On-lead dog bitten again. What’s the ‘etiquette’ here?

[SirChenjins]

Short of shouting at the owner to get their fucking dog on a fucking lead? Which obviously I don’t want to do and make things worse while I have an anxious dog on my hands.

That’s three times now that on-lead one year old ChenPup has been bitten. Once when another off lead dog came up to him and dropped his ball right under him. CP went to sniff it and the other dog lost it - apparently “she doesn’t like other dogs taking her ball”. Another off lead one snapped and bit - they were happily sniffing each other and then, bam. Apparently this dog “doesn’t like on-lead dogs”. Today, another on-lead dog came up to CP - we’re doing some desensitisation training as he’s become a bit reactive (no bloody wonder), so he was sitting quietly a little distance away and was watching this other dog just fine - no reaction, all good. Again, happily sniffing at each other and then the other dog lost it - growling, barking, lunging and then the fog went to bite. Fortunately nothing serious, but of course he then became very anxious so I had to up the desensitisation training to calm him down on the remainder of our walk.

Each time the owner has been v apologetic (the last one perhaps not as much as I’d be) if it had been my dog behaving that way - if you know your dog is a “grumpy sod” then don’t perhaps walk him off lead?) but what the hell do I do here? We live in an area that’s semi rural and v popular with dog owners, (they’re not lockdown dogs, they’re older dogs and older owners - the lady one lives very locally, I know who she is) and I’m not going to stop walking him obviously - but it’s getting to the point that I’m on edge every time I go out. Is this just something I have to accept as part and parcel of owning a dog?

Apologies for the long ramble.

I used to have a dog. He became reactive because of reasons like this. Sorry I have no advice. It was a complete and utter nightmare

No it is not something you have to accept. As soon as their dog starts coming over shout “please call you dog” or “Please don’t let your dog near mine”.
It is an offence to not have your dog under control. I would be reporting the one that bit my dog if I knew where they lived. I hate irresponsible dog owners, and that includes ones that let their extendable leads wrap around your legs because, you know, they can’t control the animal on a 2 meter lead.

www.gov.uk/control-dog-public
”Out of control
Your dog is considered dangerously out of control if it:

injures someone
makes someone worried that it might injure them
A court could also decide that your dog is dangerously out of control if either of the following apply:

it attacks someone’s animal
the owner of an animal thinks they could be injured if they tried to stop your dog attacking their animal”

The only answer is for shitty dog owners to put there dog on a lead

You shouldn't have to do this but can you take a tennis racket with you? Not to hit the other dog but to provide a barrier between the two dogs until the owner takes control. Saves you getting bit too.

oh nvm sorry. Was assuming off lead dogs ran up to yours then i read your post properly.

I honestly don’t think I’d get very far reporting the last one - dog on dog attacks aren’t taken seriously at all, and I know from some of the fog pages I’m on on Facebook that even when a dog sustains really serious injuries the courts don’t seem to want to know. I’ll just make sure from now on that I’ll tell her from now on to keep her dog away from mine. It’s so bloody frustrating - she’s part of a group who walk their 7 dogs three times a dog, mostly off lead, so I have to time it v carefully - I just got it wrong today. The rest are v nice and well behaved, I have to say, but after today I’m now very distrustful of them.

Because it’s such a popular area for dogs it’s a common occurrence for off lead dogs to come up to CP (who’s kept on lead because his recall is atrocious and he’s becoming quite reactive), and whilst the vast vast majority are ok it just takes one (or rather, 3 so far). I’m so angry at the moment.

Definitely ask the owner to put their dog on the lead. I find if a dog approaches and the owner isn’t there or just not being aware I put my hand out and firmly say No - usually stops approaching dog in it’s tracks. I don’t care if the owner doesn’t like it - I am protecting my own, or clients, dog.
Can you get a yellow lead - a yellow lead signifies a nervous dog, or a dog that needs space. Unfortunately some people are just clueless I do despair at times!

He’s got a yellow lead and harness!!

Im a dog owner so I see this a lot but Im afraid what I will say is going to be unpopular. You are your dogs advocate. You decide situations that do and dont happen. You know he has been bitten three times now so that tells me you have failed to step in, stop or avoid. Sorry but you are failing your dog, do not allow other dogs access to your dog or else go somewhere where there are no dogs. You cannot desensitise a dog if you fail to stop biting happening. Imagine if you were a dog and everytime your lead went on it might signify you might get attacked with nobody stopping it and being unable to escape. Step up and get assertive or else dont have a dog.

I always ask them to get their dog under control and to put it on a lead. I use my body to block any off leash approaches and turn my dog away. I have picked him up and walked away with him before, he's 17 kgs so not easy.

I hate the 'don't worry he's quite friendly' brigade of dog owners. Every time my dog has been attacked its been by a 'friendly' dog, always a labrador and the owner is always surprised 🙄😡 🤬

If this was happening to me so often I think id start carrying one of those dog deterrent sprays on walks.

I don't let my dog greet unknown dogs while he's on his lead. IMO it's a recipe for disaster. I would stop letting your dog greet these dogs full-stop. He really doesn't need to say hello to every dog that comes over.

