Dog training - how do I reinforce something our dog isn’t doing?

[Itsarecipefordisaster]

We have a big dog (40kg). She’s 7 or 8 so no longer a puppy. She moved in with my DP about 2 years ago.
She insists on lying at the bottom of the stairs which is kind of the centre of the house. It’s also right in front of the front door and I’m tired of cleaning dog grease off the door. Stepping over a big dog at the bottom of the stairs is a recipe for disaster! We’ve told her to move enough times that she knows she shouldn’t be there. If I catch her there she moves before I even have chance to speak. So she definitely knows. If I don’t leave something to prevent her lying there she just gets up when she sees me. How do I stop her lying there? How do I reinforce not lying there? Thanks

Maybe this is now a “me” problem, but she knows she shouldn’t do it. She’s a 40kg dog, she’s not inconsequential and if she thinks she can get away with things she knows are naughty all hell could break loose

She really, really doesn't have a concept of naughty behaviour or "know" that she can't do it. She's a dog doing normal dog behaviour. They're opportunistic. As others have said dogs like to sit where they can observe. Train her what you do want her to do instead, such as a place or bed command, or prevent her access. They're your two options.

You say dogs are new territory for you but she's lived with you for 2 years? That's not really new!

Sounds more to me like it's an issue to you as you're not really bonded to her and maybe begrudge her being there a little?

I have an almost 40kg dog and she stands or lays in the most inconvenient places practically all of the time. Even skirting boards that she doesn't even brush against end up with a muddy dusty film. It's annoying but I wouldn't feel I needed to train her out of it, especially not as it might make her become naughty in other ways. It's all just a minor annoyance as she does many more things which make me happy 🥰

Totally get it's different for you though as you never chose to have a dog in the traditional sense. Could you perhaps try to bond with her more?

@Itsarecipefordisaster You needed a Whippet!
small, non greasy, like to lie somewhere comfy out of the way, like their bed or a corner of a sofa.

The barging past you shows she has no respect for you at the moment-
Some professional training with you might help.

A dog would just move a hairbrush!
-or chew it!
I can’t see a hairbrush working with a dog
Plus my Whippet loves being brushed with a soft bristle brush.

@Itsarecipefordisaster Groom the dog daily outside to keep the shedding down.
It should keep the coat much cleaner as well.

They love standing at the head of the stairs😂 to see who is coming and going- like a wooden mountain.

Put a bit of vet mat at the bottom of the stairs.
Reward her for sitting on it.
Send her to her mat on command, reward.
Move mat and repeat.

I was being sarcastic.

Sorry @Hedgerow2 new puppy and not quite with it. 🤦‍♀️

I came here to say exactly this. She is a dog, she has emotions and opinions, but doesn't have a moral code or a sense of right and wrong. She only knows what she gets rewarded for and what makes you angry. If she's moving out of the way it's because she's afraid of your reaction, not because she knows it's naughty. Nor is this about 'respect' - again, that's just another word for fear.

If you want her to lie somewhere else, reward the place you want her to be, and prevent access to the place you don't want her to be.

I do think one of the other posters had some insight when they suggested you might not be very bonded with her. It does sound like you're treating her like an unwanted child rather than a loved dog, assuming motivations that the dog can't have and not really interested in why she might be doing what she's doing. If she's not your dog, that's completely understandable and I'm not having a go, but you might find it easier to live with her if you were able to empathise with her more.

My friend’s rescued Staffie is absolutely lethal as a trip hazard.
He tends to get right behind you , especially in the kitchen, I step back ( Whippet gets out of my way) but the Staffie just stands there like a massive boulder.

I think we definitely get used to the dogs we have
He also lies in doorways and at the foot of stairs, but does move .

@Itsarecipefordisaster no she DOESNT KNOW! What she knows is you get cross with her for lying there so she moves.
She doesn't under WHY she just is scared enough of your reaction.
It is on you to manage the situation not on her to understand something she doesn't.
This is not her being naughty. You need to work out what she likes about lying there and recreate it elsewhere.
A rather than punishing her for what you don't want her to do reward her when she gets it right. So when you come down the stairs and she is lying where you do want her to be you need to actively reinforce that. Tell her she's good, give a treat etc. make it worth her while to lie down somewhere else.

Respect definitely isn’t about fear!
A dog should not be barging past someone- That IS disrespectful.
A friend who has Great Danes is a really gentle but firm man- his kids and dogs respect him-
It’s easy to have respectful dogs who do as requested and who allow stuff to be done to them without fuss -

Same with horses- They have to do as asked to keep themselves and people safe.

A dog shouldn’t be barging past to get out onto a road.

There was a doughty upper class women who had a very large breed. They absolutely respected her and when she arrived in London with them on the train from far up North to go to Crufts, her natural authority enabled her wonderful hounds to travel safely with her, and negotiate the tube 🚇 as well- Dogs used to the Highlands.
They trusted and respected her.

She never said a harsh word to them.

Boundaries and good training.

What kind of dog is she? What is her nature? The only dog i've had that did that was definitely defending the house by being able to watch the door for intruders, and by blocking the stairs for his humans. He was painfully anxious and defensive.

My current mutt would only do it if there were a toasty sunbeam in that spot. I'd agree with others that the only way to ease it would be to block it off. Though I would question why they are there and try to work out the dog logic.

She doesn’t know it’s ‘wrong’, she’s just lying in the best spot which is natural. Either she’ll like being able to watch the family’s comings and goings or there’ll be a nice sun spot coming through the door. If we’re all in different rooms, our lab likes to lie at the top of the stairs with his paws over the edge 🥰. That way he can be equidistant from all of us 😂.

My dog would definitely leg it with the hairbrush 😂 Then I'd fall over trying to get it off her 😳

Yes... this is exactly like my dog. She's surprisingly stealth-like despite her massive paws too and now I just assume she's always behind me rather than chance she's not 😂 She's solid... won't move an inch... in fact I slipped in the kitchen once and everything seemed to go in slow motion and she just stared at me and didn't even so much as flinch! I managed to avoid her though and ended up over the top of her like a particularly strategic move in Twister 😳

The dog sounds like...a dog.

We have a “move” command for her, so I think it’s unfair to say she’s scared of me for assertively telling her to move. My DP does the same. Neither of us shouts.

As for the barging, we have some narrow stone steps to get into the garden and I have no doubt she would push me down the steps to get back in the house if I wasn’t ready to stop her.

I have already trained her to go to her bed. It’s taken a year and still takes 4 attempts when the postman knocks! But I don’t open the door till she’s in her bed and she gets a treat when the postman has gone and she’s still there.

I agree we haven’t bonded, I have tried so hard to bond with her. I don’t know how to do it. I’ve tried brushing her but she doesn’t like it and gets a bit bitey (in a gentle way). I feed her. I’m here all day and give her fuss and talk to her. I play with her with her toys. I take her out in the garden. The only thing I don’t do is feed her scraps - from my plate or when I’m cooking.

I get that the place she wants to lie gives her the best view of the house. Her bed is in the next best place. It could be she lies there when there’s no one downstairs but not always.
She’s a very gentle dog, defends the house as any dog would but is not a guard dog.

@Itsarecipefordisaster I always feed scraps, not from my plate but when I'm cooking DDog loves a bit of mushroom or the end of a carrot when I'm chopping,
and now knows if he hears me emptying a yoghurt that he will get to lick the pot treats are definitely a way to bond, although some, usually female, dogs are just less likely to bond with people or with more than 1 person (DDog loves everyone and would run off with a stranger for a tasty treat).

Although if you don't want her in the way in the kitchen then don't do this