Just need a vent - clueless owners

[tootyfruitypickle]

I've been taking my nervous dog to a NT place where dogs are on lead.

Today a huge doodle or poo of some sort ambushed us 3 times. Not on lead . Third time I asked the owner what the hell she was doing . It had recall but not instant so it came right up to us leaping around.

It took me 40 mins to get my frozen dog out again, and he was making such good progress and walking so well for the past few weeks. We're going to have to take some steps back now. I was standing there with this terrified dog who wouldn't move thinking that she had no idea what stress she had caused.

The only positive I can take is that I advocated for him instinctively which is something I've had to learn. I stood in front of him, put my palm up to the rushing dog and said 'wait'. It did thankfully . And asked the owner to recall - nicely twice - third time I did lose my shit a bit though.

Just so entitled . She can go anywhere with her dog. Why come to somewhere where dogs are on lead and think it doesn't apply to her ? My dog has a yellow nervous vest too.

We need more of these around!!!,

@NeedAHoliday2021

I agree and it’s frustrating. Our dd is always called to our side if we see a dog on a lead and when he was a puppy he’d go back on the lead. That said I’m always puzzled when posters say you can only let a dog with perfect recall off their lead for a walk. How do you train that without the interim period of not being totally sure dpup will recall despite distractions. There’s only so far garden training will get you.

Use a longline.

@Moonface123 a group that sounds exactly like yours walks around a lake near me. Last weekend a big black lab from the group came bounding over and being 'friendly' jumped up at me with paws landing smack in the middle of my stomach. I've already had 6 miscarriages and don't need the stress of friendly dogs jumping up at me. The lab had perfect recall when the owner called it back but that was too little too late. The group were on the path around the edge of the lake which is a popular place for families, I understand letting dogs off on big open fields but why would you allow your dogs off lead where you know there are going to be lots of people walking a circular path? I was at elevation castle... so if that was by any chance your group, YABVVVU.

Does anyone have any tips for how I can help him get used / less afraid of off lead dogs ? He is my first dog and he is a rescue . His reaction is to reverse fast and leap backwards - can be hard to hold. This is what I have tried

*walking with a dog walker with all other dogs off lead. He tolerated (was introduced to each one first on lead ) but clearly didn't enjoy . I did this early on as he used to always freeze when he saw a dog , not sure it was the best plan although it did help.
*we occasionally walk in small groups with some of the dogs off lead rushing around - fine with this now.

*just started going to daycare with 2- 3 other dogs same breed (always samw dogs)
*I treat every time we see another dog , as we see , walking past and afterwards, just continuous feeding! This had got him to walk past nicely and not freeze which js a major advance -but this is only on lead dogs
*recently I have learnt to put him behind me and stop the on coming dog, this seems to have become instinctive as I've bonded with him so I'm quite relieved about that

Today we went somewhere super quiet and he froze as he saw another dog in the distance but then visibly relaxed as we saw the lead .

I'm completely new to dogs so any advice appreciated . What I don't want to happen is he become so afraid he becomes reactive .

@Henry176

To be honest we have a ginormous Newfypoo puppy who is fine off the lead, when there are large or no other dogs about. We try to be considerate to all other dog owners, but sometimes dogs just suddenly appear and our enormous beast just wants to bounce and play. It is frustrating to us when she won't recall, but she is a work in progress.

That's just not good enough. An enormous puppy off lead rushing my dog would be very damaging for him. You should take him to safe, enclosed areas. I sincerely hope you're not just walking your dog in the countryside and the woods etc. and wouldn't be able to control them, it's simply.not fair on the people and dogs you would meet

OP - one way could be to teach your dog recall and see if he’s more relaxed with off lead dogs then. We have a retired racing greyhound with prey drive (not for other dogs) but have taught him good recall and built strong bonds. I also think part of the trick is to spot the on lead dog early and recall to anticipate any rush of blood. I think that’s the issue with many owners who aren’t really paying attention.

