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The doghouse

If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

Our dog bit ds in the face and drew blood

309 replies

Differentusernametoday · 22/08/2022 13:19

please be kind, I am really shaken and need some support.

We have an 11 month old springer. We have a few issues with him, mostly anxiety related, and are waiting to see a behaviourist. I don’t trust him because he has growled at us before, and has bitten my hand and snapped at me, although to be fair both times I feel we’re partly my fault. This afternoon, he was on the sofa bed put down for guests - ds2saw him and told him to get off, apparently dog growled at him, ds tried to move him and dog bit his face and has drawn blood. Currently waiting in a&e now. Ds2 is devastated and knows he should not have tried to move him when he had already growled, and blames himself. I feel like I have reached the end of the road and I can’t live with a dog I don’t trust, but it will break ds3’s heart if we rehome him, but in some ways it will be a huge weight lifted. What would you do?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
plinkypots · 22/08/2022 15:41

I'd give the dog back to the breeder. If the breeder won't take the dog back you know half your problem already...spaniels are notably highly strung and need careful breeding by knowledgable responsible breeders. If the breeder won't take him back then you can try a spaniel specific rescue but please leave them with a very hefty donation. The dog won't be easy or cheap to sort out if it's even possible.

BotterMon · 22/08/2022 15:42

StopStartStop · 22/08/2022 14:17

The dog has to be put to sleep. Don't have any qualms about it.

Don't be so fucking ridiculous.

I would rehome OP for all your sakes, including the dog.

CrotchetyQuaver · 22/08/2022 15:42

I've been in this situation myself before and it's awful. I'm afraid you need to regime the dog, ideal no children or older teens and they need to be experienced dog owners.

BlackEyeSusan · 22/08/2022 15:43

You have my sympathy OP - I have been going through almost exactly the same thing.
Working Cocker spaniel, not quite two. Last year he bit my (adult) DD, not to blame her as he shouldn't have done it, but he had a chew, and we were already aware that he growls and guards chews and were working on training around that, but she bent down to kiss him and he bit her, catching her lip. She needed three stitches, (as well as antibiotics and tetanus obv) and the scars are barely visible now unless you are looking for them.
We rationalised he was only eight months, still a pup, lots of training to be done.
Soon after that we took him to the vet to be neutered, but the vet rang up and said he was guarding his cage and neutering could make his behaviour worse so she refused to do it.
Despite consistent training around guarding chews he has continued to do so. Only 3 or 4 weeks ago he had a chew, lying at my feet. I rubbed his tummy with my foot and he growled at me.
We had him neutered in the end about three months ago, as although he is never aggressive with other dogs, he wants to play, but doesn't back down when other dogs don't want to play and I was concerned he was developing dominant behaviours and could get in a fight which wouldn't really be his fault but might then lead to more aggressive behaviour. We have had him going out with a dog walker once a week so he gets a good walk with other dogs all on the lead, and I had thought that was improving his behaviour.
He did seem to be calming down a bit after neutering.
But two weeks ago he was asleep on the sofa with me sitting next to him. I bent over to cuddle him and he launched himself at my face biting my nose, I had cuts either side, one very close to my eye.
Headed off to A&E bleeding profusely. Heard someone say she'd been waiting ten hours as I walked in (late at night). Waited two hours to see triage nurse who confirmed they were superficial cuts and no stitches needed and I'd have to wait eight hours to be seen to get antibiotics and tetanus 🙄.
So I went home and went to my local minor injuries unit first thing in the morning where I had a short wait, efficient nurse and got the tetanus and antibiotics in a five minute consultation.
Had a long chat with the vet on my way home who offered to refer to a behaviourist but agreed rehoming was probably for the best.
Now I will say, I have never allowed dogs on the sofa before but this boy was such a cuddly puppy, I couldn't resist. And I recognise, for some dogs at least and he is one of those dogs, not allowing the dog on the sofa is not just about dirt, but much more about pack position, and he needed to know his place. Also that old saying "let sleeping dogs lie". Maybe I just startled him.

What ever, I cannot trust him again, and the next bite could be much worse. Although my adult DDs are nowhere near planning for babies, it has been at the back of my mind before this that if a grandchild came along, I'd have to send the dog to kennels or something every time they came to stay.

