Puppy with poor recall, can I have your advice and reassurance please?

[Hayliebells]

I don't know if I'm stressing out unnecessarily, but I'm really concerned about our puppy's recall. He really isn't very consistent at all, when he gets excited (usually when playing with another dog), he just will not come back when called. He just runs around like a lunatic ignoring us. He's an 8 month old Labrador, and we've done all the recommended puppy training/training classes. This isn't my first rodeo, I've had a Lab before, but unless I've blocked it out, I don't remember my previous Lab being that difficult to train! He loves to run free, I just can't imagine keeping him on a long lead, it's unfair on a dog like him imo. Does anyone have any advice on a plan of action? Or words of reassurance that he'll get better as he gets older? We do try and train off the lead in quiet places where there aren't many people about, sometimes he's quite good, sometimes he's terrible! And he's so bouncy! He jumps up, usually when playing with another dog, and he starts jumping around the owner. He doesn't actually make contact, just bounces around them, whilst ignoring my commands to come back. Everyone he's done it to has assured me it's fine, what with them being dog owners too, but I don't think it is, and it's mortifying! Should we be keeping him on the long lead at all times? We try to train off lead sometimes, in the belief he has to learn eventually, but is that the wrong thing to do? Our dog walker says his recall is good, but maybe he's just following what the other dogs do. I keep seeing adverts for Absolute Dogs Sexier than a Kitten course, is that worth purchasing? Is it likely to have ideas that we haven't yet tried? Should we go back to training classes? We got a Lab because I love them, I've had one before and I thought they were easy to train. Have we likely been doing something wrong? Are there any common mistakes that people make, that we might be making? I really feel like I need a plan of action, I dream of long country walks with a bounding, wet, muddy dog. I see other dogs running through the woods so happy, and I'm quite sad for him that ours is still on a lead, he has so much energy. He's a lovely dog really, so good natured and gentle, with people and other dogs. I just want him to be able to run free!

@Newpeep it's such a good way to have a dog that you can all off lead with total joy rather than fear or what they might do next.

Id be interested to see what you all think of this - just back from a walk through a deserted forestry commission area. Met a couple of walkers at the start but apart from that didn’t see a soul - ChenPup was brilliant on his recall, coming back every time he was called, and was rewarded each time. We were out walking for a good 1.5-2 hours. On our return walk I heard someone shouting (I’m partially deaf so struggled to hear what was being said) and DD said to get him on the lead quickly, which I was able to do because he was sniffing the undergrowth close to heel, before a cyclist shot past us at full speed (I’m not exaggerating, he was bloody fast) and it wasn’t a very wide path. I got the fright of my life, as did ChenPup who barked - apparently he’d shouted “bike behind” but barely gave us any time to react and he didn’t slow down. I don’t even want to think about what could have happened if I hadn’t managed to clip him onto the lead - but should I really have to have him on a long line in the middle of nowhere just in case of (idiot) cyclists?

@SirChenjins no, you shouldn't. I've had the same problem. Two cyclists steaming down the footpath. I managed to grab the loony puppy but our old collie was still loose (tbh I wasn't worried about her as she is an old, sensible girl) However, they nearly ran her down, despite her desperately trying to get out of their path, she's not very agile anymore. As they cycled off one of them said I shouldn't have an aggressive dog off the lead. I'm really not sure what they meant as she was running away from them? It really pissed me off annoyed me as they got the last word as they cycled off.

I've also had the same issue when I've been out hacking in local forestry areas. Cyclists coming up fast behind my horse.. they must not value their life 🤣

Sorry for the rant, but I feel for you. I hope ChenPup wasn't worried by the cyclist and at least you had some really good recalls today 😊

I’m so glad you said that - it actually upset me as it could have had a horrible outcome in the middle of nowhere - not easy to get to a vet obviously. I’m going to refocus on his brilliant recall and remember what a wee star he was for 99% of the walk.
I can’t believe those cyclists behaved like that with your collie - what utter prats. I know if I’m cycling then I give warning and reduce my speed until I’m past the walkers, and even more so if I can see there are off lead dogs as their owners need time to gather them in. I do the same with horses - probably a result of growing up with a horse owning sister!

