Summer 25 pups

[Lavenderdog]

Any other new puppy owners around this summer? Have been looking back at some of the old puppy support threads and can see how helpful it was for those posters to share their experiences.

9 week old mini schnauzer here - so toilet training and avoiding those needle sharp teeth are the current main activities here!

(And being tolerant of her determination to rid my garden of lavender plants. Hence my user name 😂)

Those of you whose pups are out walking - or indeed, to anyone who can help, how did you work on ‘nice’ lead walking?
I use a harness with Pablo, sometimes he walks fairly nicely with just verbal corrections and other times he lunges forward.
Trying to get a balance of - should I just accept this as pup behaviour and not sweat it too much and carry on as I am vs should I work on it more now in the hope that he is more manageable when bigger?
And if the latter, what things have you guys done that have worked? I’ve heard all sorts suggested, walking in the opposite direction when they pull, stopping completely. Some advocate using a verbal command such as ‘heel’, others say they should learn that being on the lead itself should be the signal to walk nicely.

Sometimes he just lunges forward because it’s so exciting, other times it’s because he sees another dog or human and wants to say hello! I seem to be able to control him better when we go to the off-lead portion of the walk! I managed to get him to sit and stay politely in the field last night while a group of people were walking past us. Could have been a fluke though?

We’ve been wondering that too @VanGoSunflowersas SoupDog pulls 90% of the time on lead as she’s so excited and wants to sniff everything. We’ve got a bungee lead now and do about 10 minutes training each walk. If she’s on a longer walk it gets better if you walk at a brisk pace. We use the stop when she pulls, get her to sit then move on method - and practice “heel” in the house and garden off lead. She’s still only 5 months and I don’t expect good loose lead walking until she’s at least over 1 if not longer. We also work on sitting and ignoring other dogs and walkers which is more of a priority at this stage. We had a bit of off lead in the park today to practice recall and she stole a bit of baguette from some picnickers. Epic fail!

@soupmaker thanks for the tips. I probably need to spend more time teaching him to walk to heel off-lead maybe? I’m lucky in that I have two
enclosed fields about a 5 mins walk from my house and the times I go, I rarely come across another person or dog in there. So I had him off lead pretty
much from day one. I dunno if it’s fair to say his recall is good? He comes to me every single time I call him so far but is that a puppy thing because they don’t want to be too far away at this age? He has more form for trying to trip me up 😂

I probably just need to make more effort, I’m ashamed to say that we do the very short leading walking part of the walk in a half-cocked, sorta trying to train kinda way because we both want to get to the good bit 😂

One of these.

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Fits in the middle between the back seats. Dog has just come back from a 5 hour trip to the North (with a couple of wee breaks) and sat in there quite happily and had a sleep…

Well that was interesting, he walked beautifully on the lead today but ignored me a few times in the field. I reckon he has a secret MN account, read my earlier post and thought “I’ll show her” 😂

@VanGoSunflowers it's one of the things I really wish I'd worked on more with Bill - when he was little we were only walking to a handful of places, and they weren't far, so it didn't seem to matter. But then he got to his full size and strength (which is less than a full grown Lab of course) and he is an absolute unit. That chonk is all muscle and I now have a walking belt in order to be able to have him on a long line and still keep all my limbs attached.

There are a few things you could do. If you have a good safe harness like a Perfect Fit, it'll have a d-ring at the front and the back. You can attach the lead at both ends when you're working on nice walking, and just to the back when it doesn't matter so much.

As @brushingboots suggests elsewhere, sometimes it's hopeless trying to get them to walk nicely - Bill can't help himself when he needs a poo or we're going somewhere exciting. On the way home he can trot like a show pony on a gossamer line, if he can be arsed.

My own feeling is this is one of those things, like recall, that you start now knowing that you're going to go backwards at 7-8 months, but the more you persist, the more you'll get the benefit. Eventually. Bill is improving incrementally despite being a nobhead teenager so there is always hope!

Bonnie is in puppy school and they talk about building rewards for being near. So to start when they look back at you give a treat and encourage focus. Then when she’s walking close to me she gets a treat. And you can keep tightening it up into a heal as they get better at it but we’re not there yet. She mostly walks with a loose lead now but sometimes gets too excited but she’s a puppy so I’m pleased with how she’s doing.

Thank you @Bupster, that makes a lot of sense. I guess that applies to most training? Expect him to go backwards at that age on most things but it doesn’t mean I can’t work on it again. Sorry for being dumb but is ‘perfect fit’ a range of harness?

@BarkItOff ahh that’s a great tip, thank you! So just working on it in increments. I do wonder if he was slightly better last night because I walked him just before his last meal of the day so he was probably hungry! I suppose they do say to set them up for success!

I tried taking Pablo to puppy classes, they’re every Thursday but last Thursday was too hot for him to be running around in a stuffy village hall. I wasn’t overly pleased with the first class but I think I might keep going as, if nothing else, I’m trying to train him in a room full of distractions!

