Working cocker or border terrier

[53103min]

Hello

Just wondered if someone could give me some advice on breeds. I am a medium-experienced dog owner- grew up with show cockers and had my own lovely whippet who sadly died a few years ago.

We are thinking of getting another two dogs. DH would like to get a lurcher. I would like either a working cocker or border terrier. I've only had show cockers before and never any terrier-type dogs so wondered if anyone could give me any advice?

Our situation is-

• both semi-retired (early 50s), doing a day or two from home
• we live rurally and have a large garden
• we spend a lot of time outside and enjoy walking, I also run so a dog that could come along would be lovely (all on footpaths)
• I would prefer not to spend a huge amount of time grooming but don't mind a bit
• we visit our children in London frequently so our dogs will need to come with us on the train (this is presumably just a training point rather than breed-specific?)

Any advice gratefully received.

Either dog would suit, to be honest.

Personally I prefer cocker spaniels but that's just preference - a border would work just as well.

Big lurcher on a packed train? Presumably having to use the tube the other end too. Hmmmmm........Good luck with that one.😆

Who have you got as emergency back up for such times as, god forbid, you or DH has a serious health emergency and you need to be at the hospital for the best part of 24 hours? The dogs will need letting out, feeding etc.....They could live to be 13 or so, you'll be mid 60s. Do you have any travelling plans when you retire and what impact would the dogs have on those? Do you have any caring responsibilities towards your own elderly parents which may be impacted by the responsibilties of dog ownership?

Is your car big enough for a lurcher and whatever else you want to get?

Have you checked that your children are happy to have you take dogs every time you visit them? Is THEIR home suitable to have the dogs staying there while eg you all go out for dinner/the theatre/whatever you like to do when you're there? Will they resent you saying you can't do x/y/z because you have to consider the dogs? What will happen when grandchildren come along - will the tying nature of having dogs to care for impact on what you can do with helping out with the grandchildren?

These are all things that many people don't consider when they have the urge to have a dog because they enjoy the companionship. They are very tying and restrictive in lots of ways as circumstances change. It's not just your circumstances NOW that you have to look at, but in the next 10 years at least.

Get a springer - less mad than a working cocker.
If you get a working cocker then look for one with a lower drive.

We always had show cockers until we got our working one who is nearly two now. He is a terrific dog but totally different from our older show dog who has always run with my husband since he was old enough. You shouldn’t run a dog until it’s a year old with joints etc developed and then start gradually. Our worker now does a 10k run and would do the same again if his master was up to it. It’s not just the energy level that’s high he needs his brain occupied too so lots of training and play. He has a strong instinct to chase birds etc so lots of work on recall at the start using a long lead after he disappeared into the distance once. Doesn’t need same amount of grooming as a show one but feet ears and feathers need trimmed and I think he sheds more. Great temperament and highly intelligent. Never had a border terrier so can’t help there. I do think terriers are more independent than spaniels though.

Miniature poodle.

We have a working cocker and he is the most lovely nature, although quite anxious. He does shed so much hair though and needs grooming every day.

Our show cocker is very, very full on and has been known to exhaust a collie. Since we got her, we seem to have met more than a few comparatively calm, gentle, laid back working cockers. Or maybe it's just our jaundiced eye by now.

I have a working cocker and he’s a dream to train. Amazing recall, on it when he’s out - lots of running and sniffing etc but home he just flops around the house. He was more of a shadow when very young, now he’s almost 4 and he happily goes and finds a bed to lay on while we’re downstairs.

Eh? Not all lurchers are big, it entirely depends on what crosses they are. Obviously, a deerhound x greyhound will probably be massive, but a Bedlington x Whippet would be fairly small.

Working cocker . They are lovely dogs who give what they are given - be peaceful and gentle with them and you'll get it back. Be wild and rowdy and active you'll get that back. They're a good size to fit most households and are clever little buggers.

I think they really vary. Our working cocker doesn’t moult much at all but his brother (who has been shaved so maybe that changed his coat 🤷🏻‍♀️) moults while walking, you can see it flying everywhere whereas our boy is more silky smooth. We vacuume twice a week but that’s enough.

Of the two I would go for a working cocker spaniel. Easy to train.

Interesting as ours was shaved ( we didn't know you weren't meant to ) and since then he has moulted terribly. we have laminate floors and huge fur balls just collecting and rolling around daily !

Gosh, it's astonishing that anyone manages to keep a dog by this reckoning. I shudder to think how you would rate my dog owning credentials- in my 50s!, with a job! and an elderly parent! and children 😵

Get a border terrier, @53103min . There's nothing not to love about them and even when you're a very old lady of 60 you'll still be able to manage.

Massive difference. I’ve got a border. I’ve taught many spaniels agility and moving in training circles know even more! They don’t really have very good off switches. They are bred to work 8 hours a day. Every day. They are high drive and need to work. There are of course exceptions but it’s not the norm.

