Told by the farmer to keep dog on a lead?

[mudstuck]

I was walking my dog through a field and the farmer came up on his tractor and complained that he had seen my dog off the lead. There are no sheep or livestock around, and I would always always put her on a lead if I there was any chance of encountering any livestock.I did raise the fact that the field was empty with him and he said there are young pheasants going about... I apologised and agreed to keep her on a lead in future. However on reflection I am wondering if he is in the right to ask that of us? My dog doesn't have a very high prey drive at all and lives happily with three house cats. I don't allow her to chase wildlife although her recall, even though it's good, is not 100% and we have had the very occasional chase of a squirrel or deer. She probably would chase a pheasant if she saw one running away but she would never catch it. What do you think? Like I said I am happy to keep her on a lead just for an easy life. I live close to the farmer and don't want the trouble/conflict. Just wondering who is in the right..

@Hedgesfullofbirds

Of course the farmer is in the right! Regardless of whether or not there is livestock in his fields it is still his land, just because it is agricultural doesn't mean it is a free for all to allow dogs to run free - that is NO different to allowing your dog to run free in someone else's domestic garden.

Added to which, many, many ground nesting birds like skylarks, plovers, pheasant and partridge are either incubating eggs or have young chicks, they are having a hard enough time as it is with predation from the exponentially rising number of badgers hoovering them all up. Add loose dogs into the mix and it is no surprise that many species are now on the cusp of being lost forever.

"Of course the farmer is in the right! Regardless of whether or not there is livestock in his fields it is still his land,"

By that logic if he asks her to only walk the dog when she's topless in a pink tutu no-knickers OP has to do that too?

I definitely think that all dogs should be on a lead at all times in public places, and definitely if they aren't 100% obedient all the time. But the farmer doesn't have unlimited rights just cos it's his land.

@0ntheg0again

Wow this is possibly the most bizarre thread ever, she did put her dog on the lead as the farmer asked! Can you lot not read??

We know that.

OP is still arguing that she shouldn't have to keep her on dog on lead on farmland.

Wow this is possibly the most bizarre thread ever, she did put her dog on the lead as the farmer asked! Can you lot not read??

Yes, and what we read was the OP asking:

However on reflection I am wondering if he is in the right to ask that of us?

And yes, the farmer is within his rights to require a dog to be on a lead, when walking through his property.

@LST

Yes! Letting your dog off lead when you haven't got full control of it

I hate to break it to you but it is not possible to have full control of any off lead dog. Period. You can do all the training in the world but it's still an animal and hence can be unpredictable.

You are no different from me if you let your dog off knowing the risk is minimal. You may think your dog is perfect but it's still a dog with a prey drive.

If you are ok his land, the farmer is always right. It doesn't matter if you're dog is the next messiah, fully wormed and vaccinated and goes around with its own personal toilet.

Pheasants are livestock in the sense they do have to buy the chicks in, feed them up, medicated them etc etc but just not "traditional" livestock as in cows/sheep etc.

@AllThatisSolid

Wow this is possibly the most bizarre thread ever, she did put her dog on the lead as the farmer asked! Can you lot not read??

Yes, and what we read was the OP asking:

However on reflection I am wondering if he is in the right to ask that of us?

And yes, the farmer is within his rights to require a dog to be on a lead, when walking through his property.

Yes. I accept that and I have learned but there is no need for all the hate. Anyone would think I let her run through a field attacking lambs or some shit 🙄

OP, as a dog owner, are you aware of nesting season? You must be aware that the country code does strongly recommend that you keep your dog on a short lead during nesting season. Even if you were not in his field but were in woodland, your dog should still be on a lead, especially as you have accepted that your dog is a risk because he does chase things and may not return when called.

Regarding the farmland, again, even in Scotland, you are strongly encouraged to keeo your dog on a lead. It doesn't mater if you haven't seen any livestock. You've no idea what the fields have been treated with, or if there are plantings growing etc. Your dog should be on a lead, especially when they may run off/chase things.

You are entirely in the wrong. It's nesting season and you were on farmlan. Those are 2 reasons for keeping your dog on a lead.

@mudstuck my dog has never ever failed to recall and never ever chased a single thing apart from a tennis ball (which I threw) in his life. Therefore no, I am not as bad as you. I had a dog which had bad recall, I never let him off unless in an enclosed field.

@twinkletoesfairynose

If you are ok his land, the farmer is always right. It doesn't matter if you're dog is the next messiah, fully wormed and vaccinated and goes around with its own personal toilet.