Don’t they say the socialisation window starts to close at 14 weeks and is firmly shut at 16? How true do you all think that is? We’ve missed out on doing a load this weekend due to the heat so I feel like we going to need to do a little roadshow this week seeing as he will be 14 weeks tomorrow!

@VanGoSunflowers I do the very old fashioned, bend down when I walk the puppy and have treat in my hand so the the less. Reward every few paces with a ‘cue’ word (‘heel’ is ours) and repeat. Twatdog got it after two weeks (and he’s really not the brightest spark in the box). Gives me a terrible back ache, but usually I only have to do it for two weeks or so and puppies have 100% got it.

Honestly, I hate puppy training classes with a vengeance. Trainers always play favourites and if a dog is acting up their suggestion always appears to be ‘give it a toy or king’ (yes let’s give an overstimulated puppy a toy or a food, that won’t wind them up more…). Also, sticking puppies in a room with each and expecting them to pick up commands when most of the time they don’t even have them 100% down at home is just a terrible idea!

Try not to worry too much about the socialisation window. You’ve done loads with Pablo. A few days off, as long as he’s still getting walks in, is fine 😀

Shall I give my thoughts or is it irrelevant? @VanGoSunflowers 🤔

I know it's kind of different for me with a guarding breed; the focus with gundog breeds is always on off-lead work. But on the other hand, Pablo is clearly going to be significantly bigger, heavier and stronger than a WCS, so close lead walking without him dragging you all over the place is going to be pretty vital. It's also important if your son is going to have any chance of walking him a couple of years from now.

As you know, my girl is a complete demon on the fields, but with short lead walking she's an angel. She trots along beautifully with a loose lead. It's always been our main focus, because we live at the top end of a moorland village, so to get down to the nature reserve/meadow/woodland involves a fair bit of pavement. I have to be able to negotiate the hill without the dog pulling off my feet.

Because of the vaccines, we didn't get Brie out until 14 weeks, by which time she was larger than an adult cocker. Initially I had her on a harness, which goes against all the breeders/vets/trainers advice for dogs of this size. This is one area where lovely @Bupster and I don't quite see eye to eye. For me, although I tried with both Algy & Brie, a harness does not give enough control, she had too much strength in her chest and I couldn't steer her in the right direction. I persevered for weeks with different types of harness and lead combinations, double ended training leads etc. But she was all over the place and not walking nicely. Almost as soon as I switched to collar only, things improved. I use two different EzyDog collars (double up and check mate) with a 6 foot webbing lead. This is what works for me, but we're all different and our dogs are different.

Again, this, like crating, is maybe an area where large size is an advantage. With a dog whose neck and head is level with your hip, a collar allows very close control when needed. I realise Pablo won't be that tall but it still may be worth trialling a collar for road walks just to see how you get on, even if you still use a harness for long line/ off lead training.

The only commands I use for close lead walking are "wait" and "slowly". I use wait at junctions but I don't use sit while walking, because of their size; their huge bum and long tail can block half the pavement, so nicely standing to wait is preferable. She's not much of a puller, but "slowly" said low and slow is useful for moments of eagerness.

Sorry for the essay, it might not be helpful at all. But, as Landsharks and I always say to each other, with the larger breeds a lot of everyday stuff is different, so some of this might be of interest if another big pup turns up on the thread at any point.

In agreement with @LandSharksAnonymous as usual. Not all pups do well in classes and you won't always see eye-to-eye with the trainer. For me, it was too much pressure and more treat driven that I wanted my training to be. But it's a very individual thing. I also didn't get along with 1-1 sessions. Too much the rebel I guess😉

I’ve started some lead training in the garden as he’s only 10 weeks old so not allowed out in public yet.

He’s very much a fan of sit down and look at me. I wait for him to move and praise/treat that. I know if I offered him a treat he would move - is that forming a reliance on bribing?

I’m not crate training but do need to build up his time alone. If I’m around in house/garden but not giving him attention he’s fine and isn’t glued to me at all. Quite happy pootling about and entertaining himself. But I practised leaving house and waited outside front door for 1 minute and he immediately whines. Any tips? Or just ride it out?

We did Dogs Trust puppy classes for 4 weeks. Even as a complete novice I realised they were only going to be mildly helpful. I’ve been trying your method too @LandSharksAnonymouswe had SoupDog out last night and got about 3 minutes of good walking so it’s an improvement! She was very chuffed with herself, my back was killing me.

@soupmaker I'm surprised you could read what I said - I just read it back and it made no sense to me 😁It does feel like the best way to do it though. Puppies respond best (if they're food motivated) to food in front of their nose. I sometimes see people trying to do it with their hand just dangling by their side, or straight backed, and it just ends up with the puppy bouncing up and down.

Hopefully in a week or so SoupDog will have the gist of it and you can move back to standing like human again! After about 10 days - 2 weeks I can usually move to standing straight again just with a bit of food in my hand. I always smile when I tell mine to walk to heel these days as they take it in turns to jab their snout into my hand to try and get the treat out of it 😃I must look like the local nutty dog woman with four dogs prancing along next to me, grinning up at me with their snouts pressed into my hands.

