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The doghouse

If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

Original poster

Which pup?

52 replies

Bigbluebuttons · 05/05/2021 01:37

Pup 1) Jug. 3/4 pug, 1/4 Jack Russel. Single pup of a house pet, no short nose or folds near eyes. Very well socialised at home with the family children and 2 other dogs. Currently 5 weeks so not quite ripe. Achingly cute.

Pup 2) KC licensed experienced breeder of schnauzers. Pup is fully tested and vaxed and chipped etc. 9 weeks old, ready to go. Crate and toilet trained. Also crazy cute.

There is a price difference but aside from that, which would you choose?
Doggy will be at home with me, we have a safe garden, and 3 KS2 kids. One of the kids is prone to allergies. He’s had a good snuffle of the jug but no reaction so far.

Which would you pick?

OP posts:
bluebluezoo · 05/05/2021 09:55

@Whitney168

Yep that ad is a puppy farm.

Whitney168 · 05/05/2021 09:56

[quote bluebluezoo]@Whitney168

Yep that ad is a puppy farm.[/quote]
Yes, I know it is - but I don't know if that is the puppy the OP is looking at.

Original poster
Bigbluebuttons · 05/05/2021 10:15

That’s not the ad but that IS the breeder. It says that they’re all tip top licensed.

OP posts:
Original poster
Bigbluebuttons · 05/05/2021 10:16

In answer to the question about the breed, I like schnauzers, the ones I’ve met are bright clever and not too yappy. One of my kids is obsessed with pugs.

OP posts:
SirVixofVixHall · 05/05/2021 10:20

Pup 1.
Reasons as follows- 1.Mixed breeds are healthier normally. 2. The pug element should calm down the nutcase JRT element. 3. Shanuzers are sweet pups but on the yappy side as adults, the biggest size ones are a lot better than the mini in my experience, in terms of temperament.

Whitney168 · 05/05/2021 10:20

Yes, for 101 dogs. I wouldn't touch them with a bargepole.

SirVixofVixHall · 05/05/2021 10:23

Also having see the ad, an even firmer Pup number 1.

Original poster
Bigbluebuttons · 05/05/2021 11:10

So the consensus seems to be either the pug cross or something entirely different to the breeder?
What’s the difference between a incensed breeder and a puppy farm?

OP posts:
Original poster
Bigbluebuttons · 05/05/2021 11:11

Can you be BOTH a licensed breeder and a puppy farmer?

OP posts:
Whitney168 · 05/05/2021 11:19

@Bigbluebuttons

Can you be BOTH a licensed breeder and a puppy farmer?
Of course you can. Do you think anyone who is licensed to keep 101 dogs can possibly give them the appropriate level of attention, let alone do that for the number litters that will result?

Before the recent licensing changes, I would say the majority of licensed breeders were puppy farmers. It used to be much easier to say to people to avoid licensed breeders like the plague, unless they had some sort of record in another discipline to show their credibility. Now things are much more confused.

Please do your research on the conditions that dogs are kept in at such establishments, then research the licences of any breeders that you are looking at and make sensible decisions based on that factual information. Anyone who does not do this is complicit in the misery.

For those buyers who don't care about the conditions that dogs are kept in behind the scenes at huge breeding establishments (and all buyers should!), then bear in mind that lots of puppies from such places are very poorly socialised and often not very healthy either. Many die soon after purchase.

Original poster
Bigbluebuttons · 05/05/2021 11:21

Thankyou that’s very helpful.

My gut says the pug - so happy at home with the family, socialised, responded to his name, happy to investigate and play.

OP posts:
XelaM · 05/05/2021 12:18

I know people don't approve of pugs on MN, but ours is an angel compared to our nutty poodle that we previously had. Even as a puppy he is less trouble than my 16-year-old poodle ever was

Whitney168 · 05/05/2021 12:31

I don't think anyone thinks Pugs are trouble. I don't see a huge number round here, but I do find it difficult that most of them are struggling to breathe, even on a normal day. I am very judgemental of a couple of owners around here who also keep them very fat, to make things even worse.

I suppose if you live with them, you get used to the snuffling and snorting, but it is upsetting to hear when you are used to more 'normal' breeds.

