Spaying

[LIC1985]

Wise mumsnet.

We will shortly be getting a lovely girl pup to join our family

Currently we have a boy who we rescued and we neutered him as part of that process and prior to that we have only had boys so always had them neutered as soon as vets recommend

I mentioned getting girl neutered when she's old enough to a friend and a friend suggestion she would only do a female spaying if really needed as it's a major op.

I had just assumed it was what we would do but would now love to know opinion on females and if you spay your female young like you do you boys ?

Thank you.

From my perspective I would definitely spay. You really do not need a dog who regularly goes in heat and who you have to be super careful to keep away from other dogs. Combined with her bleeding and having to use dog pads. It is not fair on her.

Besides, I believe they use keyhole surgery now to spay. (?)

It is the only responsible thing to do IMO. We have had 4 female dogs and all have been spayed. I have a friend who did not spay hers because she hoped to breed from her and it really was a total pain. The dog who was quite shy absolutely hated attention from other dogs when she was on heat, and became anxious and nervy to the point she was unable to be walked outside their own property.

But it might be worth talking to your vet when you get the puppy and get their veiws.

Thank you so much! That was my gut to but it's been so long since we have had a girl I wanted to check.

Will absolutely get vets advice also when she's arrived .

A girl in heat does not sound fun

It's a big op, yes, but not the same as a hysterectomy for a human in terms of recovery, if that's the frame of reference that your friend is using. My bitch recovered from it extremely well and quickly and the relative benefits in terms of removing risk of reproductive cancers, pyometra, and unwanted pregnancies far outweigh the few days rest and discomfort that your dog will have. My bitch was bouncing about ready to tear around as usual 3 days after hers. I obviously kept her quiet, but it was a struggle because she obviously felt fine. You can also pay more for keyhole surgery if you're concerned, we considered it but there was a massive waiting list.

I wouldn't listen to your friend.

That's great thank you! So glad your girl was a quick recovery

I am just about to get my girl spayed. I have waited because I do think dogs need to mature before they are spayed but she’s coming up to 2 and has had two seasons. Some people spay at 6 months and depending on the breed I think that’s too young. There is good info on the internet but you have to sift through it a bit.

A bitch that regularly comes into season is a messy, moody liability as a family pet and as pp have said, there are considerable health risks attached to not spaying.
Having said that, I would only spay when my dog has finished growing and had one season as there is a risk of osteosarcoma associated with spaying too early for the breed I have.
If you’re looking for keyhole spaying then check the vet you use/are planning to use does it. My vet doesn’t offer it, despite being a bigger practice than the other vet locally who does offer it.
It is a fairly big operation but recovery time passes quickly and the biggest challenge is stopping your dog bouncing all over the place before she should! Compared to rearranging walks, outings, daycare etc every 6 months or so for a season it’s a breeze, though.

Overall, spaying protects a bitch from pyometra, which can be quickly fatal. The risk of pyo varies by breed. On the other hand, spaying carries its own risks, in terms of the risks of spay incontinence and various cancers. There has been some scientific work done on this (Hart et al, published iirc about 2019) which gives guidance for age at neutering to maximise the benefits for each breed examined.

This only looked at physical outcomes and personally, on the basis of my own experience with both earlier and later neutering, I prefer my dogs to develop mentally and socially as well as physically before I remove a chunk of their endocrine systems. In general, small dogs mature earlier than large dogs.

Ultimately you have to decide what works for you and the dog, but it's worth being aware of both the costs and benefits of neutering to your dog's physical health.

What breed is your dog?
When did her mum first come into season?

Most vets recommend spaying at 6 months or after the first season. For a larger or very active breed, after two seasons may be more beneficial. Research and have an informed conversation with your vet.

Due to lockdowns, waiting lists and broken equipment our dog was done after 3 seasons. She had a lap spay and recovered from the operation quickly.

Spaying and neutering is fine as long as dog mature

Do not do it before 2 years old and she has had 3 seasons.

In males you should wait till 2 years old.

I wouldn’t be focused on having key hole surgery rather than traditional approach. For an experienced vet, the incision for traditional is barely larger in terms of recovery and comes with other advantages - it is much easier to see how the reproduction organs are configured (there is variation between individual dogs) and less risk of nicking another organ and easier to deal with any complications in the unlikely circumstance that any arise. I would have a chat with your vet about it.