We will keep at it @LandSharksAnonymousSoupDog is a WCS so massively food driven but also massively prey driven - she pulls immediately on seeing any sort of bird, feck knows how she’ll be when she spys a squirrel. We live in a city in walking distance of two massive parks so recall training going to be vital and ongoing. 😂

I bring my nine week old black Labrador pup home on 25th July

Bet you can't wait!
Boy or girl?

@LandSharksAnonymous and @CoubousAndTourmalet both extremely helpful, thank you so much! Extremely right about getting him to walk nicely so my son has half a chance of walking him!

I will use @LandSharksAnonymous method, as I said before I was probably being a bit sloppy with it because I just wanted to get to the good bit so that’s totally on me 😂 so I just need to try harder and refine more!

Past two walks we have done before a meal, which seems to work because he is hungry! And he has walked nicely most of the 5 mins there/back without me feeling too much like a human pez dispenser 😂. I’ve made the mistake of not swooping low enough which has caused him to jump up but I think he is starting to get hang of ‘paws on the ground’ now for earning a treat. So we shall persevere this way unless anything drastic changes.

I definitely wasn’t keen on the trainers in the puppy class. I didn’t think we were getting much of value, and they did just assume I hadn’t done anything with him at all and would walk over, remove his lead from my hand and start using commands like ‘wait’ even though I had taught him ‘stay’ to mean the same thing. And kinda spoke to me in a pretty patronising tone - although I guess that’s my ego talking as maybe they assume it’s safe to think they’re all completely untrained pups! Tbh, I’d rather wait until he is a little older and try some gun dog stuff with him unless I come across any real issues with him and need expert guidance 🤷‍♀️
I paid for 4 classes up front but they are a local charity run thing so I don’t mind that. It may be more pertinent for dogs that can’t get around other dogs in a controlled way maybe? But I don’t think I will be going back!

Yes! Same here! I don’t take that well to having orders patronisingly spoken to me 😂😂

Pablo was exactly the same at 10 weeks. I’ve but him up slowly and he can be left for half an hour now (he is now 14 weeks)

I have a gate so he is contained in the kitchen when I’m not here but before leaving him, I would put him in there and literally stand in the hall, come back, calm praise and a treat and repeat (max ten mins a session) I started with literally ten seconds and built it up from there. Flitting in and out after random intervals of time. If he whines after a minute, try 30 seconds.

First time I ‘left’ him, I sat in the car on my drive and watched him on a pet cam (downloaded an app on to my iPad and used that for the camera) to see where his tolerance was. Repeated the ‘experiment’ several times and realised that he could handle about 40 mins so I kept trips out to half an hour max. Have left him to do the school run and I still have the camera on to listen for him and he is consistently fine with half an hour and is usually settled down asleep when I come back.

I think the best advice that @LandSharksAnonymous and everyone else on the adolescent thread gave me was that you know your dog and what they can tolerate (this was after getting a bollocking from the breeder because I hadn’t left him alone yet!)
Some people prefer not to leave at all until older, which I totally understand. Some advocate more for throwing them in the deep end and just ignoring the signs of distress but that didn’t sit right with me.

Again, the others will probably be able to give better advice but this is what has worked for us.

@VanGoSunflowers I think classes can be useful for some pups, from a socialisation perspective, but if you're able to manage by yourself it does take a lot of pressure off. Trying to train when pup is overtired and overstimulated is just pointless.

Thanks @VanGoSunflowers

Thats very sensible advice. Think I have a petcam in a cupboard from a few years ago that someone bought us for previous DDog (she was old and slept on sofa when we left her so camera wasn’t needed!)

I’ve also started ‘threshold’ type training so when I’m doing stuff in the kitchen he can’t get underfoot (as it’s at best annoying and potentially dangerous) so hopefully establishing some boundaries with help us coexist!

Think having the summer holidays off for puppy training may end up being mixed blessing as I have quite a lot of time to overthink things 😂

@VanGoSunflowers oh bless Pablo! That's the retriever tummy for you though - if the food isn't close enough, they'll jump. Fat little things, aren't they?😃

@Paws4thought25, VanGo is right - every dog is very different when it comes to being left. My youngest (2.5 now) has only recently started not sitting on the bathmat whilst I shower but his grandma probably would have tolerated being left alone all day, every day, as long as she had food.

@CoubousAndTourmalet I often wonder the logic of doing puppy training classes in the evening tbh. I know people work during the day (she says, on SUPL) but surely it would make sense to charge that tiny bit more and do a Saturday or Sunday morning? Witching hour (6-8) seems to be prime-time for puppy training classes, and it seems insane to me that everyone knows puppies are little gits when they're over-tired but they also think evening puppy classes are a good idea!

How exciting! I’m partial to a black Labrador myself 😉
Have you any names picked out yet?

@Paws4thought25 I totally sympathise with the overthinking and have been guilty of doing it myself! Still, I personally think it shows you care 😊

I still can’t believe the difference in him in just a few weeks from when he was ten weeks (where you are) until now. He’s definitely more confident and even more settled which is lovely to see.