7 month old sprocker chased deer

[TheBigMacDougal]

Will he need to be on a lead forever?

We have done off lead walks from day 1 and his recall is good, I practice every walk with him. He comes away from other people and dogs, he will chase birds but does it close enough to be in sight and then circles straight back to us.

He has never seen deer before and there was no way he’d have been stopped. Took us nearly 2hrs of circling a small woods to find him. He would have been completely lost as we’ve only walked that path twice and no where near that far.

Long leads are very impractical for where we walk. I was worried he’d got his harness stuck on something, so that will have to go too.

I’m careful when walking him. I never let him go on ahead where I can’t see what is coming or in the next field and out him back on the lead regularly. We play hide and seek, I change direction, I reward him checking in with me and being in my circle. I know he’s a working breed and I’m trying to train him responsibly.

Has anyone had similar experience and it’s not meant a lifetime of lead walking for the dog?

Just keep going with the training. It's clearly distractions that are the issue so that's what needs to be worked on.

I was worried he’d got his harness stuck on something, so that will have to go too.
Why does this make sense? Don't get rid of his harness. He didn't get stuck. The alternative is a collar which is much more dangerous if he got stuck.

I think that deer remains a lifetime trigger for many dogs. I will watch this thread with interest as my dog is 11 and would still chase a deer if he sees one - but generally we walk him where there are none and in 11 years he’s chased one twice so for us this has not equated to never letting him off the lead.

You'll need to go back to basics and train/reinforce a recall again and make sure you have some really high value treats. He's only 7 months, his recall isn't going to be bombproof - as clearly its not. Hopefully you don't walk him off lead where there's livestock.

Yes, quite possibly. You need to keep all dog on leads for about 6 months of the year anyhow (rutting and birth/newborn seasons) so St not such a big difference to keep them on a bit longer

Find a another place for off lead walking.

It's not worth the risk - a kick from a deer could kill your dog (and stags do get aggressive during the breeding seasons)

My 12 year old chased a deer the other day. We just keep an eye out.

Keep going with the training, is all you can do.

Our dog could be called back from chasing cats, rabbits, other dogs etc but even at 10yo, if he put up a deer or a hare, he would chase it.

Thankfully he never caught one, but would come back covered in scratches from hurtling through thorn patches. Two hours after a deer was his longest.

Our 3 year old is like this, would chase sheep too if we let him. He has perfect recall the rest of the time
Think he gets the smell and just gets flooded with adrenaline.
We just avoid areas where he is likely to encounter them.
Whistle training can be useful for some dogs.

He will chase deer if you do not change his training but if you change his training it is not a given that he will do so always. Think of dogs out on the shoot they hunt under direction and that is what you want with your dog.

In the short term you do need a long line and a harness. Dogs get very good at what they practice so if he is allowed to chase deer he will get really reall good at it.

You might want to get some help with looking at ways you can encourage controlled hunting for a ball or a dummy. You also need to stop the chasing of birds as this will also encourage the chase drive,

Loads of focus games, some recall games and in a few months you will have a different experience whilst walking your dog

We have deer in our local woods and all my dogs have begun a sprint when they see the deers race off, usually already quite a distance away -- too far away to be much disturbed by the dog's movement.

The key issue isn't whether or not they begin a chase, but whether you can recall them if they do. With my current pup (six months old) I am whistle training using very high value rewards, to help me control situations like this. My plan is only to use the whistle in higher-risk situations such as these, and to keep on reinforcing the training a couple of times week with high-value treats.

I absolutely don't think that your dog's behaviour on this occasion should mean that you keep him on a lead forever. It just means that you have to do some more work on his recall.

Also, I wouldn't think of it as a deer-specific problem. Obviously deer were extra excitin for him because he hadn't seen them before. But another time it could be a hare or whatever. I guess the only additional risk with deer is that they get so far away so quickly, which is hazardous for the dog if he follows.

I have posted this on the other thread but will put it here as well.

Do you recall to a whistle? It won't stop the chasing but does improve the chances of getting them back if they run off and can't locate you. A whistle can travel a very long way compared to your voice.

Mine did a deer chase in his teenage period and it was probably only 10 mins or so but there was no way he could have seen where I was and he travels a long way in that time but because of the whistle he eventually located me and came running back in a totally different direction to where we had been walking and where he had run off initially. Ironically straight after that time he tended to stick with me as it clearly shook him up as much as me and we just practiced recall lots of times on a walk especially me walking off or hiding.

And at 7 months you're bang in the teenage deafness phase. Mine has had some dubious recall recently so he's back on the long line. We have deer and hares in the field and he wouldn't stop the chase. Squirrels end up in a tree, pheasants fly off, then he comes back but deer could be hours of madness.

Also a spaniel too! We are back to basics with him

Yes, you need him on a lead until you have full control of him. You should put him on a lead near livestock anyway. If this was sheep at the right season, he would have been shot by the farmer.

All dogs have an age where they forget all training, much like teenagers and around the same age. You should be aware of this. Get a professional trainer if you need to.

I'd walk somewhere safer for a few months, continuing to work on high value/high drive situations but where there aren't deer!