I would have a family pet spayed for all the reasons pp have already listed.

I've just adopted my DM's ddog as my DM passed away .
Our vet has advised spaying her ( I've never had a dog before, didn't know anything about spaying).
Shes 7 yrs old but the vet has still advised spaying as it will stop her coming into season and avoid any potential future health issues.
Ddog is currently in season and tbh even though I've been around her all her life I didn't realise how distressed ddog is when she's in season, it's been horrible.
I was told by the vet to wait until she's been in season ( I didn't know roughly when she was last in season) then phone them,
which I'm going to do next week.

Absolutely spay! It's the only way to protect your dog from unwanted pups. Males will do literally anything to get to a female in season.

Our girl was sore and sorry for herself for a couple of days but bounced back very quickly after that.

The distress in season bitches suffer is nothing compared to the distress of a phantom pregnancy.

Dogs vary greatly.
My pointer had first season at 18 months and then 9 month gaps. Had a lap spay at three.
My friends chihuahua had first season at 5 months and four and a half month gaps. Traditional spay after second season, age one.

Ask loads of questions about mum so you have lots of information to base your decision on.

Honestly get her spayed - pyometra can kill them and there aren't that many signs for it .

They can do keyhole surgery now!! So if you can find a vet that does that it is much much less traumatic for the little one

Thanks so much everyone ! Def reassured me my original thoughts are correct

Will find out about mum and have a good chat to the vet to .

They can do keyhole / lap spays. Not on tiny dogs or overweight ones. Your vet can advise, plus if they find any problems or irregular anatomy they will revert to traditional methods. Vets like their patients alive and with the best outcome.

Research your dog and discuss with the vet.

Castrating dogs is not a black and white decision but spaying bitches is much easier decision. There are major benefits for Health and behavoural issues for the bithes.

It does depend on breed as to the time of spaying and the health implications to the bitches. This report is very highly valid and worth reading for timing of spaying in different breeds.
New Frontiers report on Spaying

Being spayed isn't as bad as major surgery for mammary cancer... Which won't be a risk after spaying. . Cancer surgery was over 2k. And lots of heartache..

I am just about to get my girl spayed. I have waited because I do think dogs need to mature before they are spayed but she’s coming up to 2 and has had two seasons. Some people spay at 6 months and depending on the breed I think that’s too young. There is good info on the internet but you have to sift through it a bit.

By waiting until after her 2nd season you've increased your dog's chances of developing mammary cancer from 0.5% to 26%.

Op get off the Internet and speak to your vet who has the qualifications and experience to advise you properly. Some of the advice of this thread is just plain wrong.

How come?
ours was from the Dogs Trust as a puppy, and they spayed for us as part of the adoption package at 6 months.
was about 15 years ago though

Different breeds suggest different ages. We have a saluki and was suggested we waited until she was 2.
Rescue dpuppy was 6 months years ago.

@Anonaymoose
onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1748-5827.2011.01220.x
A more up to date paper on mammary cancer, which is just one of many reasons for spaying.

Honestly, the mammary cancer stats are not clear cut, and they're not the only thing to consider. I looked into all this before spaying my older dog, particularly as a friend's dog had just been treated for it.

If you dig into the Hart et al study I mentioned above and which @Ivedonethisthreetimesalready has now linked to, the rates of MC are low, though they do say that it's a late-occuring cancer and perhaps if they had an older sample they'd find more of it.

The other cancers they looked for occur earlier in life and some of them have a poor prognosis. In some breeds, early neutering can increase the risk of joint disorders (hip dysplasia etc).

Your issues with delaying spaying are pyo, phantom pregnancies (not every bitch will have this), particularly in some breeds), the mess and the risk of pregnancy. If you have hard floors, the mess is minor. I live fairly rurally and have not had a problem exercising my dogs (out of the way places, out of the way times, longline).

If you choose to delay it, you might (depending on breed) reduce your dog's risk of certain cancers, urinary incontinence (there is a high risk of this in some breeds) and joint problems. You will also benefit from a dog whose skeleton develops properly and who matures mentally and socially. Smaller dogs mature faster, on the whole, so their minds and bodies get there more quickly and early spaying doesn't seem to be such an issue for them.

It's a balancing act with few clear answers, especially if your breed isn't on the Hart et al list.

Pyometra isn't pleasant either..