Socialisation before 12 weeks

[puppyparent]

We're just a few weeks away from bringing home our new puppy - our first - and I'm doing as much prep and research as I can to make sure the first few weeks and months go smoothly in terms of settling in, training, etc.

One thing that is puzzling me is how I can best socialise pup in those first few weeks before he's received his 12-week vaccinations. I've read that the period of time before pup is 12 weeks' old is critical from a socialisation perspective. But at the same time, I've read that the puppy isn't supposed to interact with / be exposed to other dogs in that period because those other dogs might be unvaccinated and carry harmful diseases that are dangerous to an unvaccinated puppy.

So I'm wondering what people generally do in those first few weeks. Do you keep your puppy close to home? Or do you take it out and about with you and, if so, do you let the dog walk on the ground or is that in itself dangerous (do you carry the dog)?

Sorry for the probably dumb questions!! Grateful for any tips

Socialisation isn't just about meeting other dogs - it's about introducing your puppy to all sorts of new experiences.

PDSA puppy socialisation checklist

You can carry your puppy around, so that s/he gets lots of new sights and sounds

I carried our lab to meet the postman, bin man, took him to a friend’s house, to my gran’s house. He was a happy sociable pup wagging his tail. Still is now at 4.

So no paws on the ground in public places?

We got our Viszla at 8 weeks and took her out in a room rucksack from day 1 to get her used to people, noises, new smells etc (before she’d had all her vaccinations and could walk outside the home).

Shes a very well socialised dog and the first couple of weeks definitely helped with this (I still remember her having the ‘puppy shakes’ as they are nervous about new things / experiences.

@wetotter good checklist!

@NorthernSpirit aw bless her and her little puppy shakes. We're getting a vizsla too (wirehaired). What sort of rucksack did you use?

Socialisation is not socialising. Not the same thing at all.
I’d carry her around to see stuff and reward when calm, my friend used to take hers to busy car parks and just sit and look at stuff and reward when they weren’t trying to go and see what was going on

We carry ours around when they’re small - town centres, busy roads, shops etc. We also allow our puppies to meet family dogs who we know have been vaccinated.

Lots of experiences when tiny make for a confident adult dog.

Caveat: lots of experience the dog finds good or neutral make for a confident older dog.

If you fail to spot your puppy is nervous or scared of the experiences you do more harm than good.

Don't use the 12 weeks like a hard deadline. Go at your dog's pace at all times.

You are aiming for him/her to experience as much of the world as possible without being scared or upset by it.

We really struggled with this. Because our girl had the Nobivac 4 vaccine she was almost 14 weeks old before we could really take her anywhere. My cousins came to visit when she was 10 weeks old and again at 14 weeks but that was pretty much the only socialisation she got.

For us, the issue was further complicated by having a giant breed puppy; by 10 weeks she was the size and weight of a fully grown cocker spaniel so we didn't really have the option to carry her anywhere. Fortunately, her breeder had done an amazing job with socialising the pups up until 8 weeks old so we took on a pretty bomb proof puppy that wasn't scared of much.

If you are able to carry your pup or even take it out in the car in a crate, park up and sit with the tailgate open somewhere that they can see cars, people and dogs passing by it can all help towards getting them used to noises. Car park at a nature reserve or even a quiet corner of a supermarket car park is good, provided pup is in a crate or cage it is fine.

It is a lot of work in the initial weeks; I'm very socially anxious so I struggled at first with all the attention that a tiny cute puppy inevitably gets when you do start taking them out and about. Once they get to about 5 or 6 months it becomes a lot easier and the pressure is off (aside from the lead training...😱) but it can't be over emphasised how vital those early weeks are.

Enjoy your new puppy and don't forget to drop into the puppy survival thread where you can share photos if you want to.🙂

Visits from friendly vaccinated dogs can be good; also meetings with such dogs on sofa neutral ground (eg the garden of a dog less friend).

Vizslas are high-energy dogs with a lot of prey drive. What's your dog's breeding like? If the parents are keen workers, you might find that gundog training will provide a necessary outlet for your puppy, as an unfulfilled dog is not a happy one. This is the voice of experience as I have two dogs from the same breed group: the older one is a delight if she gets what she needs and becomes stroppy and difficult if she doesn't. I'm not trying to scare you as vizslas are really lovely dogs, but they tend to be full on.

This all makes sense! Super helpful!