We all agreed he is a working dog, he came from a game keeper and working stock. We have found a home with a local gamekeeper. I feel so sad, thinking how he must be missing cuddles and toys and treats, he must be so confused, but I know he will respond better to having just one trainer, and the company of other dogs and lots of work. So far he seems pleased with him and says he is loving going out with the dogs, comes back well (he has good recall to the whistle, he's a good dog in many ways) and I know I made the right decision. He's an incredibly energetic dog, the only time he has been tired and settled in the evening has been on holiday in Cornwall with lots of swimming all day.
Two hours a day isn't enough for him, he needs to be on the go all the time and he's getting that now.

So I sympathise OP, but you know what you have to do. There will be a good home for him out there, he's only a young dog with lots of potential for a good life, but away from children.

Springblossom2022 · 22/08/2022 15:44

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

AM453 · 22/08/2022 15:44

Haffiana · 22/08/2022 15:37

Christ. The dog nutters on MN are unbelievable. "It wasn't the dogs fault".

It DOESN'T MATTER WHOSE FAULT IT WAS. A dog can kill a child and if it thinks it has the right to bite when asked to get off a sofa, then it needs getting rid of.

I don't get how this is so hard to understand to be honest

finalpunt · 22/08/2022 15:45

Notmytiep · 22/08/2022 14:22

Don't care what kind of bite your're calling it, doesn't change the fact. Not the first time and it wont be the last.

OP you know what to do, get rid of that dog now.

I do get what JenGin is saying, we have a german spitz mix. He has territorial aggression and is head shy so if you don't know him and stroke his head he would bite you, not to attack but to warn you to get off and don't touch me again. That said a bite is also a bite.

He is 12 now and I have 3 GC aged 2.5YO to 10MO. He has never met them because when they come over he is shut in our bedroom. Even if oldest stays with us they are kept completely separately both for sake of dog and dc's.

If I had them have to live with me full time then as much as I love my dog he would have to go - it is not fair on either the dog or the children in scenarios like this.

LakieLady · 22/08/2022 15:49

Justasec321 · 22/08/2022 14:44

JenGin this is nonsense.

The dog should leave.

Spaniels have form for this. they are a working dog and should be …working.

I agree.

Rehome him via a Springer or working spaniel specific rescue, where they will know exactly what they are dealing with.

Springers need to work, imo, or live in a home where they will be given loads of exercise and stimulation with hunt and retrieve type games.

Meraas · 22/08/2022 15:52

I don’t trust him because he has growled at us before, and has bitten my hand and snapped at me

And yet still allowed your child alone with him.

EvilTendency1 · 22/08/2022 15:54

Oh gosh, I hope your DS2 is OK OP.

I've had dogs for many years and whilst I have over the years been bitten once, it was entirely my fault for startling the older dog.

I too wouldn't be keeping the dog, I would be looking to rehome it to a child free home, but please do look at breed specific rescues, they should be able to help.

Much as I love DDog who is laying next to my feet now, he is young and whilst he's never growled or snapped...if DDog bit my DC in the face and drew blood? Then as bereft as I would be, he'd be PTS. I wouldn't rehome him, but that's because I know HIM quite well, I train him, work and handle him each day, so I know him and he knows me. So if he bit, there would have to be a bloody good reason for it, such as pain.

I'm sorry this has happened to you and your family OP :(

BlackEyeSusan · 22/08/2022 15:56

Also re: working cocker spaniels, I am friendly with a doggy lady who has helped me with training before, and who does dog trials etc so knows loads of people who have working dogs.

Some extracts from an email conversation I had with her about our dog:

"Oh dear, I'm so sorry about xxx. I got bitten by a cocker two years ago, I was amazed at my reaction - fear, shaking etc. And he just got my hand as I was patting him. My fault as I was there to see what they could do re biting. He's still there but always has a mask when I see him walking with them.

I think I told you that I talked to my vet, wonderful RB, when xxxx bit DD and he told me there were loads of working cockers with the same behavioural problems including biting as Xxx. I had no idea.

Both (another dog trainer) and my vet say there is a very serious problem with cockers' temperaments. It's in the breeding. It's nothing to do with being working dogs, it's in the blood.

I have had about 12 cockers over nearly 50 years and never ever had a problem but I've always known the breeding."