Original poster
Bigbluebuttons · 05/05/2021 12:46

Whitney I agree and that’s why I’ve not been keen on them but this is enough of a cross breed not to have the face issues.

OP posts:
tabulahrasa · 05/05/2021 13:03

@XelaM

I know people don't approve of pugs on MN, but ours is an angel compared to our nutty poodle that we previously had. Even as a puppy he is less trouble than my 16-year-old poodle ever was
Pugs IME are lovely, nutty in a dead sweet way, loads of fun and a huge personality.

But physically they’re a mess of health issues that can really impact their life.

And sadly, not even outcrossing with another breed always sorts that out - because you can’t tell by looking at them what their internal soft tissue is like.

Wolfiefan · 05/05/2021 13:08

Neither. Home bred. Indiscriminate breeding with no regard to health.
Puppy farm.
Either rescue or start by picking a breed and contact the breed club. It’s not just about the pup you being home. But how many dogs they have, in what condition and how many litters each bitch has.

sunflowersandbuttercups · 05/05/2021 16:16

@XelaM

I know people don't approve of pugs on MN, but ours is an angel compared to our nutty poodle that we previously had. Even as a puppy he is less trouble than my 16-year-old poodle ever was
Personality-wise I think pugs are great dogs - I've never met one that was vicious, aggressive or unpleasant in any way, but as a breed, they have SO many health issues that it's almost impossible to avoid them.

Even pugs with long snouts can have issues relating to their eyes, their breathing, their skin, their hips and more.

www.pdsa.org.uk/taking-care-of-your-pet/looking-after-your-pet/puppies-dogs/small-dogs/pug

DiddlyWiddly · 05/05/2021 17:59

ISDS eye tested Confused
Is that a typo?!
ISDS is the International Sheep Dog Society..
There won’t be any schnauzers registered with them!

DiddlyWiddly · 05/05/2021 18:14

I’ve had a google incase ‘ISDS’ stood for something else and I wasn’t aware but no, still the same.

The eye screen the breeder refers to is listed as the BVA/KC/ISDS eye testing scheme.

BVA is the British Veterinary Association, KC is the Kennel Club and the ISDS is the International Sheep Dog Society.

If the Schnauzer was eye tested it wouldn’t be under the ISDS as for obvious reasons they don’t register Schnauzers!

So for a Schnauzer it would be under BVA or the Kennel Club.

The fact the breeder actually refers to it as ‘ISDS eye tested’ suggests to me the dog actually hasn’t been tested at all.

Maybe I’m overly cynical but I’d actually be worried any ‘papers’ were fraudulent.

Happenchance · 05/05/2021 18:46

Crate and toilet trained. I doubt this very much.

Have you met both puppies' parents? What are their temperaments?

Motorina · 05/05/2021 19:00

I wouldn't touch pup two with a barge-pole. Breeding multiple breeds, multiple litters on the go, rehoming the adults when they've retired/finished breeding. Puppy farm by any other name.

Plus their website is a truly offensive shade of pink.

I might consider pup one. Might. I would want to speak a vet who had examined the pup to get an indication of likely airway issues. Also there can be behavioural issues which come from being a singleton, and I would want to know what the breeder had done to address that.

bluebluezoo · 05/05/2021 19:12

Insurance for pugs and pug crosses is astronomical. You may want to factor that in.

Because you will need it...

GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman · 05/05/2021 19:49

I've never known a nasty pug but a) health wise they can be a nightmare as PP have said and b) JRTs are notorious little shits (and we had a JRTx, so I can say that - she was lovely in many ways, but had massive prey drive and would happily tell any dog who interfered with her day to fuck off, even if weighed 10x what she did).

But it's the one I'd go for, over any poor little sod bred in a puppy farm.

landofgiants · 06/05/2021 22:34

Neither.

Iremembertheelderlykoreanlady · 07/05/2021 16:53

Neither.

I wouldn't want anything crossed with a pub due to the health issues. Eyes being a big one.

I wouldn't want anything crossed with JRT. Nasty little fuckers on the whole.

And the 2nd is from a puppy farm.

Go away, do your research. Find what breed would be best for your family and circumstances and then look for a good breeder. Go on a waiting list etc etc

Good luck