At Wits End

[Rockhopper81]

Not sure if I'm looking for advice or just to get things off my chest.

I have a one year old dog - just turned one - who is super smart, friendly (too friendly really, we're still working on appropriate greetings of people), loving most of the time...just lovely.

However...

He's started biting at us (3 adults) for attention, or for no apparent reason (we think it's to initiate play?). It seems to be more aggressive lately, and mostly focussed towards one member of the household (there is no history of aggression towards the pup from anyone - we've had him since 8 weeks - so not sure why this person). He is 'bonded' to me (I use the term as he's part border collie and I'm definitely his 'person') and is generally well behaved for me, but it he is also very, very dependent on me (to the point of separation anxiety being a very real possibility).

It's becoming really, really hard to enjoy him - he's biting at household members more (not to the point of drawing blood, but bruising and pinches), and it feels like I in particular can't do anything as he always wants/needs to be near me (or he's even worse with barking and nipping).

It doesn't help that myself and another household member has been unwell over the weekend (and the other - the target for the majority of the biting at - isn't very proactive with him), but honestly it's so hard with him at the moment.

I know about teenage hormones at his age, and he was neutered a couple of weeks ago (so that will be playing a part), but I don't know what else to try. He's really good at being 'trained', but then doesn't seem able to apply it outside of 'training', if that makes sense? He gets two good length walks a day, chew toys, meals in enrichment bowls/toys etc.

I've honestly spent this weekend questioning if we're the right home for him, and I feel terrible for doing so because I absolutely adore him, but I don't want him to have anything less than what he deserves in life. But I also know it would be really hard for him to not be around me, and I don't actually want to rehome is as I do love him a lot of the time he's a fantastic member of our family! I just don't want to risk him actually hurting someone seriously with this biting behaviour - I don't want to think about what would happen then, especially as I don't think it would be intentional.

I'm not sure why I'm posting, just to get it off my chest I think. Thanks for reading this essay if you got this far!

I've kept dogs and my solution to this sort of issue was to get the animal a humane muzzle. Pups grow out of bite play but in the meantime you don't have to put up with it.

As he’s part collie, is he trying to herd the person ?
Maybe he needs to tire his mind more. Daily training and those dog puzzles.

We have a 22 month old collie and can 100% understand what you are going through 💐 . Its just me and DH and DH is winterpups person. Probably at around 1 he turned into the demon dog and I was his target. Nipping my ankles, grabbing my arm, just like you've said. All of his training, recall etc went out of the window. DH had to step in when it got too bad, a firm 'no' and winterpup went off with his tail between his legs!. I did lots of redirecting to chew toys and rewarding when he stopped nipping. Im glad to say hes completely stopped it now and on the whole is a good, chilled out boy...however ifs hes over stimulated he can revert to being mouthy. Just keep going with the back to basic training, praising the good and ignoring the bad, and honestly it will pass.

2 threads this evening on a similar topic - look at the rescue dog thread.

Dogs testosterone levels can go up before they fall after castration so some of the behaviour may be done to that but equally it was happening before that.

Prevention is good so keep your dog calm, dont encourage high arousal exercise eg ball chasing, or exciting games concentrate on sniffy walks and loads of chewing and lots of rest and calm.

If the behaviour starts the best thing is to walk away (although not always possible) do use leads indoors if it is directed at certain people to prevent it happening.

If he's part collie are you sure he's not trying to herd people?

It's very common - collies can be incredibly nippy as a breed and you really do need to be consistent with their training. They are incredibly intelligent dogs and definitely need some kind of job or activity.

Does anyone "do" anything with him in that respect?

Thanks for the replies - all very helpful.

We have an indoor lead, which helps to calm him (he seems to understand that it means he needs to be calm when it's on). He used to love puzzles and games, but seems to have completely gone off them lately. We will try again with some high value treats to see if that will engage him. Our aim is to reduce his dependency on me over the next few weeks, building to him being able to be left for brief periods, but obviously we needed him to be fully recovered from his op first. Now he is, we can think about putting things in place for that.

I know logically it's his hormones settling after the castration and him being a teenager, but the emotional side of my brain has been in control the past few days (not helped at all by the succession of migraines 😖), so we will start anew tomorrow.