Certainly our boy is a very different temperament to our last working cocker, who was a bitch, and wonderful with children. Not so wonderful at coming back when there was a pheasant population to decimate though Hmm

VacayingInTheHamptons · 22/08/2022 15:56

AM453 · 22/08/2022 15:44

I don't get how this is so hard to understand to be honest

It does matter in terms of OP understanding that her child being injured was preventable by keeping her children and the dog separate or even to tell the children to not continue their behaviour when the dog growls. The behaviourist may have been able to stop the dogs behaviour and everyone live happily. It’s also important that OP understands that she is not responsible enough to have another dog.

Booklover3 · 22/08/2022 15:57

I have a dog OP but if mine acted like yours I would 100% either rehome or have the dog PTS. I’m really sorry

StridTheKiller · 22/08/2022 15:59

Dd was bitten by a friend's Shitzu, she just bent down to pet it and it took a chunk out of her hand.
Though this was no fault of hers, or mine, the OOH clinic had to report to Social Services, who were utter cunts and made me feel like the shittest parent ever. Just warning you that the decision might be taken out of your hands as to what you need to do with the DDog.

Hoppinggreen · 22/08/2022 16:01

BlackEyeSusan · 22/08/2022 15:43

You have my sympathy OP - I have been going through almost exactly the same thing.
Working Cocker spaniel, not quite two. Last year he bit my (adult) DD, not to blame her as he shouldn't have done it, but he had a chew, and we were already aware that he growls and guards chews and were working on training around that, but she bent down to kiss him and he bit her, catching her lip. She needed three stitches, (as well as antibiotics and tetanus obv) and the scars are barely visible now unless you are looking for them.
We rationalised he was only eight months, still a pup, lots of training to be done.
Soon after that we took him to the vet to be neutered, but the vet rang up and said he was guarding his cage and neutering could make his behaviour worse so she refused to do it.
Despite consistent training around guarding chews he has continued to do so. Only 3 or 4 weeks ago he had a chew, lying at my feet. I rubbed his tummy with my foot and he growled at me.
We had him neutered in the end about three months ago, as although he is never aggressive with other dogs, he wants to play, but doesn't back down when other dogs don't want to play and I was concerned he was developing dominant behaviours and could get in a fight which wouldn't really be his fault but might then lead to more aggressive behaviour. We have had him going out with a dog walker once a week so he gets a good walk with other dogs all on the lead, and I had thought that was improving his behaviour.
He did seem to be calming down a bit after neutering.
But two weeks ago he was asleep on the sofa with me sitting next to him. I bent over to cuddle him and he launched himself at my face biting my nose, I had cuts either side, one very close to my eye.
Headed off to A&E bleeding profusely. Heard someone say she'd been waiting ten hours as I walked in (late at night). Waited two hours to see triage nurse who confirmed they were superficial cuts and no stitches needed and I'd have to wait eight hours to be seen to get antibiotics and tetanus 🙄.
So I went home and went to my local minor injuries unit first thing in the morning where I had a short wait, efficient nurse and got the tetanus and antibiotics in a five minute consultation.
Had a long chat with the vet on my way home who offered to refer to a behaviourist but agreed rehoming was probably for the best.
Now I will say, I have never allowed dogs on the sofa before but this boy was such a cuddly puppy, I couldn't resist. And I recognise, for some dogs at least and he is one of those dogs, not allowing the dog on the sofa is not just about dirt, but much more about pack position, and he needed to know his place. Also that old saying "let sleeping dogs lie". Maybe I just startled him.

What ever, I cannot trust him again, and the next bite could be much worse. Although my adult DDs are nowhere near planning for babies, it has been at the back of my mind before this that if a grandchild came along, I'd have to send the dog to kennels or something every time they came to stay.

We all agreed he is a working dog, he came from a game keeper and working stock. We have found a home with a local gamekeeper. I feel so sad, thinking how he must be missing cuddles and toys and treats, he must be so confused, but I know he will respond better to having just one trainer, and the company of other dogs and lots of work. So far he seems pleased with him and says he is loving going out with the dogs, comes back well (he has good recall to the whistle, he's a good dog in many ways) and I know I made the right decision. He's an incredibly energetic dog, the only time he has been tired and settled in the evening has been on holiday in Cornwall with lots of swimming all day.
Two hours a day isn't enough for him, he needs to be on the go all the time and he's getting that now.