Pheasants are livestock in the sense they do have to buy the chicks in, feed them up, medicated them etc etc but just not "traditional" livestock as in cows/sheep etc.

As I just said... by that logic if he asks her to only walk the dog when she's topless in a pink tutu no-knickers OP has to do that too?

I don't know the answer.

I know that OP should keep the dog on a lead on farmland with livestock around. I don't know whether the farer has a right to demand the dog is on a lead and at what point he has a right to shoot the dog (when the dog runs 10 m from the owner? When the dog starts chasing sheep? When the dog gets close to the sheep? I don't know. But I am very very sure that the farmer doesn't set all rules simply because it's his land.

These farmers clearly think they're above the law and can do as they please just cause they own abit of land

So where's your fridge? I need to get some milk.

What? You're telling me it's your house, and I'm not allowed to walk through it?

These house owners clearly think they're above the law and can do as they please just cause they own a bit of land.

In answer to your original Op, yes I think he was right to ask you to keep your dog on a lead. As he said your could run off and disturb the pheasants. Also as you said no dog has 100% recall so your dog may not have come back should you have called. From a farmers point of view they don't know how (or not) aggressive your dog is. By keeping your dog on its lead you keep the livestock safe and your dog safe. Everyone wins. Our local RSPCA shelter has a fenced area that anyone can use and take their dog to exercise and let if off the lead for a run around. Maybe see if there's something like this by you.

It isn’t as if the OP was traipsing through a field of sheep. Land that’s never got livestock on it and land that’s planted with crops so you stick to a path is usually safe for a well behaved, off lead dog.

@user1483387154

they are 100% in the right, you are also lucky he is happy for you to walk across his land. it is private property

Presumably OP was Ona public footpath and therefore had a right to be there. We own land - well, a single field- which has a public footpath running around it. People have a perfect right to be on our land if they stick to the path

‘Just because they own a bit of land’.

I live rurally surrounded by several farms. If you let your dog roam on their fields, it will get shot sooner or later and no-one will be interested in the circumstances of the shooting.

You can complain and say it wasn’t fair, it was illegal, but it won’t bring your dog back...!

Please keep your dog on a lead, especially at this time of year. Even if the fields look empty there could well be skylarks, curlew, plovers, deer fawn, leverets.

Just because you can't see it doesn't mean it isn't there and very vulnerable.

Wildlife not just livestock takes priority over your pet . Please keep it on the lead .

Mudstuck if the farmer feels the dog is a threat, yes, he would be entitled to shoot. Why begin the thread if you do not like the answers?

You are no different from me if you let your dog off knowing the risk is minimal. You may think your dog is perfect but it's still a dog with a prey drive.

Haven't you just answered your own question @mudstuck? The Scottish land law basically says dogs have to be on a lead or under close control. The farmer for some reason doesn't believe you have 'close control' so asks you to put the dog on a lead. And you've just said 'it's still a dog with a prey drive' in answer to everyone saying the farmer has every right to ask. So you can't 100% guarantee the dog will not chase something it sees as prey. Therefore it goes on a lead in a field, particularly at this time of year as there are ground nesting birds nesting - baby birds right at doggie level.

So your question is answered and you've agreed with it - the farmer is within his or her rights to ask for the dog to be put on a lead. The threat of being shot doesn't apply then does it. Because the dog's on a lead. Problem solved.

’If you let your dog roam on their fields, it will get shot sooner or later and no-one will be interested in the circumstances of the shooting’

That’s the reality.

"I hate to break it to you but it is not possible to have full control of any off lead dog. Period. You can do all the training in the world but it's still an animal and hence can be unpredictable.

You are no different from me if you let your dog off knowing the risk is minimal. You may think your dog is perfect but it's still a dog with a prey drive."

Which is exactly why it is entirely reasonable for the farmer to ask you to keep your dog on a lead when crossing his land!

The Scottish access code does say dogs should be at heel or on lead from April to July because of ground nesting birds this applies not only on farmland but moorland seashore loch side etc

To add to my post, I couldn't give two hoots if a dog is on or off a lead on the footpath through our field. It has no livestock. Obv if it did it would be different.

I hate to break it to you but it is not possible to have full control of any off lead dog. Period. You can do all the training in the world but it's still an animal and hence can be unpredictable.

You've answered your own question.

I was walking through an estate yesterday, in Scotland, and there were indeed lots of pheasants in the fields, there were also signs everywhere asking owners to keep dogs on lead (not that everyone did ). It's not really about the law. It's breeding and lambing season, not the best time to be walking dogs off lead in fields.