Recommend a family dog - not first time dog owner don't worry

[pastypirate]

Not a thread about whether to get a dog. I already have a very content show cocker who isn't left for long periods (wfh and other adult almost always at home). We have a holiday home so dog comes with us and has been kennelled twice in 9 years!

Considering a second dog and ddog is getting on and we will find his passing v painful.

Dp wants another spaniel or a collie. I have said a flat no collie as I do not think we can meet their stimulation needs. Ddog is very easy and very set in his ways. I love spaniels but ddog pulled on the lead a lot and I want next dog to be walked by dc as early on as possible so logically a smaller breed seems a better option. Dn has a dax which the kids love but we have a big house with lots of stairs and apparently this is an issue with them.

I would have a rescue staff in a heartbeat I'm sure they tick every box but family not keen especially dp,

Dd1 and I want a Jack Russell but we do have rabbits so maybe not a good match. I really want a clever dog we can teach tricks to. Ddog is very loving but not the brightest and it took 7 years to teach him lie down!

I was set on a whippet but my whippet rescue friend has put me off with the prolific food stealing I'm not sure I want to invite that problem in!

I would choose a flat coated dog as I'm already stuck with a mud sponge dog who has to be groomed every 3 months. Not a deal breaker but an extra expense.

So a dog smaller than a spaniel? Keen for ideas and in no rush more interested in what breeds are suggested for us to look in to xx

Smooth Collie? (This is a breed, not a smooth-coated Border Collie.)

Great family dogs, far more of an off switch than a Border Collie/working sheepdog.

I was going to say greyhound but then I saw the rabbits so flat out no there.

Honestly? I think if you want a dog that’s smaller than a spaniel that won’t chase rabbits you’re gonna end up with either some deformed thing that can’t breathe (pug) or a yapper (chi).

I’d say a retriever - they’re bigger but they have all the pros of a spaniel without the sometimes quite sad behavioural issues.

Miniature poodle, get it cut like a cockapoo style. They're very clever and won't pull your shoulder out on a walk like a cockapoo/cocker spaniel.

Sorry mini poodle will need grooming every 6-8 weeks but otherwise good choice.
Or what about a Mini schnauzer? Although they are very vocal 😂

Oh I was going to say a Labrador but they’re obviously not small and are very strong until trained to walk nicely on a lead. They tick all your other boxes though, easy to wipe the mud off after a walk and ridiculously trainable. I think your best bet would actually be another spaniel tbh.

I think you're going to struggle to find a short coated, easy to clean, small breed that doesn't have a high prey drive around the rabbits, to be honest.

My vote would be a miniature poodle but they do need daily brushing and regular grooming as they matt very easily otherwise. Every 4-6 weeks is ideal.

Schipperke?
Cute, clever, IME not too much prey drive. Can be a bit arsey with strangers though not aggressive.

A rescue staffie? Glad your partner disagreed with you on that!

I'd say a Lab but doesn't fit your size requirements but ticks all the boxes.

Miniature poodle if you're happy to take care of the coat (they don't need a fancy style).

They're clever, a good size, don't shed. I'm considering one for my next dog (always had terriers). My sister has one and the only downside is they can be neurotic!

I would also consider one of the milder natured terriers, like a Norwich. If you hand strip the coats, they needn't be high maintenance grooming wise.

I would say you are better off looking at more of a lab or a retriever. Both can be challenging as puppies but unlike full working breeds they mellow down quickly once adulthood is reached.

My biggest advice is research as many breeds as you can and what that breed is specifically bred for, those traits will be dominant and will be noticeable if it's a well bred dog. Breed traits are such an important part of picking the right companion for your family. If they are bred for any kind of work they won't be the easiest dogs. That being said working breeds can be fantastic family dogs, I have a GSD and he is wonderful. But he needs the bare minimum of an hour of walking/running daily and requires quite a bit of mental stimulation and play, he can only settle completely when it's the evening and he knows the day is done. Other than that he's always on alert or ready to be on the go, which can be challenging. It's the nature of his breed and anyone with a working line breed will tell you they are difficult at times. I have seen far too many people get in over their head with certain breeds because they underestimated how much energy they would have, Jack Russels being the most common.

Another vote for a miniature poodle. You will need to keep on top of the grooming but they're fantastic dogs.

Papillon! Very clever, healthy, as purebred dogs go, very portable. They have long coats but they aren’t double coats and their shedding and grooming needs are less than you might guess.

Might integrating a new dog with an old dog you describe as 'set in his ways' be fraught with problems and make your old dog unhappy?

In my experience you might end up with an elderly dog and a full of life new dog who both have very different walking needs and end up having to walk both separately.

Not trying to be negative, but this might not be the smooth ride you think it will.

Unlike full working breeds?!? Labs and retrievers are definitely full working breeds!

OP the issues you want to avoid are avoided through training. We have gundogs - by definition high prey drive animals. They are completely safe around rabbits and small furry animals, as they have been trained to be steady. They don't pull as they have be trained to walk on the lead properly.
It's training.

I would still go with Whippet, we had one and his food stealing certainly wasn't any worse than any other dog. The lab cross we had was much worse! I've dog sat loads of dogs and I think Whippets have been about the easiest. No hair everywhere, can take as much or as little exercise as you like, will snuggle up with you or happy to snooze in their bed, don't mind being left too much etc. I don't know if the prey drive would be a problem though?

I don't know if you are considering cross breeds but I have a working cocker x collie and he is amazing! Really clever, obedient but not at all neurotic like some collies can be. I'd highly recommend it as a cross

I am a cocker spaniel owner and adore them. I get very puzzled by what I read here about the breed. Mine barely moults (we had cats previously and ddog is nothing in comparison).

he loves a bonkers run around on a walk but in the house he flops from one sleep position to another. He’s 3.5 and so loving. Also, we have house rabbits and he snuggles with the old one, the new young one jumps on his tummy and head - he’s not sure how to deal with that but never chases or snaps because we trained him. It’s mostly down to training.

My second choice would be a border terrier. The ones I know are lovely friendly dogs, happy with a long walk but also OK with less

@OrlandointheWilderness how did you train not to pull on the lead? I still struggle with this aspect. Sometimes he’s a dream but other time he is a pain. He’s much happier off the lead and recalls well so I think it’s due to practice but any tips are very welcome!

Oh God I don’t know whippet with rabbits could be extremely high risk.

We start from puppy hood. Teach the heel position (treats are useful here 😂) then take steps forward. As soon as they get ahead, a 'no' and don't move. Say heel and reward when in that position. When you stop, dog sits. Immediately. Resume and try again! 😂
It's a long, slow process sometimes, but the dog does NOT get to walk unless they are at heel. Change direction frequently too.

Whippets are designed to chase small furry things - personally there is no way I would risk having one in a house with a cat or rabbit, though I know people who seem to manage.

I know a working labrador who lives with two guinea pigs! They've never done any specific training with them but he is incredible with them. Super gentle and calm - it's amazing to see.

I'd really go for a labrador, we've had several as house dogs and so long as you start the training early enough, then you shouldn't have problems with food nicking, or pulling. But do not go for the working lines, as they want to work! But temperament wise, they are as safe as you can guarantee any dog being. And they are easily trainable. I wouldn't worry about the size issue, or the rabbits with a lab.