I am trying to help him with by normalising him being alone, increasing the time I leave him by just a few minutes each time. I think my biggest concerns are the separation anxiety and the wild barking because I live alone and I feel that I have just made my world really small & isolated. I do appreciate that it is very early days.

The positive things are that he is now house trained, he is not pulling on the lead so much, I can interrupt the barking & he settles (but obviously I can't stop it happening in the first place) he travels perfectly in the car & we have formed a bond already. He is also showing a promising, shy interest in other dogs, if they are calm & steady. As well as training in short bursts every day, lead walking & praising all his good behaviour, I have found a local secure field, on a farm, where he can be the only dog and run free to burn off all the energy he has and hopefully learn a reliable recall. I will take him for the first time later this week.

I imagine that his experience in the kennel was terrifying for a sensitive 12 month old puppy, it was very basic, with constant barking from all the other residents & of course he has been wrenched from the only person he knew.
Also, he is still only 18 months old so he could maybe calm down as he matures? I have only had older rescues before.
I guess that I am hoping to hear some reassuring advice from people with experience of poodles & with the clarity of mind that I don't have at the moment.

Any advice or observations gratefully received. Thank you so much if you have read all this & are able to relate or comment.

Poodles are very clever dogs, so they need their brains tiring out. Lots of training will be good.
Find some calm dogs for him to meet.
You need to teach him to be quiet on command. You’ll find how on line.
Good luck, they really are wonderful dogs.

Sounds like you have made some fantastic progress in the three weeks you have had him. I think you’re doing all the right things and with time he’ll get better and better.

I would give it some more time and then if there are still issues, work with a behaviourist. I haven’t had a poodle, but know a few, and they do seem to be barky dogs but they are very smart and trainable so I don’t think it would take long to train them.

If you can afford £27.99 per month, I'd highly recommend signing up for Adolescent Dogs Online Academy

https://www.adolescentdogs.com/academy

Not only do you get training videos and webinars, you also get a Facebook group with 'Training Tips Tuesday' where you can ask for specific help, and 'Feedback Friday', where you can send a video of what you're working on for advice.

The most helpful thing, for you, is that Mike Newland, an experienced behaviourist, holds a Q&A session each week live on Zoom. You can send questions and videos of behaviour, and he gives detailed, bespoke advice and support.

It really is worth every penny.

Honestly, I think you’ve done a lot in three weeks and you need to give him time to settle. Of course he will as he begins to feel safe and learn the boundaries of his new life, but it can take longer than you’d like, I’ve found. It took 3 years for one of mine to reliably recall and I have another who, after nearly two years, still will not walk on a lead (that’s actually heartbreaking, she’s so terrified, she just pancakes herself on the ground 💔)
In terms of the barking inside, ignore it completely. He’s alerting because he’s anxious but, if you do not react at all, as he learns to trust you he will follow your lead. Also, the more he settles and the more exercise and stimulation he can cope with and enjoy, the more he will settle. And, as I’m sure you have already experienced, they all do come good in the end. Another of mine hid behind the sofa for the first month after we brought her home. Refused to come out, I had to feed her there. It took about a year but she’s utterly bombproof now, has been for almost a decade and is the matriarch in my house - she shows all the new ones it’s safe. Good luck xx

I've got a very nervy sprocker who is on Reconcile (Prozac) from the Vet. It's not been a miracle cure by any stretch of the imagination, but it's given her the ability to cope with noise/general life better. She's much happier when we're outdoors for a walk and we meet other dogs. She's been on it for just over 7 months now and I would hope to taper it to a lower dose/off over the next 12 months or so, but if that doesn't work I'll keep her on it. She's not a rescue, I'd add, we had her at 10 weeks - but came from a very noisy busy family home and she's super sensitive to noise. We'd tried lots of herbal supplements etc but nothing worked.