Curious if anyone here has trained a hound? I grew up with terriers and had no trouble with recall ( lots of training) but I now have a hound and I know these are often much harder to train to recall and many never make it off the lead as when they find a scent, it's game over! Mine is only 13 weeks, great recall at home and garden but have not tried in the park yet, but I see her find a scent and just know there is no getting her away from that!

Hi @Orangebadger I have a beagle! His recall is selective but I know where is safe to let him off now and he's a lot better than he was when he was younger (he's five) - he's also much better in groups of dogs that have good recall as he'll follow them rather than the scent.

I'd really recommend joining Kellie Wynn's page on Facebook - she's a trainer and specialises in beagles/hounds and she has some amazing advice.

Oh thank you for that. I will look her up. Yes I have known of hounds improving their recall as they get older. I guess all the new scents aren't as exciting anymore! I have met a few other young puppies ( not hounds or terriers, mostly gun dogs) off lead in the park. But I imagine as they've very young they're recall is great. Luckily my hound is food motivated. So I am hoping I can find something tasty enough to work with while out!

I think you already have loads of good advice, but just wanted to offer some reassurance. We have a nearly 2 year old super bouncy, super friendly lab goldie cross and training recall with distractions was so hard but we've got there - just about. I would say most of it was just her getting older.

We were down on the beach today with tons of other people and dogs and balls and yes she did veer off to say hello to a few but she came back when called and she wasn't a nuisance to anyone. Also I wasn't a bundle of nerves about the embarrassment of trying to catch her.

What worked for me to get her more chilled out about walking past dogs, was to use lots of eye contact and feed her lots of treats, then give loads of praise and more treats for a successful walk past. I started doing walks where the whole focus was about walking past dogs with pockets full of hotdog sausages to keep her focused on me.

Another thought, does your dog get playtime with other dogs? Ours goes to daycare so she gets to have a mad play with her friends and so gets that need out her system. That is my take anyway!

I think I gave myself a really hard time about us not having perfect recall but when I see owners with puppies and young dogs now, I have tons of empathy and can see they are trying their hardest and learning and it is a process. Good luck!

He had amazing recall until about five-six months, then scents became MUCH more interesting and he ended up on a lead for a long time

Now he goes off in select places (mainly the beach) or with other, trustworthy dogs and I have a supply of cheese and sausage in my pockets at all times!

Lots of useful tips on this thread, so thank you from another lab (6 months old) owner. We’ve just started taking RiverPup to sone local orchards and practising recall on long line. Wished we started earlier. Bit nervous though that when he hits teen, all this hard workplace will be wasted.

Last dog was a terrier cross hound. Fabulous recall. She was a rescue too 🙂 I teach agility and we teach hounds. Ok like terriers you have to work that but harder but the hounds have had more reliable recall than most of the spaniels tbh.

Honestly, it won't be wasted.

Build the foundations now and keep going even when they ignore you - they do come out the other side, and it's SO worth it.

Won’t be wasted in the end. It will probably go wappy though but it comes back IME. The people who struggle after adolescence didn’t do anything before it. We’ve been staying with my in-laws who are old school and very disapproving that we kept feeding her treats for coming back. Their dog had no recall. I know which I prefer.

Ahh thanks again everyone, I'm feeling much more positive. @ilovesushi he goes to doggy daycare once a week, where he's off lead and fine, with great recall apparently! I think he's probably just chasing around with the other dogs, and they're the most exciting thing to him so he comes back when they come back. At least he does get that exciting time once a week.

You need to keep at the training, if he doesn't return immediately take action to get him back etc.

