Dog bit someone - mortified - never happened before - help!

[madgearmy]

I have two Beagles - girls - one is 18 months old and the other is 3. The three year can be a nervous and reactive when we take the dogs out together but she had never ever shown signs of biting anyone or wanting to.
Now my dogs do bark when we take them out together - the older dog barks when she sees a reflective jacket and in the dark she barks at people with torches and those lights runners wear on their heads.
They are always on a lead because they are Beagles - we give them a free run once a week in a dog field, they have at least an hour's walk a day and lots of play - normally with each other.
Last night I took them out and - something I've not done on my own with them before - took them into a narrow cut through near our house. It has a lamppost but it wasn't lit. Now the cut through backs onto a wood where my dogs can smell foxes, people feed them there. Anyway as we are walking through the cutthrough my dogs get excited and at the other end I can a woman has started to enter the cut through. My dogs are barking a bit - she has a torch on her head. Some fireworks go off in the distance - quite loud but not scary loud. I shout out to her 'my dogs are friendly but they can smell foxes and they get a funny about torches' she carries on walking towards me - this cutrhough is narrow. I pull my dogs back on their leads but somehow - I think it's the older one, jumps up at her. She says 'your dog bit me'. At that point I turn round and say can you follow me out. We go out into the woods which are well lit and I get her number and tell her to send me a picture of the wound.
I mention my profession and she tells me she's in sinurance. She sends a bit, I can't tell whether it's a bite or whether it's my dog's claw. I feel terrible. She says she's called the NHS and was told to wait 12 hours. My Beagles are not aggressive - although maybe they are now. What can I do? Do I have to have them put down - I don't want them hurting anyone ever!!

I'm sure you don't have to put them down for this, but you could muzzle train them. Keep working on stopping them from jumping at people, and avoid narrow paths like this one where possible. I'm sure plenty of people will be on to blame the woman for walking, wearing a torch, whatever as there is no shortage of owners who think their dog's behaviour is only ever the victim's fault.

You don’t have to have them put down. This may not even be a bite and there are many solutions if it was including muzzles.

You aren’t in control of your dogs though and need to understand how to train them. You can’t expect people will change their behaviours so get the dogs sorted. Reward based, decent trainer could work wonders (even with beagles:).

Firstly, calm down! Of course you don't need to get them put down over this. If she reports you, you may get a visit from the dog warden, though. They could (theoretically) enforce a dog control order but in all likelihood you'll just be told to make sure it doesn't happen again.

However, what I would say is that you need to set yourself up for success going forward. Short leads only so that you can control them properly (they can't be allowed to jump up like that) and if you can't control both at once, then take them out separately. If they're scared of torches and reflective jackets, then walk them in the daytime so that they're unlikely to see those things.

I have a beagle who's lead reactive (he's fine off-lead) and I only ever walk him on a six foot lead in public so that I can hold him close to me if necessary.

We did use to use muzzles to stop them eating and scavenging.
I'm going to call our vet and see if they can recommend anyone.
We did a lot of training when they were younger but we need to keep going.
I'm so awfully sad about this.

A muzzle is good but it won't stop the main issue, which is them jumping and lunging at people. A muzzle punch from a dog can still cause a lot of damage.

You need to keep on short leads so they can't jump up in the first place. I know my beagle is strong and if he jumped at someone frail (or a child) he could easily knock them over. You really need to be on top of that kind of behaviour.

How long were the leads if you pulled them back but your dog was still able to jump up?

Short leads metal ones - the cut through is about 1.5 metre across if that - people walking through it will brush one another. So it would have to be a silly short lead for her not to have touched her if you see what I mean.

Is there a reason you use metal leads?

Personally I would switch to adjustable leads like Halti or Kumfi. Put them on the shortest setting while walking near people or on narrow lanes and wrap the leads around your hands to physically prevent the jumping up.

If you physically can't hold them both back you shouldn't be walking them together.

I wrap the leads around my hands, I hold them tight - I'm very strong and can control them.
I made the mistake of walking through a cut through and maybe not realising just how reactive my dogs were to the narrow space/fireworks/torch and smell of fox.
I won't be walking them through there again! Not on my own.
Even with a short lead so there so little space I would have choked my dogs if I'd held them any tighter!

We all make mistakes. I’ve beaten myself up about things that have happened too but sometimes all you can do is apologise and move forward taking steps to ensure nothing like this happens again.

The first thing I would do is stop walking them together, 2 reactive dogs fuel eachother and in order to tackle the behaviour you need to stop them practicing it. Go back to basics individually but I would seriously consider investing in a behaviourist to teach you the basics of working with a reactive dog. It’s not acceptable for them to be barking at people ever and certainly not lunging…in the nicest way possible it’s not okay to just say my dog barks at people without having addressed it seriously. It sounds a bit like you’ve been resigned to them behaving this way rather than sorting it.