So I sympathise OP, but you know what you have to do. There will be a good home for him out there, he's only a young dog with lots of potential for a good life, but away from children.

Why the heck would you give a dog that resource guarded chews a chew?

VacayingInTheHamptons · 22/08/2022 16:02

Meraas · 22/08/2022 15:52

I don’t trust him because he has growled at us before, and has bitten my hand and snapped at me

And yet still allowed your child alone with him.

I find it mind blowing really.

My children and my dogs are the most precious things in the world to me. I can’t imagine taking such risks and being so irresponsible that would mean my children could get injured or my dogs having to be rehomed or pts. You keep them separate until it’s sorted with the behaviourist. If the dog is truly a risk to children and the dogs behaviour can not be solved, you rehome because there is no alternative. I feel so sorry for the kids and dog here, the child being hurt, the trauma of rehoming on the kids and the dog, all probably unnecessary if OP had done things right.

mattressspring · 22/08/2022 16:07

To those saying I ignored the warnings - I didn’t,

Yes you did. Otherwise you would not have put your child in a position where he could get bitten.

Capri3 · 22/08/2022 16:09

Redburnett · 22/08/2022 14:40

I think a biting dog such as yours should be PTS. Please do not inflict a nervous anxious dog that reacts by biting on anyone else.

This.

You have said that your dog has growled at you, snapped at you, and bitten your hand. It has now also bitten your child’s face. Sadly it’s very unlike that your dog will not bite anyone else in future.

neilyoungismyhero · 22/08/2022 16:10

Justasec321 · 22/08/2022 14:44

JenGin this is nonsense.

The dog should leave.

Spaniels have form for this. they are a working dog and should be …working.

Good God what planet are you on? A bite is a bite is a bite.... end of.

LadyPenelope68 · 22/08/2022 16:12

Dog bites child - dog goes, no second chances, no excuses, it could have been very serious and life changing. There is no way your child should be blaming themselves.

LadyPenelope68 · 22/08/2022 16:13

Goes as in PTS not just rehomed.

IVFNewbie · 22/08/2022 16:15

Don't have the dog PTS (talk about disposable society) but do consider rehoming or at least isolating from your kids until you see the behaviourist.

Springdaisy · 22/08/2022 16:15

StopStartStop · 22/08/2022 14:17

The dog has to be put to sleep. Don't have any qualms about it.

This is nonsense. Its a young dog and can be trained and have a long happy life in the right family.
I would definitely think about rehoming though. It sounds like he is very stressed out in your home.

I dont think all dogs who bite need to be rehomed. My son also got bit by our dog once. He was running in the house, tripped over the dog and landed on top of him. Dog snapped backwards and got his cheek.

I definitely would have rehomed if it was a big dog, simply because its way too dangerous. But our dog was quite small and in that instance i really felt she wasnt at fault.

We kept her and she lived for several years with us afterwards without any incidents.
in your case however, it seems to be happening a lot and if you cant trust her at all, then its probably best to find a new, more suitable home.

User1113 · 22/08/2022 16:15

JFC this thread. People kissing resource guarding dogs who have been given access to the thing they guard, and cuddling sleeping dogs with a history of biting... I know lots of MN hate dogs but really the owners are the problem 90% of the time. Pack theory has been debunked fgs.

@Duettino Please don't use Southend Dog Training, he uses aversives. Find a positive reinforcement trainer, it's much kinder and just as effective (possibly more so, it might just take more time and effort)

TeeBee · 22/08/2022 16:19

JenGin · 22/08/2022 13:56

It should also be noted that this was not at "attack" bite. The dog wasn't going out of its way to harm anyone. If a dog really wants to attack then the injuries you described would be far far worse. It was done out of nervousness/anxiety/fear. So you don't have a dangerous, aggressive dog, you have a dog with some issues that can be worked on. It's just about whether you have the time and patience for this and in the mean time needing to be more cautious around your dog than you signed up for. From what I gather your dog isn't going to go on a rampage attacking everyone in sight - it just needs to left along when it's showing telltale signs until its issues have been addressed and worked on.

Time and patience? Or don't mind your child being bitten further or scarred while you experiment with an aggressive dog.
Utter tosh. The dog needs to go. A house with a child is not a place for an adult to play dog behaviourist. Children come before pets.