2025 is our year for getting a dog. But what breed and from where?

[LarryUnderwood]

After lots of thought and discussion we've decided we will get a dog this year. DS1 is 13, DS2 almost 12. We live in a London suburb in a 4 bed terrace with a private small-medium garden. We have 3 chickens kept in a large fox proof enclosure. They free range in the garden at specific times and are otherwise enclosed so can be easliy kept separate. South London with lots of parks and recreation grounds in easy walking distance. I WFH full time, with 1-2 days in office per month. DH is in office 3 days per week so easy to coordinate days at home. Kids out of house 8-3. Neither of us have owned a dog before but I grew up with dogs in my extended family (all my grandparents, aunts, cousins etc, mainly yorkshire terriers, cockers and goldens). Relaxed about shedding and fur, we're reasonably active but not out hiking every weekend. 1.5-2 hours of walking plus time doing bits of training during the day on weekdays is feasible and I'd expect to take dog on all errands so be out and about in our local area a lot in addition. Weekends we'd be happy to do more. Keen to have a dog which is loving, trainable and friendly, not too barky and ideally will have calm moments as well as zoomies. We aren't experienced dog owners so trainable but not a working line, for example a border collie or GSD would run rings round us and we wouldn't be able to meet its needs. Basically a dog that is happy to be a family pet, not a dog that needs a job to do all day.
Breed discussions are around golden retriever, Staffordshire bull terrier, old english sheepdog, bernedoodle or goldendoodle. I'd also consider a Havanese as the small dog alternative. DH is the doodle fan - he wants a fluffball. My preference is for a Staffy, I like their hardiness, affection and that they're smallish but strong and with lots of personality. Overall though my preference is for a dog we can get from a good breeder, and that's what worries me about doodles, I'm not.convinced doodle breeders are going to be so ethical or concerned with breed standards and health. But do know some really lovely doodles. I would prefer a medium or large dog, I want something I will feel confident walking in the dark at night and I just like larger dogs. Any owners of any of these breeds have any recommendations or warnings for us? I've heard that goldens are nightmare adolescents then great from about 2, Staffys are fab as long as socialised well and given plenty to chew. Don't know so much about old english sheepdogs except my cousin has one and he's brilliant. I love cockers but having known many in my family they are too nervy and hyperactive for me. Thoughts from any passionate golden/doodle/staffy/OES/havanese owners? Or any other breeds which would better fit the bill?

I would take bernedoodle off your list. Bernese are not first time owner type dogs. Although they don't need loads of walking, they need lots of attention - grooming, brain tricks etc, they can be stubborn and bouncy if they aren't stimulated enough.
Not had a staffy personally but wouldn't they chase the hens? Retriever or labradoodle would be a good bet for ignoring them...

I don't really know the breeds well enough to give the sort of advice you asked for, but want to say something else you might find useful.

Numbers of Old English sheepdogs have absolutely plummeted, and they are now on the "at watch" section of the vulnerable native breeds list. These breeds are not being produced in large numbers for the commercial market, but rather by breed enthusiasts. So that would definitely be a point in OES favour for me; and I'd start looking for a good breeder via the breed club.

Vulnerable native breeds | The Kennel Club

Whilst on that theme, if you might want a fluffy dog to meet DH's preference, might you consider a wheaten terrier? The terrier temperament is rather different to the breeds you're currently considering, but if you're up for it, I think this breed could tick all the other boxes. And it's a vulnerable native breed, so again only produced by enthusiasts.

Thanks @ribiera. I suppose I'm thinking that if we get a puppy it would get used to the chickens and we could train good manners - they're also not shy at sticking up for themselves. And because they are usually in a large enclosure then it would be relatively.straightforward to keep them separate from the dog when they are out in the garden.

Before you yourself mentioned I was going to say Staffy, as for the chickens we have some, when our neighbours staffy comes over they chase him, to the point he refuses to go in our back garden without a human!

I agree with @ribiera about ruling out Bernedoodle. The mountain dogs are really not suitable for inexperienced owners, they are very stubborn and guardy. They are working breeds and can bark a fair bit.
The very large heavy breeds in general are less suited for an active family lifestyle because as pups they need very gentle handling, restricted access to stairs and no jumping around etc etc.
You would be better opting for medium-large.

@wetotter makes a very good point about native breeds. You can also be more confident about the temperament of a purebred dog compared to a crossbreed. I think the issue with Old English is possibly the grooming but if you already have one in the family I'm sure you are well aware of this...

Get a rescue dog. ❤️

I think if you get an adult rescue, youve got more chance of seeing its personality and whether its barky etc.

Being purebred isn't a guarantee of temperament

But those who produce the rare breeds generally do so because they are really enthusiastic about the breed, and so will care about things like health testing and the level of inbreeding (I was stunned to find out the breed average coefficient of inbreeding is higher in golden retrievers than in some breeds where <100 puppies per year are registered).

You need to ask the breeder, if a rare breed, about the temperament of their line - if they are showing for looks, then temperament might be a secondary consideration (not good). But it's not an either/or issue, rather something to talk through. With the sorts of breeds you're talking about, the breed standard for appearance is that of a normally proportioned active dog, so unhealthy "torture breeding" aesthetics are not a factor.

I wouldn't be so fixated on the specific breed. 2 families I know of did this sort of 'shopping' and both have needed up with very annoying dogs (and paid a lot of money to end up with issues).