Ours was quite skittish and/or would freeze with small jumpy dogs in particular when he was just on lead. Now, even if he’s on lead and they’re not, he’s not bothered. His usual way of dealing with scary off lead dogs is do a full on zoomie - very much “and my superpowers are speed and cornering ability, bozo”.

Fucks sake it just happened again somewhere else on lead only. This time two small yappy dogs no recall whatsoever and I was yelling 'she will bite them' but owners just found it funny.

Think my lunchtime walk will just have to be around the block on pavement at least for a bit .

@tootyfruitypickle

Fucks sake it just happened again somewhere else on lead only. This time two small yappy dogs no recall whatsoever and I was yelling 'she will bite them' but owners just found it funny.

Think my lunchtime walk will just have to be around the block on pavement at least for a bit .

It's so frustrating :( I'm sorry you had another bad experience.

You do get to learn the best times/areas for walks - I find streets are often worse as you can't always escape other dogs - I go to areas with lots of open space so you can spot people in the distance and purposefully walk away before they spot you or get anywhere near.

I usually don't let my dog off lead because he has no recall around other dogs. I will only do it if I am sure there are no dogs around in a big place where I can see for miles. I do use a long line to let him run around and practice recall but my problem is that he sometimes gets super excited and zoomy and starts to run fast in circles like a crazy thing or another dog comes over to us then he gets tangled up and it's an unholy mess. I still have no idea what the official answer to that one is. I usually wind up dropping the line before one of us loses a limb.
I have no idea how he is ever going to get any better with recall as he can do it perfectly with no distractions but he chooses not to be arsed to if he wants to play more than he wants treats.

@tootyfruitypickle would you believe it, I just had another one too.

Guy walked his (on lead) dog right up to mine, even though she was visibly tense, staring and sticking very close to me. I TOLD him she was nervous and moved her away while trying to reassure her. He let his bloody dog follow her, and finally she lashed out and bit it. I explained again that she was nervous and he replied 'It's OK, some people just don't get it, do they?'

Currently questioning my own sanity, after that experience.

Just shout out “my dog is unwell and might be infectious”

@BunnyRuddington

I just shout "this one bites". You'd be surprised how quickly they take their dog away.

Haaaaa this

The issue in this case is that op and her dog were in a place where dogs should be on a lead. She and her dog expected and deserved space. Rather entitled from other owner to go to such a place and break the rules.

Some dogs can never go off lead too. The argument that pp have rescued ‘several nervous dogs’ just doesn’t stand as there are so many reasons why all on lead dogs have to be… on lead. Also ‘several’ is not a representative sample really.

I have an enormous rescue dog - he’s reactive through fear (has been awfully treated). We’re trying so hard with him and I know he’s not perfect. I’m sure he has frightened other dogs and probably people when on lead. That said he only wants to play when off lead but it’s not an excuse. We are trying and training training training though. We’re not ignorant and it’s not that we don’t care but we can’t fix everything instantly. 18 months on and it’s SLOW progress. Posts like this make me feel awful because I completely agree with OP but I know that people we’ve met on walks could post about the awful dog they met.

@Burnamer as pp said both times I complained about I was in an on lead place. Although generally I hate dogs running up but I avoid my local lovely woods and commons as I expect it ! I don't have an issue with dogs on lead barking , I realise that's just another fear reaction in most cases .

We were having gorgeous hour long walks around the NT place but back to 20 min slow stop freeze creep forward in response to a treat on the local green now . That's the effect of him having running dogs coming at him. I'm not sure he'll ever change - I think it might be a case of long walks in-the winter when less people about and mini walks in the summer - but I might also start hiring a field for him.

@Burnamer if it makes you feel better, there is usually a huge difference between owners like you who are trying, and owners who just stand there chatting/looking at their phone/never apologising.

Yes I probably wouldn't have posted had it not been for the complete disinterest of the owners - while leaving me about a mile from the exit with a frozen dog !

I'm here to sympathise OP. I also have an slightly nervous poodle who is lovely but prefers not to say hello to unknown dogs. She is fine with those she knows and dogs that approach very quietly but off lead bouncers with zero recall are the stuff of nightmares for her.