By 8 months recall should be very good. You are right to be concerned, take advice from a trainer

@SirChenjins are you sure it was a footpath? On Forestry Commission land there are loads of mountain bike trails. There is an expectation that MTB users of FC trails will watch out for other trail users inc dogs. On the wide tracks which are usually also designated bridleways that's straightforward. But at some FC sites it's harder as they have graded harder MTB trails so people can go much faster downhill on technical trails. My dog knows to just follow me off the path not run along on the path or she risks being run over. Usually they are quite well sign-posted, but cyclists will usually shout or ring a bell to alert other users if they are going to bomb out of a path in front of you. I appreciate that doesn't work if you have hearing difficulties but it's worth being aware the Forestry Commission allow MTB on most of their sites so it's going to be an issue whenever you visit one. The NT don't allow MTB so you might find it easier letting your dog off-lead on NT land.

Very normal for recall to go at this age and can take a year to return until then dog must be kept on long line. Do not allow the dog to ignore. Take it to a secure dog park to practise.

Yep, it was on the Woodland Trust website listed as as Forestry Commission Scotland woods, and not listed as a MBT, I’ve just rechecked the website. It was flat (one of the people coming off the track that we met at the start walked with sticks so that gives you an indication of the type of path it was) - definitely not a mountain bike trail. I wouldn’t have walked on it if it was. The bloke was in the usual Lycra gear and we passed him on the road home - it was a road bike, not a mountain bike. No-one should have been cycling at the kind of speed he was going at on the type of path it was, esp when he had clear sight of us and could see and off lead dog.

@SirChenjins fair enough. The Scottish ones are more hardcore so it would have been pretty obvious! In England they are easier to confuse, especially as because the NT don't allow MTB and own a lot more land there's a long history of err slightly creative development by MTB-ers on FC land in England (cough). They should not have been shooting past anyone then let alone someone with a dog.

Yes, they’re pretty tough going here, definitely way beyond my cycling abilities! The track would have been great for an easy pootle on a bike, but even at that it’s important to be aware of other path users and adjust your speed accordingly immediately - which this man didn’t sadly. Thank god our recall training worked on this occasion.

Hi op. I am in a very, very similar position. We have a nearly 8 month old golden doodle. Really friendly, loves other dogs and humans but has started behaving exactly as you have described.

I only let him off the lead on his early morning walk in a place where i know the other dogs and owners. I have high value treats - chicken, bits of sausage and i save these for recall training. I don't currently let him off elsewhere due to the rubbish recall and his tenancy to bound up to strangers and runners. I don't use a long line though as he hates, refuses to move and chews through it.

Patience and persistence. Someone up thread said that you have to be more exciting to him than anything else going on - i v much agree.

This us what we are working towards!

There's some excellent advice on here already.

I'd just add that it helped us greatly to change my mindset. Instead of thinking that the whistle means 'come here ' I thought of it as meaning 'the super duper treat station is now open if you want to come and collect'. This really helped me focus on whether he was too distracted to hear, whether I was offering treats of higher value than anything else he could be doing, etc. You can even start with no recall at all, blow the whistle, give a treat, repeat till he knows that whistle means extra special treats are about to come his way. If you then move away from him and blow it again he can work out for himself that he'll have to come to you to get one.

With other cues I move on to intermittent rewards but with recall I always, always treat and if I inadvertently blow the whistle when I haven't got anything to hand I make a big song and dance about going to get something.

Having said that, my dogs recall reliably to the whistle but they recall like speeding bullets to the whispered words 'chicken wings'.😄

To everyone who’s using a whistle - do you recall using your voice as well? My concern is that I’d forget the whistle or would lose valuable time getting the whistle to my mouth and blowing.

My dog definitely was of the opinion that she was the one that had been training me.

She doesn't do it any more as we've pretty much dispensed with treats, but when she was younger and still using treats, as soon as we got a little way into the park she'd stop, sit down and wait for me to walk on a while. I'd then call her and she would happily rush to me for a treat.

She did it at least a couple of times every time we went to the park, and sure enough it worked every time; she knew she'd trained me well.

@SirChenjinsWe use whistle or voice, we used a high pitched ‘what’sthis’ from her first days with us and she would run back for a treat, and introduced the whistle later. She’s reliable with both (she’s 8 now) so we’re covered if we forget the whistle.