DESPERATE for help. Extremely distraught over dog cruciate tear diagnosis...

[kelce]

16.5 kg dog hurt his leg running like a loon in the woods a month ago. It didn't improve after a week, he was limping/not weight-bearing etc. X-ray at vet confirmed what they said was a 'very partial' tear.

We were instructed to cut the dog's normal exercise (45min-1hr off lead) to 25% (10 min walks on-lead) for a week and then gradually build back up to see if the leg would go lame again. Sure enough, with more exercise it was clear the leg was still injured.

At our followup appointment, the vet said we would need the surgery, but that it was not urgent. He said some people would even leave it for months until it fully torn as it is the same operation and recovery either way. It would be ideal for us to delay the surgery by a couple months due to travel plans, work schedules, etc.

My concern, however, is that we have been given bad advice. The vet basically made it sound like the dog is fine to carry on going to doggy care as long as he has shortened walks and stays on the lead because the risk of a full tear is 'very unlikely'. But wouldn't wrestling/roughhousing with other dogs be the worst possible thing to do? Said nothing about stairs, jumping on furniture, etc. either... just really worried to take him at his word that waiting a bit won't really make a lot of difference and that it getting worse is unlikely....

Is there anyone who can help shed some light on this -- please I am really worried and anxious with all the 'what ifs' and though I'll be devastated if we have to cancel our holiday with family because of this I would rather know now.... begging anyone for insight, even better if some vets are lurking here... grateful in advance

I’m not a vet but have two experiences of crucial ligament tears (different dogs):

1. Diagnosed immediately and surgery needed immediately. Long period of rehab (6 months +) which wouldn’t have included any daycare situations as too dangerous.

2. diagnosis of possible cruciate damage but not certain. Essentially 1 month of very limited exercise and crated for any periods of time alone in the house. Dog recovered beautifully and hasn’t had a problem since.

So, my opinion would be that 1 week of exercise reduction was very short. However, I’m not sure whether the cruciate ligament can repair itself that easily so may be that was why? I personally wouldn’t want my dog to go to daycare and be trying to manage in this situation, I agree with you there.

Good luck, it’s horrible when they are hurt.

Just to be clear, with my second example the vet checked after 4 weeks and still wasn’t sure the cruciate ligament was stable but it seemed ok. So we still don’t know if it was a tear or just another injury.

No vet but my experience of cruciate injuries in own dogs and fosters.

A minimum of 6 weeks rest to see any improvement at alll.

If partially torn I would not just wait for it to fully tear. Either rest or operate.

Small dogs may improve if not totally torn. If totally torn rest will not repair the cruciate.

Surgery is usually really really successful. In my experience dogs get over it pretty well. Although the crate rest and restricted exercise initially takes some planning.

Personally I would do surgery asap whilst all the muscles and ligaments are still strong. If i did decide to try rest it would need to be for at least 6 weeks.

I would not be letting a dog with a known dodgy cruciate jump twist or rough play with other dogs

I’m also not a vet but we had a border terrier x with a cruciate injury and he recovered with rest for about 6 weeks and that was literally barely moving at all . He was about 9/10kg and overweight at the time .

Thank you for the replies. Not letting him anywhere near daycare was also my instinct. I will ring them tomorrow

I will never forget the noise my dog made when his cruciate tore, there’s no way I would wait until that happens.

My Lab has suffered two. One around age 6 the other around age 11.
“He said some people would even leave it for months until it fully torn as it is the same operation and recovery either way.”- This is bad advice according to my vet, arthritis will set in.
Sooner it’s operated on the better. The op itself is brutal in terms of exercise restriction. Our outcome was amazing, after very strict confinement to one room to heal - out to toilet only for a few weeks. He was limited for ten weeks in total. After a year he was back to 95%.

As soon as he saw the vet he said limit exercise immediately until the op could be done.
We saw a top orthopaedic veterinary surgeon so there was a short waiting list. After the op, no stairs, no jumping, no slippery flooring, orthopaedic pet bed. Good luck op hope your dog will be ok. I’d get a second opinion!

It either needs extremely conservative care for many weeks or operating on.

I’d be seeking a second opinion with a specialist. It is totally recoverable with either route but depends on the care given.

My dog is 12 weeks post cruciate ligament surgery. As I understand it small dogs are often left to see if they improve with rest. Medium 12kg and above need surgery.
my collie 27kg has had 4 weeks literally just going out on a short lead for toilet breaks and then as immobile as possible. At 5 to 6 weeks two ten minute walks on a short lead. 7 to 8 weeks two twenty minute walks.
So 8 weeks of no jumping no running no stairs on a short lead walking only.
it feels like a life time and my dog has been so good.
Unfortunately he has being referred back as his hip was injured at the same time but it wasn’t noticeable until the ligament was stable.
I think maybe your dog is weight wise in the grey area of wait and see and needing surgery.
I couldn’t have left my dog a moment longer than I had to, the noise when it happened was awful and then it made a horrible clacking sound every time he moved and was clearly painful.
good luck and I would get another opinion.

@Beautyfadesdumbisforever - can I ask if it snapped/tore completely?

How could you tell your dog was in pain? Ours seems alright right now, no whimpering and putting a little weight on it still.

I am dreading the recovery, no matter when that will be. Is your dog chomping at the bit, or more relaxed anyway wanting to recover and on pain meds? Any advice to keep them entertained under these circumstances?

Thanks so much

He wasn’t himself he was very quiet and flat. If I walked up the garden he would come with me but would then lie down and wait for me not his normal enthusiastic self at all.
I had to wait ten days for the surgery I kept him at home and as quiet as I could.
His leg was swinging like it was broken it was horrible.
I used a cage when I went out something I have never used before but generally as long as he was with me he was fine he just accepted that he had to lie down it was his new routine.
I also used a stair gate and put down anti slip flatweave runners in the kitchen. I bought a licky mat which was useful at times.
It’s lovely when it stops the first time I opened the door and let him out for a wee without having to put him on a lead and go with him was sheer joy.

you will get through it and it will improve your “sit and stay” to championship levels.

The recovery is very doable a nuisance and time consuming but very doable and the time will go quickly.

Generally the dogs seem to settle into the new routine. Mine were used to the crate as travel in one in the car so happy to be in there but if I was just sitting working or staying in one place for any length of time they would be out of the crate and with me.

We took them out for car rides to give them some interest and we sat and people watched in carparks! As time went on we got them used to a buggy and they came out with us on smooth surfaces in the buggy.

If you have time before the op I would condition some crate work and buggy work.

You will get through this but I do understand how daunting it seems.

My lab had a cruciate op at 7 and lived till he was 16 and walked and still did gundog work after the op.

We have a cat in a similar situation. We have tried rest but a few weeks on and she is still limping a bit. I think she will need the surgery - just waiting for the vet to confirm or to give it a bit longer.

If your dog shouldn't be off the lead then doggy daycare seems terrible idea as then risk having dogs encouraging to run around and barging or jumping on them, maybe vets thinking like a kennel where they are kept separated within small area, some small home boarders may be able to offer recovery care.

You can seek a consult with a specialised orthopedic vet (either a referral centre or some work within general/first opinion practices) that deal with cruciate tears/repair routinely to assess leg/xrays to be sure what the best treatment plan would be and if/when they may need to do surgery to stabilise joint.

Here's some videos & free courses that may give you more information on condition & there are couple different surgical techniques with CCL repairs.
Cruciate Disease in Dogs - Karen Perry-Butler

Preparing for your dogs CCL repair surgery

Is my dog in pain?

@ScattyHattie thank you so much for this info!