We went to several rehoming charities and did home checks and vetting with them, discussed our wants/needs and what we could offer with them and then got matched. We have had 2 rescue dogs now who are just wonderful and perfect for our family.

Definitely far better to get a young puppy, from a breeder recommended by the breed club if possible. Please do not be pressured into getting an adult rescue dog, you will have no idea of its past, and with teen/pre-teen kids who are likely to have visiting friends, that could be an accident waiting to happen.

We have a Bernedoodle puppy who is incredibly smart, very trainable and willing to learn, active when she wants to be but loves nothing more than napping. She loves everyone she meets and is a fab dog. I don't recognise any of the concerns around guarding etc that others have mentioned but our breeders specialise in therapy dogs so she has a brilliant temperament as so both parents.

Honestly I don't think a rescue is for us for our first dog. We just don't have the experience to help a dog which has ingrained issues and the number of dogs available to a family like ours is so small - most rescues I've seen are looking for adult only homes in a more rural setting.

Sorry, @wetotter , perhaps I ought to have said "breed traits" instead of "temperament" but either way, purebred still offers more certainty than a crossbreed or mongrel as to whether a dog will likely be high energy/barky/guardy/have high prey drive etc.

@LarryUnderwood have a look at Many Tears rescue they have lots of dogs for rehoming for lots of different reasons. We have two from there they are the best dogs ever.
Firdt picture Lavina from puppy farm and 8 months later second picture the trio.

I always suggest Samoyeds as we have one and they're great family dogs, BUT they're quite woofie, and I'd fear they would chase hens (our dog chases all the time ... she's better with our cats but other fave game!)
Doodles I'd take off your list for the sane reasons as you, unless you get an actual poodle.
OESD - lovely dogs, we had one when we were children 🥰
Good luck, make sure you liaise with the breeder about what you're looking for as they get a good idea matching wise if they know what you want

Long walks on the weekends aren't going to be enough for anything like a Lab or a Golden Retriever etc. To be truly happy they need at least 90 minutes a day - even the KC recommend 2+hrs a day and they're well known for under-estimating what a dog needs - plus stimulation and engagement. Anyone who says their dog is happy with 60 minutes a day doesn't realise how damn miserable their dog is - if I had a penny for every time I had heard a prospective buyer say their dog is happy and sufficiently exercised (when it's clearly not) I'd be richer than Elon Musk.

I have four Golden Retrievers (12, 8, 5 and 2). Would I have another breed? No. Would I recommend them as a first time pet? No. Do I sell, as a breeder, to first time owners? Hell no. Do I recommend them as a pet once people have had a dog of their own? Yes.

They're a truly lovely breed, they really are. But they're not half as easy to own, train or live with as people claim - at least not if you want a well trained, balanced, happy dog - particularly when they are young, but even once they are older.

I think as a first time owner, you need to think of it like this: if your dog goes horribly wrong - and I mean anything from nervous/reactivity, to full blown aggression towards particular people (men, children) - would you rather have something small and easy to manage on the lead, or something as large as a Golden Retriever or a Bernadoodle? No dog breed is bomb proof. The difference between a Cavalier and a Golden Retriever/Bernadoodle/Labrador is that when the cavalier goes wrong you have a higher change of making it out unscathed.

... woof tax

We got a golden retriever puppy last year with zero experience, two kids (11 and 15) and two adult cats. It has been a real learning curve, a lot of work and doubting ourselves but 16 months later it has worked out beautifully and her temperament couldn't really have been better. Some things to consider:

• hair! Everywhere, all the time. 🤍
• the darker the golden, the more likely they are to be a field line, therefore possibly higher energy and more in need of working / high activity than the light cream show line breed.
• size, if it is of consideration. Ours is 37kg and she's a big girl.

She is the most beautiful creature I have ever seen though. Good luck!

T not much help but just look into breeds that are fine with chickens comes to mind- the day my friend got chickens her dog ran straight out and killed one whereas I have a number of friends with chickens who have never had problems with their dogs (note I googled and golden retrievers are actually on the list of chicken friendly dogs!!)

I know an Irish Wheaten Terrier who is lovely. Very mellow. Proper dog size and shape.

Nothing doodle. Literally all backyard breeders.

Get a female lab. Perfect for your lifestyle and first time dog owner.

Show not working lines. Train it properly.

Hate to tell you this but many tears are well known for buying from puppy farms and selling on as rescues.

It's got a deservedly terrible reputation among the rescue community as being a front for puppy farms.

@LandSharksAnonymous those are all good points. I am thinking of 1.5-2 hours of exercise every weekday plus more at weekends, plus regular (several times a day) training time and general pottering out for errands would be our routine. It's quite feasible.for me to walk dog for an hour in the morning, DH to walk it for an hour in the evening, and for me (and DSs) to walk it for 30 mins or so at lunchtime and after school.

@Shannith this is one of my many worries about getting a rescue, I've heard so many horror stories about rescues passing on problem dogs without proper information, or being a front etc.

There’s an independent rescue near me which I’m sure is some sort of front for Romanian puppy farms. The dogs get bussed over regularly.

@FloofPaws what a beauty! I imagine you get stopped all the time. I would be totally open to Samoyed as well, they're just lovely. To be honest I just love.dogs and would be happy with any dog that is friendly and loving. But a stout hearted little Staffy is my secret dream.