My border is 18 months. She’s easy to train and loves learning. She will happily do miles of walks (6.5 offlead in the countryside this morning - yes offlead. Her recall is brilliant) or 30 minutes lead sniff - she gets a good variety. She loves to snooze in the house when not doing and is fun but laid back. She is very much energy on demand. She does get good exercise and two training classes a week and I train her most days. They are clever and active dogs who can get bored. Mine is from more working lines (KC reg line bred) so is more sparky than some. I roll her coat myself. It’s really easy. She’s affectionate and can be cuddly. She lives with an elderly cat.

All dogs are a way of life but spaniels can be really really hard work. Terriers are a lot less. As a trainer when I was buying it would be terrier every time. You do have to understand them though. They are results not task driven. So you have to make it worth their while! They are eager to please when you raise your value.

I love terriers, you get big dog personality in a small package. They are loyal and usually easy to train.

My terrier cross will walk all day or snooze depending on what's on offer.

I think getting two dogs together at the same time is risky though unless you are getting two rescues who are already bonded?

Personally I'd get one dog and see how you go for a year or two. If it feels right then consider adding in another dog.

I’ve got a 20 month old working cocker - he’s a dream. Absolutely mental at times but the most loving, good natured dog you’d ever want to meet.

Fab with children, has taken to obedience and agility training like a pro, was toilet trained within a week and has no anxiety issues about being left on his own. Will happily sleep whilst we are out, can now be left for 4 hours or so at a time without anyone letting him out for a wee.

He would love your lifestyle, he enjoys running with my husband but it also happy with a more sedate walk with me.

He doesn’t really require any grooming above a shower and a good brush once a week.

With training I’m sure he’d be fine on a train for short journeys too.

My border terrier is lovely, however if you like long brisk walks then they aren't the dog for you.
As with all terriers she has to sniff every 5 steps, it's really annoying at times. I certainly couldn't run with her she'd trip me up.

I run with mine. No problems. She does like to sniff but not excessively. She doesn’t sniff at all when ‘working’ as she’s completely focused on me. Walks, well they’re as much for her as me. She just catches up when she’s all sniffed out 🙂 Spaniels are far sniffier dogs. Always have their nose to the ground.

Why not a show cocker? They aren’t always more relaxed but typically are they slightly less mental than a working cocker - really no one needs a working line anything unless they’re going to work them.

Show cockers are still energetic (mines ten and still does 8-10 miles a day) so would still suit your needs

Having both, I’d say a border. Lovely little dogs. They can be independent, hunt, and be feisty. Cockers vary in energy levels, but most workers have plenty. Mine is, frankly, an exhausting, exasperating MENACE. She’s out most of every day with me or DH, and has various jobs which should in theory tick the physical and mental exercise boxes. There is just no off switch (except for at night, when she’s opened every door between you, snuggled on your pillows and is offering serious resistance to anyone who feels that maybe a dog bed would be a better place for her). She bounces through the door before 5am, stands poised at the fence for “just one last field sweep” before we go home at night, “we my have missed something”… clingy, jealous, bad tempered, nervous, intermittently reactive, thieving, shedding, intelligent and just so so SO very needy. If I dare leave her at home for too long and she suspects I’ve been somewhere fun, she greets me with a full on head hug and growls & snarls in my ear for a minute - I’m definitely being told off. If she’s feeling something else is getting her fair share of attention, she will snatch it, (books, gardening tools - if the puppy has had too long being fussed she’ll dash off and fetch his toys or bed), stand in front of you and start deliberately shredding them… although there’s a certain fairness to her malevolent moments, and she’s adoring, and driven and focused and actually really very useful, she’s a full time occupation, and there isn’t anyone who knows her who will do more than “call in and walk her” if we needed to go out for the day. I’m not sure she’d cope with kennels, and although she’s OK with DH, I’d not really relax if anyone else tried to take charge of her. She’s probably at the extreme end of the spectrum, (we are home #5) but I’m counting down the years until I can relax in the evenings again!

Our border is gorgeous

This is my experience too, he’d climb under my skin if he could and he never gets tired, only fitter. He's jumped on the kitchen side and located a ball in a high cupboard before.

At 12 I’ve tired him out for the first time after a four mile walk in and out of water with a ball.

Thats my experience of them for the most part. In agility it’s common for people to start out with a terrier then ‘graduate’ to a WCS if you want a good small dog. They are a totally different prospect and for most a shock to the system. Being dog people they adapt but I know more than a few who would and have gone back to terriers!

My border is easy for the most part to live with and she is the the higher drive end of the scale. Recall wise from 10 weeks we heavily reinforced being with us is amazing and after a brief bit of decorative ears at adolescence even if she hunts she doesn’t go far or for long and checks in with us even when there is hunting to be done. That has taken work though but again her real life recall is better than a lot of WCS I know.

Thank you so much everyone for these thoughtful (and brilliantly expressed especially @MrsElf ) answers. I’m going to give them another proper read and give it all some thought.