Think I have a problem but not sure what to do about it?

[Anewdawnanewday1]

Unusual one here and will be long but hoping for others views on what I should do!

I have a 18 month old Ddog. Got him the week before lockdown. He’s very well socialised as we sent him to doggy daycare twice a week from 6 months and as we don’t have DC we put him on a long lead and let the neighbours kids play with him when he was younger so he had exposure to children (around 3 of them aged 8-10). All was going good.

When restrictions eased we started to meet my Dsis and her 2 children (aged 2 and 4) for walks outside. Dsis & family are afraid of dogs but know how much we love the dog so while they wouldn’t pet him or anything they would always say a cheery ‘good dog’ when they see him. On walks dog was off lead and wandering around happily, kids on scooters did their own thing too.

Then once all vaccinated they started to call into the house. The first few times dog was typical puppy - running off with crayons and nosing at what they were at, barking etc but all fine. Kids just ignored him.

However I’ve noticed the last 3 times they’ve visited dog has totally changed. His tail goes right down between his legs and he sticks like glue to me & DH. When they last visited DH was making coffee and dog sat at his legs the whole time. Then we sat at table and he lay under my chair quiet as a mouse until they left. I thought he might want to get away from them so offered him into the garden but he wouldn’t budge. I then left hall door open so he could go out there if he wanted as he has a bed out there and a basket of toys and in general he can go where he wants in our house so any of the bedrooms too. The children were colouring at the table the entire time but again he wouldn’t move and he looked so sad and scared.

Like I said the kids won’t pet him or go near him so I don’t know what’s happened. Unless one of them hurt him accidentally closing a door on his tail or something but I keep a good eye on him when they’re here and I don’t remember him whining or anything.

What do you think? I said to DH issue might be if children come round who aren’t afraid of dogs and want to pet him and play with him and if he might then lash out if he’s now afraid of children. He’s very timid around them at the minute.

It’s very annoying as he’s done so well for a pandemic pup to have been so good with kids when we had none in the house and I’m just wondering should I be trying to fix this and if so how!

Dogs are clever and know when people are afraid of them. Add this to the fact that young children frighten many dogs (fast, jerky movements) you dog is feeling very uncomfortable. I would be careful, your dog is showing signs of stress around them. He's young now, but as he gets older this could start to cause issues. I wouldn't allow anyone into my home that made my dogs feel uncomfortable. I think you and the two children need to work with a behaviourist to get the dog and the children comfortable around each other.

Do you have any friends with children (preferably older ones to start with) who love and are comfortable with dogs? Could they come round for some positive conditioning? Things like (if he’s not comfortable with them to start with) getting gradually closer to them during their visit whilst rewarding him… so if he’s beside you at the table and they’re on the sofa, give him calm fuss and treats, and move nearer in spaced stages until you’re also sitting on the sofa. You need to teach him to associate younger people with good things.

I’d also wonder whether they accidentally hurt him. What’s he like with adults in the house? Outside? Children outside the home?

Is it just these children?

Thanks all for the replies. I could ask two of the neighbour kids if they could come play with him as they love him and are around 8-10 years old.

We have more friends with young kids too but none have been round since this started so I don’t know if it’s just my niece and nephew. Unfortunately 2 of the 3 families with kids we are friends with are also afraid of dogs.

I could start with the neighbour kids and then the family who do like dogs and see how he gets on. He is very non plussed by other kids generally. We live beside a school and if kids are coming out when we’re out on a walk some will ask if they can pet him. He’s fine with this - wagging tail etc but also not bothered. He doesn’t try lick them or engage with them. He’s more likely to be looking round at others. I don’t know again if this is as my niece and nephew don’t engage with him at all.

He’s very friendly and engaging with other adults in my family but then they all love him and give him lots of attention. He’s also very good with strange adults and there are a few older kids (maybe 12) in a different estate we see sometimes who make a big fuss of him and he does engage with them.

I have a behaviourist we got initially to make sure we did right by him in lockdown so I could contact her and ask if she could help if others agree this is a serious issue. I will also ask niece and nephew to go on a walk and see if he’s fine with them then as previously he’d be running alongside the scooters and sniffing the hedges happily even though they were technically there near him.

He is also a very placid dog in general. He doesn’t jump up at or bark at kids or adults or other dogs. I wonder if this is just an issue in our house as they hurt him by accident there or if maybe he is used to the house being very quiet and just him usually.

It’s so hard do know what to do here. My son has a friend who is afraid of dogs, I just don’t let him near my dog. Dog stays in kitchen when he is here to play and I driver food to lounge for them. As I think it would be unnerving for the dog to have someone scared of him. But as these children are family you will probably want to integrate more.

Yes not only are they family they live 5 mins away and we generally see them 1-2 times a week. We’re seeing them again today at a family gathering in someone else’s house so I’ll see how dog is today too. Just with the pandemic we didn’t see them for the whole lockdown and since then it’s mainly been outside for walks and only about I’d say ten visits inside.

Does he show any other signs of stress (yawning, lip licking, whale eye etc?).

On some ways he sounds wonderful with these children - not full on, not pushing for attention. I wonder if he's realised these kids aren't playmates and therefore doesn't try and sits quietly with you? Which is probably best if these children are scared?

I'm reminded of what our dog training group said - that the goal with a well socialised dog isn't the dog that runs up to play with every other dog, it's the dog who ignores other dogs.

Accepting petting from kids on walks without licking them or trying to play sounds good too - it's probably far safer for him too (you only need one parent to overreact and think he's trying to eat their little darlings instead of giving them a wash ).

My dog desperately wants to jump up at small humans but knows he mustn't, so does tend to look at me like "aren't I being a good boy, yes?" when accepting a pat

Maybe you would need to preserve with a behaviourist and with the children spending more time with the dog so they get to know each other better? Otherwise the only option would be to leave dog at home every time you visit them?

I must say I am not sure how much point there is spending time getting the dog used to 8-10 year olds. If the children that are the issue are 2-4. My own dog has plenty experience with 8-10 year olds, but I would not think that she would be ok with toddlers are they are different kettle of fish again and different behaviour/movements from them .

Yes that is true awkwardpaws as long as the children don’t approach the dog it should be ok and maybe don’t force the matter? My childhood dog wasn’t well socialised with toddlers and just hid in her basket when they came. The children knew to leave her alone.