You say they aren’t aggressive but nervous dogs are easily triggered into nervous aggression if they are unable to get away and it sounds like this is what’s happened. If you can tackle this individually you might be able to bring them together at a later date but for now you need to focus on each dog as an individual.

I would also muzzle, plus stick to open spaces (although I’m sure you already would have done that!) There’s no harm to the dog in muzzling as a precaution despite how hysterical owners get over it. I use dogmatic headcollars for control. I can grab them by the face loop if we have to pass something or someone closely, it gives more control and you can turn the heads into you if required.

Dogs that bite absolutely should be put down! The next attack could be a child or a baby or someone elderly.
Take some responsibility for your damned dog.

Just make the changes and see. In a year you could have dogs who don’t care about torches, reflective jackets or fireworks. If you ever change the love of foxes though that would be miraculous.

I hold them tight - I'm very strong and can control them.

With respect, you obviously couldn't control them because they lunged and injured someone. If I was passing someone in a narrow space I would grab my dogs' collar to prevent any lunging, or hold the lead as close to it as possible.

Or, in a short narrow space like you describe, I would turn back on myself and wait around the corner so the other person could pass safely.

As a dog walker and reactive dog owner, I've had to do both those things on multiple occasions to prevent dogs from jumping up. It's not ideal but much better than someone getting hurt.

All that said, you don't need to beat yourself up over it.

Are you sure the dog bit her - you don’t sound too sure?

in the nicest way possible it’s not okay to just say my dog barks at people without having addressed it seriously.

The problem is that beagles are literally bred to use their voices to attract human attention. Training them to go against their very nature isn't an easy task.

A barking dog is not in the same category as a lunging dog - I know OP's dog does both but barking is not (on its own) an aggressive or dangerous behaviour.

If I took my beagle somewhere with lots of foxes (or the scent of foxes) it would be nigh on impossible to stop him baying. He does it on pretty much every single walk at this time of year - it's hunting season!

OP doesn’t even know which dog it was that jumped up, so probably not the best person to ask if the dog bit or ‘just’ was allowed to injure the woman.
Strange to say you can control them. Look up dog offences in the UK, and what the gov website says about them.

I can't get past this cruelty -
' we give them a free run once a week' and an 'hour on a lead each day'!

Once a week? A one hour walk on a lead? I've had Beagles and they would have been a neurotic mess with that appalling lack of mental and physical stimulation.

Why on earth did you pick a breed that is completely unsuitable for your lifestyle?

Was it definitely a bite or could the dog have been yapping at her and she threw out her arm and the dog's teeth caught her hand. Did you see the wound? Not saying it is ok for your dogs to behave as they did but their is a difference between a deliberate bite and getting an accidental injury.

To clarify my previous post, I know OP said the dog barks at torches/reflective jackets but my experience is that it's hard to get a dog to go against their nature, no matter what that nature is.

It's why collies (for example) herd inappropriate objects (cars, bikes, people), it's why spaniels and other gun breeds will carry toys or slippers in their mouths, and it's also why beagles will bark (generally speaking) more than other dogs.

My beagle gets an hour on the lead every day and he's not a neurotic mess

You also have absolutely no idea what mental stimulation OP gives her dogs because she hasn't said, so unless you're psychic, who are you to judge her lifestyle and breed suitability?

You'll have to adjust you walking routes so you only ever use paths that are wide enough for you to keep your dogs off passers by.

And never underestimate how frightening it is to be the other person in a scenario where a dog is lunging towards them.

I agree that if reflective jackets and lights set them off, then you need to walk them in daylight only. Employ a dog walker if you aren't available whilst it is still light.

I heard back from the lady. She's reported it to the police and she's had diphtheria and polio and tetanus vaccines.
I give my dogs more than a hours walk a day that's the minimum- and the older dog goes out with a dog walker off lead - I take the younger one out running with me.
I also called the police to tell them. Im kicking myself because we were way into the through when she entered it it was pitch black.
I've been so stupid

Can you post a picture of the bite?

Your dogs are reactive and nervous (you admit that)
You clearly know there is an issue as you felt the need to call out - people with dogs that are not going to do something aggressive do not yell out at strangers like that.
You pulled your dogs back on leads that were ridiculously short- so you knew, even if you weren't specifically thinking about it, that there was a risk.

TBH OP you are an irresponsible owner.

A reactive/nervous dog is a problem and should be treated as such - it should always be muzzled just in case. Better that your dog is muzzled than something like this happens.

It's grossly naive to think a dog that is nervous and reactive won't one day bite someone.

Muzzle your dogs going forward.

You warned the lady and she continued to approach you. Therefore, your dog should be ok in theory.