Thanks again for the replies, just writing it all down has helped I think. 🤞🏻

If he’s part collie i agree with others-the hormones haven’t settled plus he’s a teenager-a deadly combination- he needs to channel that intelligence and energy.main reason why I’d never get a collie- quite a few I know that don’t work are anxious and hard to handle.Hopefully he’ll settle and maybe something like agility-fly ball might suit

It doesn't seem to be herding usually - we can usually tell when it's that, a lot of this nipping/biting behaviour is at someone sitting down. He is incredibly intelligent, he definitely favours the collie side of him, and as I say he used to love puzzles/games/all sorts of enrichment, but has been unwilling to engage recently.

We don't do anything specifically for herding as training - we were recommended to try treibball, but I couldn't find anywhere local to do it. I may have found somewhere drivable to try hoopers - he's super quick too - but worry he won't be able to focus enough for it?

We have a collie. Honestly I think the teen bit is like a fever dream now and I am blocking it out.

The fact the nipping happens when sitting down does not mean it is not misdirected herding. Herding is simply a mindset collies get into to control the environment around them. Is he watching, tensing, stalking and finally nipping? That's herding. You can stop it before it gets there, if he starts to focus on the person a firm Leave It and then take him away. Boundaries, reinforce this behaviour won't work, don't reward the behaviour with attention from you. But try and cut it off before it escalates to the nip which is unacceptable. Also fine to use a muzzle to prevent a nip and also make the behaviour less effective.

At the same time saying oh it's herding isn't much use. A controlled herding instinct in an adult dog is brilliant. And I think the job to do stuff is oversold. I live rurally surrounded by working dogs. Lots of them are stressed, bored and nippy at times. Lots of well trained pets are calm. Busy collies are happy collies and it's our job to keep them busy. They are not happy just bombing around the woods chasing stuff. Theu need to be expected to focus absolutely on their handler and follow instructions, it's rewarding for them and ultimately rewards for us when it starts to go well.

I would really recommend one to one training ideally with someone who knows collies for tactics on surviving the next year. Ours taught us lots of agility and obedience techniques. You don't have to go to classes or enter competitions, just working on new skills at home is enough. There are loads of good books on teaching tricks and you can use that to introduce games and new challenges into walks.

And don't worry about the fact he can learn something superfast but then not apply it. That's normal teenage dog stuff, it all starts to come together at some point.

As PP says, just because you're sitting down when it happens, doesn't mean it's not mis-directed herding behaviour.

Collies need a job to do - a bored collie becomes an anxious collie who will find it's own entertainment - and that can often mean nipping and demanding attention from people.

All those manufactured brain games are (imo) a waste of money for most dogs as once they've figured them out (which doesn't take long) they don't really provide any stimulation anymore.

The activities you mentioned sound good but I would really recommend agility for a collie - it tires them out mentally and physically demanding too. Even something like the KC Good Citizen classes might be a good idea - keep him focused and engaged and give him something to learn.

Thanks for the additional replies - I had looked into the good citizen classes, but honestly I figured he would become so overstimulated by other dogs that he wouldn't be able to actually do any of the things they want!

We did some really focussed 'training' this morning (in that we just went over cues he already knows), and he was so wonderfully engaged and listening. It sounds like it was as a PP said - he really valued and thrived on being focussed on me. It was like a different dog to yesterday evening, when he was biting at us and generally being a bit of an arse.

I'll also look into cutting any herding behaviours off as soon as they arrive - I hadn't considered herding when sitting just being misplaced, so it was really useful to think in those terms. I also think he thinks it's a way to initiate play to a certain extent, so I'll try to redirect that as well.

Again, thank you all so much for your ideas and input, it's good to know it's not just us who are struggling with the teen phase!

Good to see your having a better day!. Have you tried sniffy games?. We give ours dry food for breakfast and hes often not bothered about it until we hide it in his toy box, under a towel, behind the curtains and his favourite, inside a cardboard tube. 😂. Or we put a treat under a row of egg cups and ask him to find it. Could be an idea to get him using hos brain.