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What do I do when my 1 year old dog tried to bite me?

62 replies

flipflopsandsunshine · 27/12/2023 22:00

We have a much loved 1 year old papillon. I’m at my wits end and so upset.
He nips and growls at me daily, and it’s not the usual playful puppy mouthing.

He likes a lot of affection and being brushed and cuddled etc but will growl, nip and bite when being handled is not on his terms, for example when;
trying to get him off the sofa
trying to get him off the beds
trying to put his harness on when he’s not in the mood
trying to put him back in the car when he doesn’t fancy coming home
trying to stop him ripping up the rugs (we use a house training line but sometimes I can’t pick up the end of it because he will snap at me)
He steals the kids toys if they drop them then resource guards them (we swap things for treats)
Most of the time he welcomes hugs from the children other times he growls and snaps.
After an off lead play (he is very friendly with other dogs) I sometimes can’t put him back on the lead if he is too fired up, he will snap and bite me.
If he gets into anything he is not allowed at other peoples houses. It’s so embarrassing because I can’t stop him. He will bite if he’s in that particular mood.
I’m worried he is getting worse. He always used to let me untangle the lead from his legs when on a walk, but now even that gets me a growl and snap.
I am trying to use positive training methods but all we are really doing is managing a lot of the behaviour.
I literally don’t know what to do when he won’t let me handled him. I’m starting to be a little scared of him and he rules the roost! Although right now he’s sleeping on my lap like butter wouldn’t melt.
The vet has suggested it may be fear aggression and to see a behaviourist, but in the meantime what do I do in the moment when he tries to bite?

OP posts:
OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon · 29/12/2023 22:47

I haven't read every reply, but they certainly seem to be conflicting !

I think you should join a breed group forum, as they will be experienced owners of Papillons.

and you could get advice from the breeder, this is me hoping it was a decent K.C. registered breeder etc.

Finally a Papillon will be snapped up if offered for rehoming to such a breed group !

p.s. my vet advised having my Japanese Chin neutered when he reached one year old, she didn't want him done younger.

nottaotter · 30/12/2023 00:20

@OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon what kind of personality does your japanese Chin have?

OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon · 30/12/2023 00:45

nottaotter · 30/12/2023 00:20

@OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon what kind of personality does your japanese Chin have?

He was smart, intelligent, loving, funny, cute, loyal, alert, confident, dainty.

He was a big big dog in a little dog's body.

He slept on my pillow at night - No 1 spot, the other dogs were further down the bed / along side me / at the bottom of the bed.

He was the 2nd dog of 3 at the time, 1st dog was a Lab/Rottie and I am pretty sure he thought he was that size too :)
3rd dog was a female beagle whom I adopted as a playmate/companion for him as he really really wanted to play with 1st dog, and 1st dog had no interest at all in this little dog.

He welcomed 30 foster dogs into our home ( not all at once ! ) and lived with several cats.

2welshmums · 30/12/2023 00:47

I used to bite my dog back and she didn't like it (why would she)
Just a little nip on the tip of her long ear.

Honestly, sounds weird but by showing my dog that I was the boss, she stopped trying to domineer me and now knows that she isn't in charge.

I'm not a dog professional, it just worked for me

nottaotter · 30/12/2023 01:08

@OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon he sounds like he was an amazing character. Ive read they are quite independent and are actually quite cat like.

Tygertiger · 30/12/2023 08:12

2welshmums · 30/12/2023 00:47

I used to bite my dog back and she didn't like it (why would she)
Just a little nip on the tip of her long ear.

Honestly, sounds weird but by showing my dog that I was the boss, she stopped trying to domineer me and now knows that she isn't in charge.

I'm not a dog professional, it just worked for me

You put your face within biting range and then attacked your dog. You’re very lucky you’ve still got a face at all. There are no words for how stupid this is (and utterly unnecessary).

Bandolina · 30/12/2023 15:39

My dog did similar stuff as an adolescent.
Chewing stuff up in the living room, Refusing to get off the sofa, lying down refusing to be moved, stealing stuff to chew up, refusing to come back
Some of it is fairly usual adolescent dog behaviour that he will grow out of and needs to be managed whilst that is happening

The difference is mine is a big dog so picking him up was never an option and dragging him also doesn't work very well. The times I tried that I did get a show of aggression. It did not take me long to realise that if we start going down the road of brute force then I will be the loser and our whole relationship is not going to be very pleasant. They have to choose to obey you. You are forcing him and he is letting you know he doesn't like it.

What I do have over my dog is access to resources that he wants largely food but sometimes play, toys, walks or a comfy spot. He obeys me because he has learnt that it is in his interests to do so and then he gets good stuff. I am under no particular illusion that he does it out of love or respect.

