Border collie for first time dog owner?

[zippyswife]

I have never owned a dog and don’t know much about them.
Dh has owned a dog but works so the training and excercise etc will be down to me.

I’d love to get a dog. I have the time (work part time one day a week which is usually from home). I excercise daily- either walk run or both- generally in woodlands or fields. I have 3 children; 6,9,11.

I love the physical appearance of the border collie, and from what I read tends to be easier to train than some. I see that it requires a lot of exercise, but I believe I can commit to that.

Is a border collie too full on for someone like me- an inexperienced owner/with children?

Ideally I’d like a dog that makes a great pet- good and gentle with children/easy to train/enjoys activity and excercise. Is this a border collie or am I seriously off the mark here?

I’m not someone that usually goes on appearances but I just can’t help being drawn to these! I know I sound superficial- and normally I’m not.

Any working breed dog is likely to end up a project, rather than a pet imo. Brilliant if you want that and have the skills to provide the right environment, but damn hard work if you don’t.

Either you need to give it the time to mentally stimulate it, take it to classes, train it as well as the lengthy walks or, if you don’t, the dog will likely have behavioural issues due to those needs not being met. This will be an ongoing commitment, it’s not just a case of training it and it’s job done - a bored working dog will be difficult and miserable.

There will be exceptions to these rules of course, but that would be the expected norm and there is no telling what you will get in terms of working drive ahead of time, so it’s best to assume you will get one at the high end of the spectrum

Labs and retrievers look like good options for you maybe?

My collie mix was amazing with my daughter and so well trained (by previous owner, can't claim credit) so she was a doddle....but still had all the collie anxiety traits etc so had to be carefully managed around fireworks or when left alone. Maybe see if a rescue near you has any collie mixs in? Even if you aren't up for a rescue, the website descriptions of personality traits and home setup preferred is usually spot on for each breed so worth a look to narrow it down for you.

You've def made the right decision, Border Collies are my favourite breed but not for the faint hearted

I have a collie. She sleeps a lot and is chill. She got few walks when we had covid and she didn’t make a fuss and she’s still young. She has farm dog parents. BUT she can get obsessive (balls) and doesn’t make friends (will tell other dogs to fuck off basically) Lockdown didn’t help but in general I think collies can be a bit highly strung and I wouldn’t recommend it as a first time dog but they aren’t all crazy either

Show cocker spaniel. Not working.

They're still fun, love their exercise and great characters but tend to be less fizzy and on the go as their working counterparts.

Spaniels are generally great with kids, and big on the cuddle front. Mine spends every evening snuggled up.

@Yotrotro

Labs and retrievers look like good options for you maybe?

My collie mix was amazing with my daughter and so well trained (by previous owner, can't claim credit) so she was a doddle....but still had all the collie anxiety traits etc so had to be carefully managed around fireworks or when left alone. Maybe see if a rescue near you has any collie mixs in? Even if you aren't up for a rescue, the website descriptions of personality traits and home setup preferred is usually spot on for each breed so worth a look to narrow it down for you.

Show lines, I would agree.

Working lines and you get many of the same types of issues as with a collie. My working line goldie would definitely not have coped in inexperienced hands and I would say the same for many of the working labs I have met

A lab will be easier to train and probably be less needy

A sheltie will need a lot of stimulation and exercise

My family have had 4. They had #1 when I was very little then got #2 when I was 10yrs old. They aren't great with kids typically - herd them and can be highly anxious and quite fear aggressive (2 of our 4 you couldn't trust around a child). They aren't typically very playful (ball obsessed but that's a bit different - only 1 of our 4 interactive and playful) and often one-person dogs (2 of our 4 cuddlebugs, the other 2 only interested in my dad). We love them but I don't think they are right for your circumstances

I have a half collie/ lab
She's a fantastic dog... but my god she clever!
Lots of training required and playing/ training on and so we go on

I do feel for her being a family dog, she really doesn't get enough stimulation.

Hopefully she has enough lab to make her a bit lazy...
collies can be obsessive if they don't get enough stimulation!

Probably best that you rethink the collie, I’ve had several and adore them but they are hard work!

Chilled and loving cuddles? Greyhound. I know that it’s considered the default answer to all dog queries on mumsnet but they are genuinely chilled. Mine has had two half hour walks today and is currently lying on teen DS’s feet hoping for pizza crusts. He’ll snooze until 9pm, then wake up for bedtime snakes on his snuffle mat.

I have 2 from working parents and they are fantastic dogs and perfect with my toddler - there is certainly no nipping.
Mine love a long run through the forest but love curling up on the sofa almost as much. I'm a first time pet owner and haven't regretted a minute (other than when they have rolled in animal poo and mud which is almost every walk).
We have 2 so they keep each other company when we have other things to do.
We have had no health issues at all yet family with a lab and golden retriever have permanent vet bills.
I certainly wouldn't write them off

I’d say find a really good breeder and trainer, go in eyes wide open!

We have a springer mad as a box of frogs and very clever!
A joy to train and picks things up super fast but also spends all day snoozing at my feet whilst I work. Mental stimulation is key, I can miss a days walking so long as we do some training and games.

