Any vets here? Too heartbroken to ask my own vet 😔

[CarrieMoonbeams]

God, I'm sobbing here, typing this out but I feel like I need to know.

Our oldest dog was PTS on Wednesday. We don't know exactly how old he was but he was at least 14, we had him for 4 years. He had a lot of health conditions and it was obvious he was in pain despite his medication, so we gave him a lovely last day and booked him in to be PTS.

Our vet always sedates them first, but then when it came to the actual PTS part, she couldn't get a needle in any of the veins on his legs and so she said she'd have to inject into his heart if that was ok with us. There didn't seem to be any other option as she couldn't get a vein. She asked us to leave the room for a minute while she did that.

We were just out in the waiting room so I would have heard it if he'd yelped or anything, and when we went back in he just looked peacefully sleeping as before. We were able to stay with him and cuddle him for as long as we wanted.

We have loads of pets (currently 5 dogs 😔, cats, rabbits, guinea pigs and snakes) and they're mostly rescues and/or elderly/a bit wonky, so sadly having a pet PTS happens to us at least once a year but we've never had this before.

I'm the kind of person who needs to know things, but I'm absolutely devastated and just don't feel like I can ask the vet just yet - so why would we have to leave the room?

Not a vet but I would guess its because it can cause your pet some distress (it didn't in your case as you say you would have heard the yelp) and it can be more distressing for owners. I had an old cat that really struggled with the injection and it was hard and something I wish I hadn't seen really.
Hopefully a vet (or vet nurse) will reply.

Sorry for your loss

Because she didn’t want you to see her try and possibly fail to hit the heart.
Because he may have reacted negatively.
Because you would have seen the blood from his heart come back in to the syringe when she hit it.
Because it’s not the nice and normal way we euthanaise patients here.

Im sorry you had this experience. She should have gotten someone else to place an IV catheter. Yes some sedation drugs make it harder. Yes some days you can’t hit a vein for love nor money. But you always ALWAYS get someone else when you can’t do it.

Because its not pleasant to watch but as Ddog was already sedated it wouldn't have bothered him. You were only out momentarily and Ddog knew you were there with him try not to dwell on it.

Hi, I’m a vet. If DDog was already sedated, he’d have known nothing about what happened, whatever went on after that point. Injecting into the heart is not painful, and is instantaneous if you get the right place, but it’s obviously not something you can see like a vein. We find the right place by feeling or looking for the heartbeat, and with all but the smallest dogs it needs a long needle that can look a bit scary. Occasionally the first attempt is in the wrong place and we need a second attempt, but DDog wouldn’t have been aware if this happened. I expect the vet asked you to leave the room because a lot of owners find the idea of injecting into the heart distressing, especially if there’s a second attempt. She may also have been stressed and upset by not finding a vein and needed a moment herself to remain professional and calm. Euthanasia can be traumatic for the vet too if it doesn’t go smoothly. I still remember a few that were hard for me from when I was a new graduate over 30 years ago. Whatever happened, rest assured that DDog will have gone peacefully and will have not known anything about it after the sedation took effect. I’m sorry for your loss.

I'm sorry for your loss, OP.

It will have been because it can take a few attempts to find the right point. She wanted to make it easier for you/take the pressure of her - nothing is worse than something going wrong when a dog is being PTS.

Your dog was sedated. He wouldn't have known. But what he did know, was that you were the last thing he saw. The person he loved most. Remember that, OP. Not what happened after.

It’s not any worse for the animal if it’s already sedated, and there are times when finding a vein is so hard that injection into the heart is a more smooth and gentle end. There isn’t always someone else available to try, in a small practice. I have done hundreds and hundreds of euthanasias over the years, and they don’t all go perfectly, but they have all been respectful and as good for the animal as I could manage. In fact, OP, I did exactly this with one of my own dogs last week, if that helps. I sedated her and used the heart because it meant I could do it on my own without restraining her, which for that dog was the best way to do it.

No it’s not any worse for the animal. But it is worse for the owner. The person who wanted to be with her dog at the end and couldn’t be.
I’ve been in practice for 25 years and have never had to euthaise a dog intra cardiac. Small furries yes and maybe a few cats. But I would always find someone else to place an IV if I couldn’t. I would never send an owner who wanted to be with their pet away if they wanted to be there

Thank you all for your replies, I appreciate it more than I can tell you. I'm crying again but it's been comforting and reassuring.

Can't believe I forgot to mention it, sorry, it's been such a hard few days, but one of the other vets did come in and try too. They tried different needles too (maybe a yellow and a blue? It's all such a blur in my mind, bizarrely) but they just couldn't get any access. It was so upsetting, my vet was getting upset too, just as you say @TarnishedMoonstone . She always made such a fuss of him and he loved her too.