If you can do distraction free training around horses, sheep etc, that will help. So do controlled trading where there are big distractions, but don't let him get distracted, IYSWIM.
Short lead, then longer line, start at a distance, then move closer to the distraction, as your/his control builds.

When you feel more confident, do some long line walking where this incident happened and see how it goes.

This is a really common thing. If I could write a manual for spaniels it would say 'early months, don't be deceived into thinking your spaniel has great recall because at some point between 6-12 months they will bugger off'

Our neighbour rescued springers and she told me the story of how she took one to the beach at 8 months and it took 6 people 3 hours to catch him! He went round and round chasing seagulls!

I would start whistle recall training now if you can. It's a good age for it. Long lead on and stop the chasing, even birds. We have been whistle training for ages and at 17 months, we are still not at 100% in my mind so we are still on the long line where there is any possibility he will bugger off or harm/chase any type of wildlife. We don't allow chasing of anything.

A good starting point was sit and wait while birds landed around him. Start with a short sit and build up time. These dogs are perfectly capable of this and tend to enjoy the training.

My DH was walking him and didn’t have a whistle. I do recall him to a whistle but I doubt it would have changed anything in this instance.

It’s not an area we’ve seen deer before, and DH didn’t see them before the dog, who was only 5yds away from him when he clocked them and bolted.

No, I would never walk him near livestock off lead. And as I said, I make sure he doesn’t go on ahead and clip him on if we’re transitioning areas/can’t see ahead so that I can check what is about. Likewise I would let him go off flushing a managed copse.

@PollyRoulllson I agree, we need to direct his hunting. I’ve got mission control on the way (ordered pre deer chase 🤦🏼‍♀️) and am already working through the total recall book (have been since day 1). Any others you’d recommend?

Should say I WOULDN’T let him go flushing a managed copse!

My Springer is now 15 months and is walked mostly on a long-line but we have some wide bridleways and open NT land so it works. I will drop the line so it trails to practice recall to whistle - but for short periods during second half of walk when she's calmed down a bit and more willing to listen. I will walk in the opposite direction and hide, so she has learned to make sure she's aware where I am, and she gets the idea that she doesn't want to lose me.
We've come across wild deer a few times, but luckily she's been on the lead, so hoping she will get used to them and not be bothered.
Mostly she is great - but on three occasions she has run off after rabbits or birds to flush - comes back after a bit of scary distance. I put the lead back on when she's then really excited. Try to not let her off where likely to see deer, and other animals (pretty impossible with rabbits and pheasant here!) but the long line means she has become used to seeing birds and animals, including deer, horses, sheep, cows, water birds etc and will be calm around them - when on the lead! But she will also sit in the garden with a number of pigeons and squirrel without chasing or bothering/barking so I think we're getting somewhere, as she gets used to animals being a normal part of the landscape.
She is also maturing and settling down to a certain extent, but I know it will be a long haul. Am working on the stop whistle which should also help (our training is a bit delayed due to family illness - stop and recall whistle can be started as soon as you like)

Young dogs will often behave impeccably up to about 6months, then they get a bit braver! You can get GPS trackers for your dog too.

I feel you OP. We’ve a 10 mnth old lab and the deer are bloody everywhere where we live. I’m avoiding the woods for the time being and walking on the open fields for now. (Although the deer are sometimes on the fields too!)

Thank god I’ve had my whistle when he has bolted as made it far easier for him to locate me.

Bloody dogs!

my jack would chase a deer, but never a rabbit,
she would also chase a cat.

Oh, I sympathise. My beagle has taken off after deer before - I don't believe that any amount of recall training could get that hunting instinct out of him. It's so ingrained in him and it's similar to sprockers - the one I walk (I'm a dog walker) has such a high prey drive she's never allowed off the lead (we use a long line) as she will chase absolutely anything.

I would keep him on a harness and longline for now and do a lot of work on focus and recall (not in the woods!). Then you can slowly up the distractions and start practising in the woods again once you feel more confident.

Good luck - I know how scary it is when they bolt and go deaf!

Oh, and to add, my beagle is regularly off the lead now (he's four) but we have to be very careful where - he's perfect on the beach so we tend to go there a lot. I don't let him off up the woods but I'll happily let him off in fields etc. as long as there are no deer or livestock around.

My dogs have never gotten over the need to chase deer sadly. They have been trained and trained but they have a high prey drive.

Thank you for the replies.

I think the scariest part isn’t that he went, I would absolutely expect him to chase something than not given the chance, it’s that he went far enough to then not come straight back.

I would just carry on doing what you’re doing. I wouldn’t confine to lead for the sake of chasing a deer.

And don’t underestimate a dog’s sense of direction, if you stay where he last saw you he will find his way back.

@TheBigMacDougal

Thank you for the replies.

I think the scariest part isn’t that he went, I would absolutely expect him to chase something than not given the chance, it’s that he went far enough to then not come straight back.

It is scary! But in my experience, they're not daft and unless they run for miles, they find their way back.

Mine took off after a rabbit when my FIL was walking him once. Queue FIL getting in a real panic (he's not very mobile) - dog was ignoring his calls and disappeared out of sight.

He decided to go back to the van so he could drive and cover more ground. The dog was sat by the van looking at him as if to say "where have you been?!"