Getting a puppy - advice needed

[ImagineRainbows]

So we have made the decision to get a puppy. Thinking spring / summer next year as I can’t imagine toilet training is fun in the winter.

We’ve had dogs all out life and lost our latest boy 2 years ago at the age of 15. However we’ve never had a puppy as we have always had older rescues.

This time however we have a child (12 years old) and 2 cats to consider and so we decided a puppy would be a better option as so few rescues are able to cat test etc. And maybe selfishly we decided that this time we don’t want to inherit the poor behaviour and poor health caused by someone else’s bad breeding practices.

Hoping I can get some advice on the puppy stage so we can make sure we’re able to manage this.

Is there a best time of year to get a puppy? Are puppy classes generally available at all times of year etc.

Is there a guide that says how long a puppy can be left at what age etc. obviously once trained for this.

Me and my partner will take 2 weeks each off work, 1 after the other, so puppy will have 4 weeks to settle in.

My partner works at home 4 days a week and at the office 1 day a week. Is it better to use a dog daycare type place on the 1 day or have a dog walker come in a few times on that day etc. Puppy will be around 12 weeks old at this time.

Anything I may not have considered about how crazy having a puppy is going to be?

Hi OP,

Dog Training and Advice on FB has great info on all of this. Yes, spring/summer is great for toilet training as you're in and out of the house constantly. Puppy classes are available all year round in most places.

Leaving a puppy will very much come down to the breed and personality of the puppy. A terrier might not notice you're gone. I have a cross-breed gundog and at seven months old he's never been left alone for longer than it takes to put the bin out.

You might need longer than four weeks at home - it depends on the puppy, his toilet training, and what your partner's work is like - if it's very self-directed you'll be fine, but if he's in back to back meetings you might have a problem.

You're going to need daycare for the day when your partner is home. No way is a 12-week puppy of any breed going to be okay left alone for most of the day, they can't hold their bladders for more than an hour or two, and depending on vaccinations they may not yet be able to go out for walks.

DTAS recommend that you don't try to leave your puppy alone until they're in the teenage stage and getting more independent. Lots of people do fine with leaving them earlier, but you do need to remember that puppies are social sleepers, will probably need to sleep with you or near you, and leaving them to cry it out or get used to it is much more likely to trigger full blown separation anxiety than keeping them with you as much as possible and building their confidence and security.

Best of luck - have you decided what breed you're getting yet?

PS this is MN so at least one poster will come along to tell you you should never get a dog - ignore them, you sound like you'll be brilliant puppy raisers once you're in the swing of it.

We got our puppy in the summer and I'd say it was ideal, to be honest. It meant we could do lots of socialisation and toilet training was a dream - believe me, it's much more pleasant standing in the garden going "go wee wees" at 4am in July than it is in November

In terms of time alone, it really is a question of "how long is a piece of string" - some puppies won't be happy alone at all at 12 weeks, others will be absolutely fine for a couple of hours. The issue you'll have is that there are very few daycares who will take a 12 week old puppy, so you could be very limited in terms of what care is available. I'd also say a 12 week old puppy is far too young to be left all day with just a few visits, they need almost constant care.

Summer is a good time. We got our pup at the start of August and it would have been so miserable doing those first few weeks of toilet training in the middle of winter. He wasn't reliably toilet trained until around 5 months either, so that's something you may need to consider. Some dogs pick it up quickly and others take much longer.

Also we've just started leaving ours over the past month. Building up from 10 minutes upwards. He's now 6 months and I can leave him an hour or two but wouldn't want to do it much longer.

I booked off the first week when we got him, but WFH throughout the week anyway but it was so hard trying to work and keep an eye on him. I spent many weeks working through the evenings trying to catch up as you have to keep an eye on them constantly when they are awake. I'd definitely arrange daycare for that day your husband is in the office and maybe some other days too if you can afford it as it will take the strain off a bit. Working and reading a puppy can be very hard.

Is there a best time of year to get a puppy? Are puppy classes generally available at all times of year etc. No particular time of year. I got my last dog on Christmas Day - just sucked up toilet training in the rain. I was extra motivated and the dog was fully trained within two weeks, and only had one accident the entire second week.

It meant by summer he was able to to go on longer days out so I got to really enjoy time with him. Puppy classes are available all year, but good trainers get booked up quickly. You shouldn't rely on puppy classes for training - you should train your dog himself, from day one.

Is there a guide that says how long a puppy can be left at what age etc. obviously once trained for this. Honestly, I don't think puppies under six months should be left alone for more than about 15 minutes maximum. I've seen too many injuries caused because young puppies were left for 10 or even 5 minutes when they were young and they caused serious damage to themselves because of the serious stress and terror they experienced. I once had to operate on a 10 week old puppy that had broken one of it's legs trying to escape it's 'play pen.'