@MrsLizzieDarcy do you mind me asking what dose you have yours on and what are you hoping to taper to? I am considering trying it for our 🐩

I'd stop walking him for a bit to allow him time to decompress. If he is on high alert all of the time, his cortisol and adrenaline levels will be elevated. He needs a quiet space and time to relax to bring those levels down.
Once he has relaxed, he will hopefully be less reactive in the home. Then I would start walking him, but take him to a quiet place like the freedom field, where he can explore his surroundings without having to cope with meeting other people and dogs.
Then I would slowly introduce him to new things, using counter conditioning to help improve his emotional response to scary things.

Thank you so much to everyone for your fast & encouraging advice. I think I need to relax myself, somehow I seem to have lost my confidence a bit with this one & I feel a bit out of my comfort zone with the crazy barking and the separation anxiety. Your calm replies have reminded me that this is not my first rodeo and somehow all the others came right in the end, to the point that I have forgotten all the stress and anxiety they all caused me at the time!
I will try to focus on the positives, to enjoy our journey together & to get some support, I am determined to get it right as this little soul deserves a second chance.
Thank you again for taking the time to respond.

OP I feel for you, that feeling of your world becoming smaller is really hard 😔 I echo what others have said - it sounds like you have made great progress. I would say in response to you trying to unpack what is your new ones circumstances vs general poodleness - I’m inclined to say the former exacerbating traits of the latter. Though they do vary in temperament individually I have found that mini and toy poodles can be anxious little things and can become overwhelmed. Yes they are super smart and highly trainable esp where LOTS of positive reinforcement and praise is involved, but it need to be done slowly at their pace. Too much too soon (esp. with the seperation anxiety and exposure type training for other fears) leads to increased stress and ingrained patterns of behaviour. I think the term is ‘situation stacking’ (but don’t quote me on that. They really benefit from: routine & knowing what’s happening, mental stimulation like (fun) short bursts of training and toys that stimulate their mind plus lots of nosework, good amounts of physical exercise, and also, where you can, removing/sheltering them from the things that trigger them whilst you slowly work on those things. So if that’s noise, try and block it out as much as you can.

And also, staying calm as much as you possibly can because they feed off their owners energy. Hard when they are making us jump out of our own skin by their sudden barking I know!
I saw on a television programme a dog trainer saying that a dog barking is alerting us to perceived threat, if we just ignore it they will keep going. So to ‘thank’ them in a high piched tone (as opposed to a telling off tone) after they bark. Then immediately praise and reward in that moment that they stop and look at you. And then distract them - ask them to do something, or engage in play etc. So that they don’t get fixated on waiting for/hearing and barking at the next noise. I have tried (and continue to do) this myself with good results, but I believe the issue will never be completely remedied for mine. But it does make us both feel more in control and stops the spiralling of anxious behaviours.
Small poodles are not happy being left for long periods. I would suggest while yours settles in and builds confidence with you and all of your fantastic training, don’t do too much leaving alone. Work on building up his confidence in ‘settleing’ in a safe area whilst you are in the house, don’t try and do too much leaving alone at home yet, but when you do do both, make sure he has had both physical and mental exercise first. Good luck and don’t forget to enjoy establishing your new bond with your beautiful new boy!

Finally: I think many of the things I’ve said are likely things you already are aware of with your previous experiences of dogs. But I am writing specifically with poodles in mind 🐩 ❤️

@Procrastihater thank you for your thoughtful posts, I am grateful for any insights and observations as I was beginning to feel that I was losing the plot with the poodle energy and anxiety 😱I forgot that I had managed to steer all the staffies, lurchers & other random crossbreeds through the early stages & had begun to feel that I was not fit for the job of steering an 18 month old poodle. I will take on board everything that everyone has said and remember that even if things go a bit pear shaped one day, every minute is a new beginning & it is my job to remain calm & provide a port in a storm. It's clear to me that a slow and steady approach will yield results, or maybe not... I'll have to wait & see. I was just feeling the weight of responsibility as I don't have anyone to tag team with & feeling the effects of being housebound with a whirlwind of crazy barking!

