Urinary diet

[PinkJammie]

Hi all,

We’ve had advice from our vet that our dog (who is one but has been peeing sporadically overnight hence the test) has alkaline urine (8 ph) and therefore needs to go onto Royal Canin food for urinary issues. Ive looked into this and I am not convinced by the nutrition rating of the food. I queried with the vet why this food is better/how it works (as it scores so poorly nutritionally on allaboutdogfood) and was told they didn’t know how it works but not to believe what I read online! Dog is currently on canagan kibble and is thriving (bar this issue). I informed the vet that he is on good quality grain free food and then got a lecture about taurine...!

Apparently people reading online keep her in business! I am definitely going to change vet as I am not happy with her approach at all but interested to know if anyone else experienced this issue and had to make dietary adjustments?
I want to resolve the urine issue as I understand the risk of bladder stones is to be avoided but wondered if there are other avenues to try. Any thoughts very welcome.

The diet works by acidifying urine pH and preventive Crystal/stone formation.

Its nutritionally balanced because nutrients aren't the same as Ingredients and experts focus on nutritional requirements whilst pseudo-scientists focus on ingredients. Because folk believe that making a processed dog food from chicken breast meat rather than chicken off-cuts is nutritionally superior. It isn't.

Also most dog food eating websites are run by randomers with zero qualifications - why would you trust them over an actual qualified professional?

Grain free diet has been associated with heart disease (due to that the lack of taurine your vet has already pointed out) abd has no nutritional benefits. Why are you feeding it?

Hmmm

Well you’ve offered a better explanation than the vet did earlier so thanks for that.

I’m feeding a diet that has been recommended to me and he has been doing well on. And I’ve used allaboutdogfood as a source of information as that seemed the best place to go. I haven’t said anything about ingredients - but I was under the impression that foods like Royal Canin contain ingredients which are undesirable. Perhaps that’s not the case.

I’m not saying that anyone knows better than a vet, I’m asking if there are other options as the vet seemed unsure and hectoring when I asked questions earlier.

Thanks for your input.

My spaniel was on that food for 5 years after 2 lots of bladder stones. And it did work for that. But gave her lots of allergies. Persisted with it for years because really don’t want her to have another op for bladder stones.

Did a lot of research last year into what else works for bladder stones and it seems a raw food diet can work really well. Not something I’d ever been keen on (still not really), but she seems really well on it and fingers crossed no bladder issues yet.

Might be worth looking into? But you do need your vet to be on board, not all like raw food diets.

Maybe do the Royal Canin for 6 months (which is what they suggest at first?) to try and avoid the stones, then you might be able to go back to a different food.

@PinkJammie

Hmmm

Well you’ve offered a better explanation than the vet did earlier so thanks for that.

I’m feeding a diet that has been recommended to me and he has been doing well on. And I’ve used allaboutdogfood as a source of information as that seemed the best place to go. I haven’t said anything about ingredients - but I was under the impression that foods like Royal Canin contain ingredients which are undesirable. Perhaps that’s not the case.

I’m not saying that anyone knows better than a vet, I’m asking if there are other options as the vet seemed unsure and hectoring when I asked questions earlier.

Thanks for your input.

No worries

My concern is that your basis for knowledge is a random website with no real credentials. Why would you put that over a trained professional?

Your dog will do absolutely fine on a grain free diet.
Unless he's one of the unlucky ones who develops cardiomyopathy in response to it. In which case he'll die prematurely. It depends what you want I suppose. An evaluated, professionally supported duet with no known health risks. Or a trendy fad diet that is linked to early death. That's why vets advise against it. Grain free diets are a fad, promoted by the internet and cause actual physical harm.

Occasionally vet professionals get exasperated having to justify their informed educated advice to people who would rather listen to a quack website or feed dangerous food because of some misplaced belief that peas are a more species appropriate ingredient for their dog than grains

@Veterinari when I asked the vet why the prescribed diet is better (what are we looking to reduce or what is having an effect) she couldn’t tell me. Therefore I have had to go looking for more information. I’m not saying the internet knows better at all- I’m saying it says different and I want to understand what’s going on. My dog has had digestive issues in the past on other food (chicken foods seem to be problematic) so I’m keen to know what I’m dealing with. I’ve just read for instance that the hills variety we’ve been recommended is for older dogs, which he isn’t so again how can I feel confident in the opinion I’ve been provided with. My dog is still growing and I want to make sure he gets enough protein. My research shows these diets are lower in protein - is this an issue? These are the sorts of things I’m trying to find out. I just want to be informed.

@honeyandbutterontoast thank you for your comments on the raw food. I’ve just come across nutriment low purine so may make some enquiries into that.

The prescription food is specially formulated for these kind of issues. It changes the urine ph and stops the stones forming. And they are really very nasty things to have. I don’t think you can compare prescription food to normal dog food in a like for like way. I used to mix a little bit of really good quality wet food with the royal canin biscuits and apart from the allergies she did well on it, she’s nearly 10 and (touch wood) very fit for that age dog. The RC one comes in normal size biscuits, a calorie controlled version I think, smaller biscuits (which we had because she could have more of them!), and wet food too. We had all the versions over the years. The biscuits work out a lot cheaper. You can get the food delivered from Fetch, at a better price than the vets. Maybe look into probiotics to go in the food to help if your dog has digestive issues?

[quote PinkJammie]@Veterinari when I asked the vet why the prescribed diet is better (what are we looking to reduce or what is having an effect) she couldn’t tell me. Therefore I have had to go looking for more information. I’m not saying the internet knows better at all- I’m saying it says different and I want to understand what’s going on. My dog has had digestive issues in the past on other food (chicken foods seem to be problematic) so I’m keen to know what I’m dealing with. I’ve just read for instance that the hills variety we’ve been recommended is for older dogs, which he isn’t so again how can I feel confident in the opinion I’ve been provided with. My dog is still growing and I want to make sure he gets enough protein. My research shows these diets are lower in protein - is this an issue? These are the sorts of things I’m trying to find out. I just want to be informed.

@honeyandbutterontoast thank you for your comments on the raw food. I’ve just come across nutriment low purine so may make some enquiries into that.[/quote]
I find it weird that you want to be informed whilst feeding a grain free diet that is actively associated with poor health outcomes. Do you scrutinise all of your dietary decisions in this way? If so, why choose a grain free alkalinising diet that predisposes to health problems?

Urinary diets are generally not recommended for dogs less than 6mo because of their lower protein content. But this has to be balanced against the risks of urinary obstruction/surgery from urinary stones.

Thank you @honeyandbutterontoast I’ll make a decision tomorrow on what to go with.

@Veterinari sorry to jump on this thread but my pup has just had to move on to RC urinary food due to UTIs and associated crystal formation. Thank you for the reassurance - my only concern was the low protein content for a 10 month old, but he's a small breed so most of his growing is done?

[quote PeckyOwl]@Veterinari sorry to jump on this thread but my pup has just had to move on to RC urinary food due to UTIs and associated crystal formation. Thank you for the reassurance - my only concern was the low protein content for a 10 month old, but he's a small breed so most of his growing is done?[/quote]
Best to check with your vet - I think for young dogs RCW sometimes recommend the sensitive diet instead of the urinary one because of the protein issues but their advice may vary depending on clinical severity, age and size.

@Veterinari thank you. Will do that, its good to know what the options are.