She has great recall herself except if she gets scared and chased by a 'friendly' dog and so she is now always on n lead. I've now taken to staying away from our local woods and parks the last few weeks and doing a long walk around the houses which means all dog meets are controlled. She's really enjoyed it and is more relaxed. It's such a shame that other dog owners seem oblivious to it. The amount of well meaning owners who have told me that I have to train her fear out of her aren't helping by allowing their massive bouncy dogs to go up to her face. I may try the 'she bites' comment and see if that helps.

But I do want to say there are a few amazing dog owners who get it and have trained their dogs brilliantly so thank you to them.

Our dog is rescue, nervous and elderly, we always walk her on a lead and walk in areas with ‘escape routes’ if we see other dogs coming, if there is no option other than to pass we always shout that our dog is not good with other dogs and block her against the hedge leaving as much space as possible, most other owners hold their dog or put them on leads until they pass. The big problem are the owners that think roads are paths if they are a single lane width so dogs don’t need to be on leads, we saw a family with a dog, at a distance, at the bottom of a hill, decided to turn back and go into a field, the dog sprints up the hill, I get between the dogs shouting ‘back’, ‘stay’, eventually the dog listens to its owner’s belated shouts and goes back, we then start to walk quickly home, have to pull in for a car, the other dog thinks we’re stopping for him, starts running up the hill in front of the car, with me shouting stop etc only for the owner to start yelling up the road ‘why are you shouting at my dog, if your dog is dangerous it shouldn’t be out, why have you got it on a lead’ well, it’s a road, I didn’t want your dog to be barked or snapped at by my dog, I didn’t want your dog to be run over by a car and I didn’t want the car driver to be traumatised by running over a dog. They were so far away from us I wouldn’t have recognised them if I passed them in the street five minutes later but I can tell you the make of their dog’s pink harness!

I've had to stop taking my Newfie off lead full stop because she's an overly social idiot who doesn't care about instant recall and it's not fair for anyone or any dog to be in that position.

She's totally friendly and loves fuss, but she's not the only dog in the world. It makes me furious to see other people let their similar dogs jump up to everyone as if the rules don't apply to them. My dog would love to do the same, but it's not all about her is it? I hope your ddog is ok.

But having read a lot and watched a lot of trainers videos I'm clear now that owners that let their dogs run up to strange dogs are morons so best treated like that
I agree with everything above but this. It's totally normal behaviour for dogs to gently approach others and make acquaintances. It's part of life and what dogs like to do.

The very vast majority of dogs are not reactive and love to go to the park and play with others. It doesn't make their owners morons.

In your situation, the other dog owner was indeed an idiot walking his off the lead in a lead only area so you were right to confront, but don't accuse all dog owners.

If your dog is agressive, the responsibility is on you to warn others. Owners should then recall their dog right away.

Mine is friendly and loves to interact but she's only a tiny thing so will do so very slowly and carefully. She will have if the other dog isn't reciprocating and will walk away. If not, the owner just has to say something and as soon as I call her name, she'll come right back. I wouldn't want to stop feeling confident and approaching other dogs, running a d having fun as age has every day in the local park where dogs are free to be off the lead.

@NotQuiteUsual thank you for being sensible and thinking of others! Our DG sounds like yours, very friendly and sociable want to play with everyone... hence why he has to stay on lead because if he sees another do his recall goes out of the window! We also know that isn't fair on other dogs, so it's always a short lead or longline in a big open space where I can stop him running up to other dogs. We use a 30 meter long line in an open field so he gets to have plenty of space for a proper run. If I see a dog entering the field, mine gets recalled... which he ignores... so I stand in the line so he can't go any further and reel him in so I have control of him!

@vivainsomnia All fine if yours approach's off lead dog, not ok if you allow it to approach on lead dogs.

Dog recall isn’t always 100% even ones with usual good recall

Perhaps take your dog out very early/late if it’s that terrified of other dogs?

I am firmly in the "dogs should run free" camp (sorry-not-sorry) and consequently never take my dog to on-lead areas. Dogs should be able to approach one another and sniff bums and play. That's what they do.