Remember, they are never alone until they join your family. The first 8-12 weeks of their life (depending on when you get them) are always with mum, littermates and potentially other dogs.

My partner works at home 4 days a week and at the office 1 day a week. Is it better to use a dog daycare type place on the 1 day or have a dog walker come in a few times on that day etc. Puppy will be around 12 weeks old at this time. You absolutely cannot leave a 12 week old puppy alone at home all day with just a dog walker popping in once or twice - and if you are thinking about crating or sticking the puppy in a 'play pen' during that time, please do not. Do not get a dog and shove it in a crate or a play pen for a whole day - minus dog walker visit - when you are out. See above for why (for serious injuries) but other than that, they will destroy your house, piss everywhere, shit everywhere and generally cause chaos.

Dog day cares often won't take young puppies - existing dynamics often mean that puppies would be at high risk in a day-care environment (they're irritating, don't understand social boundaries and are small) - or if they do, it will be insanely expensive because they will only have a v. small number of dogs or just your dog. Consider asking friends or family to watch the puppy that day until it's much older.

@Bupster We are looking at a miniature poodle. Going to Manchester dog show in Jan to hopefully see some in person. Puppy crate will be going in my bedroom so won’t be sleeping alone and partners job is very flexible. There are occasional meetings but generally it’s self directed and hours are very flexible as long as the work is done so will be ideal for a puppy.

@biscuitsandbooks I have found a daycare near my work that has a dedicated puppy room and will take at 12 weeks as long as fully vaccinated. However we are hoping to delay this anyway but it’s not confirmed yet. I have one weekday a week off work and partner has one day a week in the office. Going to try and see if my off duty can be lined up so I’m off the same days partner is in the office, at least for the start and then hopefully won’t need it much. Just trying to plan for every eventuality.

@Killingoffmyflowersonebyone We are planning on training at home but we would also like to put the dog through the KC good citizen scheme and later look into agility as I know Poodles being so intelligent they need a focus. The training classes are more about meeting this need, a fun activity for us to do and socialising. When I said dog walker popping in I was meaning 4 times per day. A local walker does puppy visits where they come in and spend a bit of time with the puppy etc. I just didn’t know if that would be less stressful than spending the day with other unknown dogs but having taken the advice we will be going for the daycare option as we’ve already found one that has a puppy room and yes it’s insanely expensive but as it’s only one day a week ( and perhaps even less than that if my shifts work out right) it’s doable.

@ImagineRainbows you really sound like you've done your homework 😊

The puppy thread on here is wonderful, really supportive, for when he comes home. And I can recommend Easy Peasy Puppy Squeezy for a starter book. But DTAS is the place I keep returning to - they have a private group for puppy and adolescents that's about fifteen quid a month and that (and the threads on here) have been a lifeline for me.

@ImagineRainbows lining up your days off sounds like a good plan, at least for the first few months. Lots of puppies and adult dogs can find daycare quite overwhelming and scary so it's always worth having a backup in place.

Re the time of year…. The thing is, you can only really pick time of year if you aren’t fussed about it being a good breeder.

Good breeders aren’t breeding constantly - so it just depends on when their bitch goes into season.

and honestly, it’s hard enough finding a decent breeder without adding what time of year into the mix.

What @tabulahrasa says is true if your heart is set on a particular breed and you have flexibility. I knew the only time I could bring home a puppy was the beginning of the summer, as that's the only long period I could consistently work from home. Once term starts, I have to be in at least two days a week, and he had to go to daycare, so if I didn't get a puppy at the beginning of the summer it would be another year until the beginning of the next summer.

I was lucky enough to find a breeder with a litter due at the right time who was a friend of a friend; they knew the family extremely well, could vouch for them (and me), and owned my puppy's half-brother. My puppy is a cross-breed, not a pedigree, as I wasn't particularly worried about the breed so much as making sure he came from a trustworthy, responsible breeder who would socialise the puppies well. You could argue that I am an idiot who didn't do half the amount of research I should have and you would be right, but he is a lovely, resilient, happy puppy and he is perfect for me.

tl/dr: think about what breed you want now and start having a look at what the possibilities are for the puppies you want at the time you're hoping to get one.

All dogs need to be taught to be left. That can only happen at their pace and every dog is different. Realistically they’re not reliably ok until they’re more mature. My dog (super independent terrier) wasn’t consistent until she was 18 months and now at 2 we’ve built her to about 90 minutes. We’ve never allowed her to be stressed alone and have built time at her pace. Terriers can struggle as they have FOMO and that needs to be worked on the same as SA.

I like toilet training in winter as it’s too cold to muck about plus the door stays shut! Summer is much harder IMO.

4 weeks is nowhere near enough. 2 years maybe! You will need a sitter for that day.

Cats you’ll need to separate and give safe spaces. Again how long is a piece of string?

we came to a puppy in the same way as you - from older rescues. It’s been a very steep learning curve and 2 years in I’m not sure I’d do it again but there are a lot of advantages.