@indianrunnerduck I am sure it will yield results!! You sound like the best person to be steering this ship! Your poodle is lucky to have you ☺️

It sounds as though you're making great headway already! Our current rescue is a lurcher (bull terrier x greyhound) and was very nervous but with fear aggression when we first had him. He didn't sniff anything, always scanning around looking for dogs and people to be scared of. He still has fear aggression with other dogs (5 years later) so we avoid, but we can walk past people without a problem now and he actually likes women.
Carry on what you're doing, and he'll be great in a year or two. I know that sounds alike a long time, but the formative months are so important it takes a good ol' while to reverse.
He's a lucky lad, he's fallen on his feet with you.

Thank you for your encouraging message @deadpan I am committed to going at his pace as I feel that he is not really in a place to learn too many new lessons at the moment, because his furry head is full of anxiety & fear. It's all he can do to put one foot in front of the other because he is on the lookout for danger ahead and behind 😥 He would definitely be a bolter if he wasn't on a lead. He doesn't have any aggression but it's heartbreaking to see him so scared and unable to enjoy his new found freedom. However, for now I am focusing on the small wins and looking forward to leaving the house again one day, for longer than 10 minutes!!

One of my lurchers, a German Shepherd/greyhound cross was fear aggressive though and that was a real challenge as she was so strong and very vocal. I felt like people were never glad to see us out on our walks 😬

Many thanks again to everyone who has taken time to reply to my first ever thread.

Are you playing music at home? I always found it helped to have background noise- took the edge off the outside noise.

And re ignoring the indoor alerts, without eye contact start shuffling treats on the floor or playing with one of her toys. Not calling or interrupting, but ‘coincidentally’ starting something more interesting.

Scent games for poodles are really good. My sister hides and sometimes buries things around the house and garden with a tiny drop of truffle oil on them. Keeps the pooch amused for hours. Lots of socialisation with other dogs is good, maybe doggy day care once a week if you can afford it.

@Procrastihater we started off on the human dose at 20mg (Fluoxetine) but the Vet was pulled up for issuing it when there's a veterinary alternative (Reconcile) - so she's on 32mg. It did make her a little sleepier going from the 20mg to the 32mg, but she's doing well now. I'm hoping that we can split the tablets in half and go for the 16mg eventually. She's much less reactive to noise and to other dogs when we're out.

Nothing to add specifically poodle related, but have you tried adaptil? I use the cat version (feliway) and I can really notice a difference when using. Also heard great things about Thundershirts.

If he’s real stressed out on a walk, tbh, I wouldn’t really be walking him - I’d just sit outside your house with him and a load of treats and after a couple of weeks start just exploring your street a bit and then pick one quiet place you can take him, but again expect to just hang around for a while and build up from there real slowly.

Background noise in the house can help, I use white noise instead of music - me and the dog have different taste in background music 😐😂 so I settled on rain

Thank you once again to everyone for all your advice and suggestions.

I took him to the freedom field yesterday and it was a hugely positive experience, wonderful to see him off lead for the first time, running like the wind. I also discovered that he is more than happy to run back to me when called, which was great but I am aware that his recall would not be reliable if he was in a situation where he was scared, I think he would bolt for sure, at this stage anyway.

To posters who asked if I am playing music, no, I never have the radio or tv on in the background as I like silence! I have realised that I missed a trick there & my house is probably far too quiet for this young boy & this has contributed to bat ears being able to detect every single sound outside 😳 especially after spending so much time in the rescue kennel, with the constant clanging, banging and barking. The radio will be on from now on & I think it has made a difference.

I am still confined to the house, on account of the separation anxiety and we are at 15 minutes now, which is progress but not really enough time to be useful! However, I don't want to undo our progress by jumping ahead too soon but I am not sure if I am overthinking this. How do you know, until it's too late?

Anyway, generally feeling more relaxed, with the benefit of the support I have received.