@EdithStourton yes we are aware that gundogs like vizslas are high energy and need a lot of exercise and mental stimulation. It is a bit daunting for us as first-time puppy parents! Our pup comes from a line that has been bred for companionship primarily, although some of the pups in the litter are going to working homes. The breeder's practice is to allocate the pups according to each pup's energy level/personality to try to 'match' them with their new homes as best as possible. Even still, I know that our pup - even if it's the most chilled out one in the litter - will be high energy and need lots of training and entertainment!!

On that note - at what age would you say is ideal to introduce gundog training or other activities like agility? Does the pup need to have reached a certain stage of physical maturity?

I wouldn’t touch physical training (gun dog work/agility) until pup is 18 months tbh. If a dog puts too much stress on joints at a young age it can cause awful problems (and pain) for a growing dog! And no good trainers would take you on, for that exact reason.

Until then, I’d focus on things like a flying/down, walking to heel, leaving food/dropping items, recall. They can all be done easily without straining the joints and tbh if you don’t have the basics of them done, you’ll really struggle with gun dog work or agility which are both very reliant on your dog being trained well.

Flying down is really important, I think. Not enough people teach it to their dog and rely on recall, but sometimes a recall is the opposite of what you want. It’s also very hard to get right so will tire out your dog mentally and physically

A lot of gun dog training isn't really very physical. We started a gundog puppy course when pup was 14 weeks. A lot of what is learned is very similar to more general puppy training but with some gundog basics introduced. Often includes some breed specific type games which can be essential to make sure working breeds don't go self employed.

As you're not intending to work your dog, look around for a positive reinforcement gundog trainer and see if they offer pet courses.

In reality all you need to do is keep puppy away from stagnant water and un vaccinated dogs.

So a little stroll up and down your road (off lead if safe), maybe a visit to the park at a quiet time or just sitting in the car with boot open to take in the sights, sounds and smells are all good things to do.

We did a lot of gundog basics at home and started at both gundog club and with a trainer at 6 months or so. even if you don't plan to work your dog, gundog training is good for learning ways to harness their natural abilities.

I've always found with my dogs that a long sit-stay is more mentally tiring than hooning around a field.

I'd be rather more cautious than that. Parvo is very serious in dogs that are not fully vaccinated, especially puppies.

It's spread by faeces, but not just the actual turds - it moves in to the wider environment and therefore can contaminate soil and survives for months. Trotting along a pavement probably isn't a huge risk, but I'd keep off earth and grass (especially in areas with a high canine population - ie foxes as well as other dogs).

Also keep away from water (not just stagnant water) in areas where there's a good sized rat population as lepto is also serious in puppies.

That is very dangerous advice, as a PP has made clear. It's spread by feces from unvaccinated dogs and you would probably be horrified by just how many people do not vaccinate their dogs. In 2019, only 66% of pets were adequately vaccinated (PDSA) and that has just increased. I'd say around a third of the young puppies I treated in 2021/2022 were owned by people who refused to vaccinate their pets. There have even been idiots people on mumsnet recently gloating about not vaccinating their pet.

Unless you have treated a puppy that is dying of Parvo...you truly do not understand just how awful it is. Words cannot accurately describe just how horrible it is to witness and how much the dog suffers.

Putting a puppy on the pavement or a public grassy area is needlessly risky - dogs poo on both of these places (you only have to look at how many mumsnet posts there are a day about dog shit everywhere). OP can more than adequately exercise and socialise a puppy (from her arms or inside the car) without putting it down in public. It is not worth the risk (both finacialy, I've seen costs hit several thousand, or physically).

A lot of gundog and agility training is based on really good impulse control, which you can definitely practice with your puppy

I carried my Labrador about until he got too heavy. But also did trips to the supermarket car park in the car with him, sitting on the tailgate watching people. Ditto park car park as schools ended, so loads of kids, some of whom were desperate to say hello. When he was fully vaccinated his Labrador pal introduced him to the river and sea. I took him to the local railway station and sat by the 'bus stop. He met my friends' dogs in their gardens too. It was great thinking up new things for him to experience.

@Killingoffmyflowersonebyone I've done what I suggested with all my puppies... my last one is a healthy 3y old boy.
But then, if you live in an area where people spread dog feces over pavements, then I would be very cautious indeed.

I like the idea of finding places to squat with the pup and watching the world go by

Mine still love a trip to the retail park for a bit of people watching from the boot 😂

Socialisation is also a great excuse for trips to pubs and/or coffee shops. We carried pup or took a mat to settle on.

Dogs shit everywhere. It's literally what they do. You take them on a walk. They shit. They're not fussy about where.

No need to be personal and take cheap shots about where I live...very presumptive of you and a sure sign you know you're in the wrong. Shame.