All my dogs were October, November and December litters. As you can't just leave the door open for them to go out I don't think it makes much difference. You would need to go with when your chosen breeder has a litter planned.

Our trainer does puppy classes year-round and the local dog club dies the Kennel Club Good Citizen scheme from puppy through to gold year-round too.

And four weeks after getting the puppy is much too young to be left.

You're going to get loads of loads of conflicting advice until your head explodes. I would take a look at the puppy survival threads on Mumsnet to get an idea of how all puppies are different but how we all got the puppy blues at one time and thought we had made the biggest mistake - but they do get easier quickly. However, I agree with others that 4 weeks would be too early to leave a puppy on their own for longer than a few minutes. Think of them like newborn babies and you will get an idea how needy they are at first.

If possible, I think the Spring would be the best time to get a puppy followed by early summer, but these things can't always be planned so exactly. If it works out, it is better to be spending more time outside in your garden while the weather is warmer and it's lighter in the mornings and evenings.

We're raising a puppy at the moment who is a mix of Lab and Retriever, he sleeps downstairs in the kitchen on his own and has done since the first day (he cried the first 2 nights so we went downstairs to comfort him but he adapted to it quickly as did our previous Lab). They soon learn the routine and dogs love a routine. We were also advised to start leaving him alone in the daytime for 20 minutes at a time when small and build up to 4 hours apart by 6 months (he's a trainee Guide dog so we are following their guidelines and it has worked well). He is not supposed to be left for longer than 4 hours ever, but then we only have him for a year. Older dogs can be left for longer but not all day.

You'll get a lot of conflicting advice about crate training. We were given a crate by the organisation and advised to use it for the first few months, but it didn't sit right with us (& the puppy got alarmed if we ever tried to close the door) so we gave up on it. But some people swear by them so I would say it's personal choice and maybe it will make more sense for you as you have cats to protect.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/the_doghouse/5180942-puppy-survival-thread-for-new-and-old-pups-here-comes-winter-2024?page=1

Miniature poodles are prone to separation anxiety. I have a poodle mix and it's the main reason I didn't go for a full poodle. Obviously there's no guarantees with a mix breed and there may be poodles that are fine being left alone but I was keen to tip the scales a little in my favour if possible!

I bought a crate for my pup with the intention of leaving it permanently open within a pen but she didn't like being in the pen at all and never went in the crate. I'm sure I could have trained her to do so but I'd already puppy proofed the lounge and she was absolutely fine when we left the room and shut the door so we stuck to that.

I got her a puppy pram so I could take her on the school run prior to her vaccinations being complete. This helped massively I think as she has never had an issue with traffic and sirens etc. When she could go outside properly I started taking her on the school run in the mornings as I didn't have to go into school but would have to leave her for the afternoon pick up. I cycled to be quicker and she was left for 20 mins max. She was fine. I then stopped taking her in the mornings as it was too stressful with it being so busy at the gates, so she was getting left for 2x 20 minutes from an early age. This would get increased for a dental appointment or school performance etc now and then and she never had any issues with being left. I have a puppy cam (25 quid on amazon) and she never gets stressed, just mainly sleeps. She gets up to all kinds of mischief in the house when we're at home but never when we're not!

Obviously every pup is different and you can only really play it by ear but mine absolutely benefitted from being left for those short periods of time when young. She learnt quickly that we always came back!

Good luck with your future pup! Ours (almost 18 months now) has been a fabulous addition to our family.

i mean… the weather makes a bit of difference to be fair

We happened to get my last dog in a sunny week and hanging out in the garden in the sun was much nicer than when I’ve done it in the rain.

But it’s the U.K. - how do you plan for that? Even in summer, it could be nice that week, could be thunder and lightning, could be a heatwave and you’re having to stop a puppy getting overheated 🤷‍♀️

Finding a decent breeder is hard enough without limiting it for weather that might not even happen anyway.

Puppy training is available year round. Have a look if there is a Puppy School trainer near you. It is a franchise set up by Gwen Bailey and is up to date science-based. Most offer 1-1s to help you settle a puppy in even before classes. House training in the winter has its advantages - you both want to get it over with quickly! With a summer pup don't just leave the back door open & assume they've worked it out. Come autumn you will discover that they were peeing outdoors because that was just where they happened to be most of the time!
Start building up alone time from the day you get them, but make it seconds at first. Up to 6 months old 2 hours max. A dog walker that doesn't walk in "packs" preferable over doggy daycare. You can ask for extra drop ins with young puppies to break the day up more.

Steve Manns Easy Peasy Puppy Squeezy is a great book if you haven't had a puppy recently. If you can find a breeder that follows Puppy Culture they will have done some separation training, lead training etc and followed protocols to avoid resource guarding. Invaluable when you have children