If other dogs approach, I call out and ask the owners to recall their dog as mine is reactive and scared. If they don't (or can't), I move my dog to the side of the path/road/behind a bush and put myself in between the two dogs and firmly tell the other dog to leave. Chucking treats behind the approaching dog can also encourage them to turn away, which gives you a chance to move your dog on.

I also carry a spare lead and if the above doesn't work, I have no issues with grabbing the strange dog, leashing it and returning it to it's owner if they can't retrieve it themselves. I had to do it the other day when a young puppy approached us. The puppy was fine - just playful and with poor recall but I still grabbed her and returned her to her very grateful but embarrassed owner

Yes. And I would be shouting ‘Get your dog back or I will spray it’

Thats exactly what the OP should do. Not every dog is allowed to say hello.

You should be able to walk your dog on a lead without being approached by other dogs. The only real way out of this situation is to walk in quieter areas. Has your dog been neutered? Mine isn't (show dog) and he can sometime elicit bad behaviour from other dogs just be virtue of being entire.

Mine is always on lead but if I see another dog wander up I just shout and say mines not friendly and ask them to recall. I don't even give them the chance to get close enough for an incident. People seem more cooperative and quicker to react if I suggest that my dog is the problem and that I'm doing them a favour. Mines not reactive, just very big and bouncy and although not prone to starting fights he would happily finish them given the chance. If he's had a slow introduction to another dog he's fine!

No he hasn’t been neutered, he’s booked for an implant at the end of January when he’s 17 months old.

I’ve tried most of the above - keep him into the side or change direction and create distance (where he’s quite happy to watch them go by), I tell people he’s reactive and ask them to keep them away, I stand between them and put treats on the ground so he snuffles for them, and if so can’t do that I try and keep him moving (difficult when an off lead dog is already sniffing at his bum and he’s distracted by it). Very hard when the owner is so far away they can’t get to their dog in time to call it away and their dog comes up to mine.

It’s so fucking frustrating though - that’s three dogs whose owners know their dogs have issues with other dogs and still insist on walking them off-lead, and Im the one doing all the training and interventions.

Stick to places other dogs have to be on leads for a while to take the stress away
sounds silly but garden centres are good, national trust gardens etc lots to see but you won’t get random dogs coming up

Try and find a friend with a nice dog he can say hi to but also agree he doesn’t need to say hello

I would also get a spray (compressed air etc.) and tell people to get there dog or you’ll have to use it. And absolutely be your dogs advocate and do not let other dogs come over
agree with throwing treats to distract the other dog away. And physically blocking the other dog

its such a pita that so many idiots aren’t responsible dog owners

Sorry that should read
Try and find a friend with a nice dog he can say hi to but also agree he doesn’t need to say hello To every dog he meets

For now, I would stick to pavement walks where dogs have to be on lead and where it's generally much easier to avoid other dogs.

I know it's dull for you, but I think it's important to keep him away from other dogs for now and allow his adrenaline levels to come down. If he keeps meeting dogs and getting bitten or attacked, he will just get worse himself.

My dog is off lead whenever practical, but if he is on lead and there are off lead dogs around, traffic/livestock permitting, I'll let him off lead to say hello.

Most dogs, even well socialised ones, don't particularly like meeting other dogs whilst either or both are on lead, and are prone to reacting unpredictably.

Assuming your dog isn't a major flight risk, this approach might be worth a try.

Also, when you say your dog has been attacked 3 times, are you talking about actual bites, or just a lot of dramatic noise. Older dogs put younger dogs in their place, it's normal.

I agree about being your dogs advocate.

It is not right and you should have a right to walk your dog where you want however I do always avoid the dog walking areas. I will drive to quiet places to walk rather than walk from the door to get to quiet areas.

I never let my dogs meet dogs that I do not know. It will be a cheery wave and turn in the other direction. I will stand between my dogs and approaching dogs if we get the timing wrong or they get to close. This rarely happens as I have the luxury of choosing quiet dog walking times and locations.

I think I will have to revert back to pavement walking for a while or use the dog park - which is so fucking infuriating because we live right next to woods and trails and a stream, and walking there brings me so much joy and happiness (I suffer from depression - under control at the moment, but it’s always a worry). He goes to a dog walker once a week, we go to a breed meet up regularly and we have doggy friends we meet with so he’s socialised. I just wish other dog owners who know their dogs have issues would keep their dogs on bloody leads - although I know that’s not going to happen!

@RIPWalter - I’ve already explained his recall is non existent and yes, he’s a flight risk. Not just dramatic noise sadly. If you (as in the generic you, not you specifically) know your off-lead dog reacts unpredictability to on-lead dogs then you need to keep it on a lead, or put in on a lead when you see an on-lead dog, or walk it at times when other dogs on- leads (who are being walked perfectly appropriately) aren’t around.

You can either get a yellow lead or a yellow sleeve to go on your lead which says" Reactive No Dogs" Also being really assertive I'm afraid. "My dog is not friendly, so please, call your dog"
I find this works. However, people should put their dogs on leads & move away when approaching your on lead dog.

It is gutting and I feel angry that you should have to make such major adjustments just because of other peoples selfishness.

Trying not to be too much of a pollyanna but we have found some amazing deserted walks because of looking for quiet areas. We now have a portfolio of save, beautiful peaceful locations. I do hope this is the case for you.