She does love nothing better than to loon around when off lead but comes back when called.

We had a lot of support, two lessons a week 121 and group lesson and we do 4 training sessions a day 2 of which are done while out on the walk. I can’t imagine the disaster if we hadn’t done that as you need them to be able to chill out which the brighter dogs tend to struggle with

If you want something chill then I’d suggest whippet/greyhound types. There’s always retired racing greyhounds looking for homes. They get retired young so still have plenty of life left in them.

And just to reiterate collies are not an good first time dog as they just need so much stimulation. They’re also one of the breeds that have a tendency to just snap with little warning (most dogs will warn you in some way before they have a go, I recommend reading up on the aggression ladder as there’s lots of small ways dogs will tell you they’re not happy that we often miss) so with small children and busy house really a no go.

Best family cuddly dog I ever had was a Staffordshire bull terrier. Lovely dog, great with kids, laid back, loved a walk, ignored most dogs
She was ace 😀
My collie/ lab mix wouldn't sit on my sofa or be comfortable there! She prefers the kitchen just in case someone drops something. She also darts at other dogs 100 miles an hour and greets them, not aggressive, just a bit over the top

This is probably (another stupid/novice question) but are cats a definite no with lurches/greyhound/whippets? I’ve always had cats and would like to get another at some point (probably should have mentioned this up thread!)

I have a lurcher (rescue) - he seems to be greyhound x staffie. He's an absolute gem, so good with people and kids (although we don't have any ourselves), chilled and cuddly. Good with other dogs if not slightly aloof - I describe him as "dog-neutral". He's clever but crucially not too clever! Highly recommend 😊

I have a Border Collie and would say no, although mine has never snapped at a person and tends to ignore children they are quite nervy dogs so can get stressed by noisy households. I did have one when my DC's were small but she had been assessed by a behaviourist as a 'not a good sheepdog' as too placid and sheep would bully her. They were right and DD and her grew up happily together.
I also have a lab/springer cross who would be perfect in a busy household, full of energy on walks but a perfect couch potato at home.

No. Definitely not. They have a natural guarding behaviour, need lots of mental stimulation. If you don’t know what you are doing you can end up with a neurotic, aggressive dog. Sorry but I don’t think they are a good choice for a first time owner.

My border collie is now in the great kennel in the sky. She was a stupendously bright and had bags of energy. I was living in a rural area when I had her so she was in and out of the house at her own will (she could open doors) on top of formal walks. I am sporty so was often out running and she could keep up with me no bother over several miles. If you don't exercise them physically and mentally (hide and seek games for treats etc) they will basically eat your house and furnitur. They are beautiful dogs, loyal, very perceptive and will respond well to training but you have to be very proactive with them

We've got a border collie. We'd both had dogs as kids/teens, and mine was a border collie.

Yes they're hard work cos they need so much exercise and stimulation. She gets 2+ walks of minimum 1.5 hours walks a day. That's bare minimum. She will never say no to a walk unless it's pouring rain. Even if she's walked loads she will want to play.

As she's got older she's got more snappy with small dogs. Collies once adult don't really like other dogs though she will tolerate a select few.

Would I get rid? No way! She's demanding but lovable, loyal, gentle, quirky, loves people, great with kids, affectionate, funny and makes me smile every day. I love that dog so much.

@zippyswife

This is probably (another stupid/novice question) but are cats a definite no with lurches/greyhound/whippets? I’ve always had cats and would like to get another at some point (probably should have mentioned this up thread!)

A puppy with a cat already in situ is probably doable with work but I think you might struggle with an adult dog who hasn’t lived with cats before and and a new cat coming to live in the house. (Sorry I wasn’t sure which circumstance applied from your post) That said, I’d have to work at that with my goldie initially. She would definitely chase!The upside is, she wouldn’t be likely to hurt the cat if she got to it purely due to her breed, which is not anywhere near as likely with a sight hound

Vizslas are hard work for a first dog, we went with a working lab instead. Still lots of work but easier than a Vizsla from my understanding.

Ours is a real lap dog though, she loves snuggles but I think that can be as much personality as breed.

Good conclusion. I'm on my 7th BC (plus one litter of 8 last June) and they still outwit me. They are phenomenally intelligent and need lots of stimulus or they will try to take over the world. I also don't believe in getting one from a Kennel Club type breeder. They are selectively bred for work and to further their initiative and herding instinct. Proper farm ones come in lots of shapes and sizes and in my view the worst thing that happened to the breed was KC accreditation. Shepherds have bred them over generations for their brains rather than their looks.
They are the most challenging and rewarding of breeds if you have the time and commitment, a bossy nightmare if you do not. They do not belong in towns and the herding instinct can be a problem. Although, having said that, quite good for getting the kids out of the house of a morning.

OP, what lifestyle do you want with a dog? How much exercise,training, grooming etc. can you comfortably commit to?What personality traits, prey drive, herding instinct etc etc can you happily accept?

You might get more help starting from that point and seeing what breeds fit

Although, having said that, quite good for getting the kids out of the house of a morning.

There's one locally to me who is always muzzled. She's quite a friendly dog but will try to round up any small children she comes across.