I manage his access to stuff that I know will cause a problem so we got a box for shoes, kids have to pick up all their toys, I keep him on his lead and harness in unfamiliar houses and on a long line on walks and I shut him out of the lounge or prevent access to the sofa unless I invite him up ie all good stuff comes through me no self rewarding

If I want him to move or drop something I bribe him or swop him for something he wants or I distract him eg by rattling a pan in the kitchen or opening the dishwasher. He always comes running for those. I'd rather be able to be in perfect control and just command him and reward him for obeying me but sometimes that fails and then I'd rather bribe him than drag him. I don't want him to learn that aggression is an effective tactic as he would be very scary if he did.

I would suggest you act as though picking up your dog isn't an option as he is telling you he'd rather it wasn't.
Sofa and beds- prevent access completely if he won't get down.
Rugs- remove them for a while. Mine had just a canvas mat for a while because he chewed up so many of his dog beds.
Harness- I still bribe mine with food to put his head through
Getting back in the car- bribery or I have had to wait for him to just get bored sometimes. I don't feed him breakfast until after walks so he has an incentive to want to go home and is hungry for rewards
Going back on lead- no access to playing with others unless he learns to come back. This takes loads and loads of practice. You have to take the lead on and off randomly and call him back without putting him on lead a lot so he doesn't associate lead with end of fun.

mamma65432 · 01/01/2024 00:51

@Bandolina He obeys me because he has learnt that it is in his interests to do so and then he gets good stuff. I am under no particular illusion that he does it out of love or respect.

So basically you bribe him, which works for now - until he finds a better reward

I'm starting to think that this positive reinforcement only training is verging on the ridiculous. At some point toddlers have to learn the word 'no' - but it seems unfashionable to teach dogs the word 'no'.

Bobsledgirl · 01/01/2024 00:55

Can’t believe people still recommend C Milan! His methods are outdated.

There is a Facebook group run by behaviourists go on that fir better advice Dog Training Advice and Support.

Bandolina · 01/01/2024 03:15

Well I would say it is a bit more than bribery. It starts as bribery and then it becomes an assumption on his part that it's a good idea to obey me because usually that results in good stuff. I don't give him a treat every time I ask him to sit or heel these days but I did when I was training him initially. He sees me as a good person to be around and that builds our relationship and that's why he usually obeys me. He doesn't love or respect me because dogs don't have those emotions as humans understand them.

Why do you think your dog obeys you? Because you are pack leader or some crap? What does that even mean? It just means you control access to resources which is exactly what I said.

My dog understands no in the sense of 'she is making that noise that means she disapproves of what I am doing' but it isn't a very useful command really as it does not tell him what I would rather he does. Therefore I only use no as an interruption to get his attention and then I give him a different command that he has been trained to know.

Eg he jumps up. If I just shout 'no' how is that effective? He will have no idea what I do actually want from him. Instead I ask him to sit so he can't jump up or go to his place and now he routinely offers me those behaviours instead as he knows those are rewarded. Down, leave it, drop it and watch me are all a hell of a lot more useful in stopping him doing things I don't want than just shouting no.

I have tried punishing him at times and it really didn't work out very well. It makes him more hyped up and antagonistic if he is shouted at or threatened. If you shout at, hit or frighten your dog then some dogs will react back aggressively at you and mine is one of them. He's a flock guardian breed (didn't know that when I rescued him) and it's in his nature to meet perceived danger with aggression or at least a show of aggression.

I have had people (family and a dog trainer) advise me to spray him with water for jumping up, shake a can of stones at him for barking, use a prong collar and yank his lead for pulling. I did try those things and I quickly concluded that it was just making matters worse and I found a better trainer who works positively and we have successfully trained him out of all those behaviours (well barking is a work in progress) without the need for aversion.

I don't hit and shout at my kids and I did not feel comfortable doing that to my dog either. I never understood people smacking a toddler for hitting and to me shouting at or causing pain to a dog as a punishment for negative behaviour is the same dumb counterproductive logic.

Fraaahnces · 01/01/2024 03:22

He needs to be put in his place. He’s a dog. Keep him off the sofa. He needs to be shown that you are HIS boss and not the other way around. Don’t drag him out and about with you everywhere you go. Give him his own place in the house and keep him below you at all times. If this means squirting him with water every time he gets up on the couch do that. Put a dog bed in a corner and leave dog toys in it. Reward him with treats when he makes the right choices and a firm “NO!” when he is about to make the wrong one. He won’t like it, but you’re not there for his approval. He will soon be happier and less aggressive with firmer boundaries.

BrokenWing · 01/01/2024 03:37

We have always had bigger dogs (labs, collies in our family) so too big to be "handled" off sofas, beds etc. We had to train them to comply with positive enforcement/rewards.

Even though your dog is small enough to be "handled" it can lead to undesirable behaviours if they don't see the reward for complying.

Any snappy dog I would separate from the children immediately and get a professional behaviourist in to help you unpick what has gone wrong, train the dog to move and handle it less.

SIL got a deep bite from her little dog on her hand and it turned to cellutitus and she still has some damaged nerves. You dont want that, or worse, for your dc (or yourself).

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