Tbh, although as I said in my OP we have to have someone PTS at least once a year, this has absolutely devastated me. My poor boy, he must have had such an awful life before he came to us, he'd obviously been really badly abused - we had to have one of his eyes removed fairly soon after we got him, and he had cigarette burns on his body too. He was a sweetheart though and I miss him so much.

@Gymmum82 , I see what you're saying in your last post but I still do feel like we were with him at the very end. My vet is wonderful and I will at some point be able to talk to her about it, but DH and I were both so distraught that she obviously felt it was kinder to us to ask us to leave for a minute. I'm reassured that it wouldn't have made a difference to our lovely boy and I understand the process now.

Thank you @JackieGoodman , @Killingoffmyflowersonebyone and @Littletreefrog for your replies too, I appreciate it.

My dog was sedated last week, they took blood, checked his ears, teeth, joints and cut his nails… he’s so reactive that they’ve never actually managed to to give him any sort of examination at the vets despite being muzzled there.

He freaks out and barks just being in the same room as a strange person, the bloods
etc were actually so we can start him on fluoxetine because of the severity of his behaviour - While sedated he was completely oblivious, I was with him the whole time, he was definitely unaware of anything until a good ten minutes after they reversed it.

So yeah, it was very definitely to save you being distressed not your dog, he’d have been none the wiser as to what was going on.

Ever so sorry OP to hear about the loss of your beloved dog, it’s such a difficult time.

I have worked in vet practices for many years but I’m not a veterinarian. However, typically we ask owners to leave the room when injecting into the heart as it can be quite a scary moment for owners, who are typically very distressed already. Unfortunately, it is not the “go-to” and when you’re not aware of the administration of the injection into the heart it can be really off-putting and can seem really “barbaric” to upset owners. The intention is to not upset people further thereby asking them to leave the room for a few minutes, but it is never a first choice option as we like owners to be able to spend all the time possible with their pet at the time.

The pet is sedated and so would not have felt anything, nor would they have been aware that was happening to them. So please don’t feel guilt or concern, your pet would have been treated with the utmost dignity the entire time. Without knowing the medical history in and out or knowing why they couldn’t get a vein, alike to humans it’s better to not poke so many times and admit when something else needs to be done this allows another avenue to ensure that your pet has an easy-passing over.

I hope you and your family are doing okay, and that you’ve managed to process the ordeal a bit as it can be really upsetting at the best of times💓

@CarrieMoonbeams I am so sorry for your loss. Thank goodness you found him and gave him the best days of his life before he passed.

Thank you for asking the question. I have had to say goodbye to several dogs and this has never been an issue but I am sure if it ever happens in the future to me or anyone else reading, this has helped to inform and prepare us.

💐

Thank you @tabulahrasa for your reply, I'm glad your dog is getting started on medication, I really hope it helps. The world is a scary place for a lot of dogs isn't it? 😔 (And other animals too of course!)

Thanks @Ophie too, I really feel better now that I understand the process. I hadn't realised things like the fact that it would have been a really long needle, or that it might have taken more than one attempt to hit his heart. Like most things, it's really obvious when you know it, but I'm the same as @MuttsNutts in that I'd never had to face that before.

@MuttsNutts , thank you for your kind words, we were so lucky to have had him. I hope it doesn't happen to a dog of yours in the future, but at least if it does then you'll know what's happening. I know my vet would have explained it to me at the time if I had asked but we were so upset, we just couldn't .

I’m so sorry. Sometimes they can’t raise a vein so will inject straight into the heart. This means it can be painful for the dog and they can react but they don’t tend to if they’re sedated. Some vets don’t sedate and I’m not sure why (yours obviously did). Asking you to leave the room was probably because if he had then it’s not nice to see. Sometimes they need a huge needle and sometimes it takes a few attempts. Our dog fought her euthanasia (she was in organ failure and constantly fitting) and it’s awful despite the vets professionalism. We stayed with our dog as we wanted to and the vet positioned me between him and her as he said he wanted us to be the last thing she saw and smelt not him.

All my cats were pts that way heavily sedated. It’s quite normal for cats. It was really peaceful.

@TarnishedMoonstone

lovely reassuring post, factual but kind, unlike some others!!

It may have been distressing to watch compared to the usual injection. It is probably quite tricky to do too so the vet needed space and time. Your dear doggie was fast asleep and won't have felt a thing so please try not to worry or dwell... you did the right thing for your baby xxx

Thank you @DforDogWoof , sorry I just saw your post just now.

I've since been able to talk to my vet about it too, and she confirmed that it was exactly as previous posters had said. I felt better having understood the process.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

I hope you are doing OK. Please don't dwell on the end... just the time you both had x