Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

The doghouse

If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

Recall training - just not getting there

21 replies

teatimetreat · 24/01/2021 15:30

Hi all,

I'm really struggling with my 14 month old dog. He generally is calm, fun, patient - in fact he is brilliant, unless he is off the lead then he is a total hooligan who gets completely over-excited and boisterous with other dogs and won't recall or let me clip his lead.

Now it's not like I've not tried. I've read tons of books, talked to trainers, watched videos, made liver cake, spent hours doing training at enclosed dog runs, used a long line, played games, tried to increase our bond, socialised him with dogs from an early age...I genuinely have tried everything and despite the constant effort I find his recall keeps failing. We can have a few weeks where he is good then it goes again.

He can be good and I build confidence letting him off with no other dogs around, and then out the blue we have a day he will not let me put his lead on and he runs riot till I (or someone else) can catch him. Then I have to to go back to square one - again.

Post lockdown I will work with a trainer, but in the meantime I'm pretty demoralised. We are an active family who love the outdoors and my main motivation for getting a dog was having one that would freely accompany us on our adventures like my dog did when I was small.

I'm worried he is a dog that just needs to be kept on a lead and can't ever run free exploring with my kids. I'm worried he just doesn't like/respect me that much. He knows what I'm asking of him but he repeatedly choses not to do it.

I guess my question is - could he just be a dog I can't ever properly train to recall?

He doen't have a strong prey instinct, but a very large run about having fun at all costs instinct 😁😫

OP posts:
SlothMama · 24/01/2021 16:03

The issue is that he's finding being off lead is much more interesting than you, and it is a challenge trying to make yourself more interesting. I did a rapid recall course with my older dog because she had the same issue. She wouldn't come away from other dogs because they were much more fun! We played lots of recall games and it did make her better, but the most effective way to get her back was whistle training.

You introduce the whistle by blowing it and feeding the dog, repeat it lots of times. So the dog associates the whistle with something good and they'll come running.

PollyRoulson · 24/01/2021 16:03

What breed is he?

teatimetreat · 24/01/2021 16:11

@PollyRoulson

What breed is he?
He's a standard poodle. He's a beautiful big athletic dog to deserves to run free - but under control!
OP posts:
MothershipG · 24/01/2021 16:15

You need to keep him on the line for the time being. You can have it trailing & then if you need to get him away or on lead you can step on it, call him back & draw him towards you so he doesn't get to ignore you.

Good luck with working with a trainer, sounds like your dog is just being a teenager.

My Schnauzer did respond better to a whistle & would recall really fast and sit in front of me beautifully....or not! we never managed 100% & we had a trailing line on & off for years, but her main problem was high prey drive, not being a teenager 😀

EcoCustard · 24/01/2021 16:18

I remember my spaniels regressing at about 12-15 months. Like teenagers they knew it all and wouldn’t listen to a wordGrin
Keep at it, reinforcing with reward and praise for return. I used to not utter a word to mine when they ignored my recall whistle and immediately put them on the lead, but my body language said I was not impressed if that makes sense.

teatimetreat · 24/01/2021 16:18

@SlothMama

The issue is that he's finding being off lead is much more interesting than you, and it is a challenge trying to make yourself more interesting. I did a rapid recall course with my older dog because she had the same issue. She wouldn't come away from other dogs because they were much more fun! We played lots of recall games and it did make her better, but the most effective way to get her back was whistle training.

You introduce the whistle by blowing it and feeding the dog, repeat it lots of times. So the dog associates the whistle with something good and they'll come running.

I agree this is the problem, but I can honestly say I've really tried to make myself more interesting. Games, hide and seek, retrieving games, me being the funnest and most animated I can be Grin, but when push comes to shove he isn't reliably chosing me, which makes me think he's just not that bothered despite my best efforts.

Last time I had to go back to start with his training I started using a whistle and was following the Total Recall book. After a few months I could see a definatley improvement, but in the space of a few weeks it fell apart again and we go back to lead walks till I can build up confidence again.

OP posts:
teatimetreat · 24/01/2021 16:23

@EcoCustard yep totally know what you mean. I do the same as I don't want to actually tell him off when he I do eventually get him in case it damages his recall further. Trouble is he constantly body swerves me to avoid the lead - despite constant training that when he is recalled I touch his collar and he gets a treat. God bless the kind dog walkers to have came to my rescue one too many times Grin

OP posts:
mamalovebird · 24/01/2021 16:23

My Schnauzer was like this. The only that worked in end was cheese and perseverence that every time I say 'what's this?', he knows he'll get a cube of cheese so will come back. Took time with practice runs indoors but now when I'm out, he will come back 99% of the time... just means I cannot forget cheese whenever we go out.

yearinyearout · 24/01/2021 16:28

It's also important not to only put the lead on at the end of a walk (you may have already covered this) so when he does come back clip lead on, give him a high value treat, make a massive fuss of him then let him back off a minute or two later.

Treat wise have you tried dried sprats/homemade sardine biscuits/liver paste/cooked liver/primula tube etc, to find something he adores?

ThunderwingDoomslayer · 24/01/2021 16:36

Is the recall issue only when he encounters other dogs? It sounds like he becomes so overstimulated/engrossed in what he is doing - playing with the other dogs - that nothing else will compete, so of course he carries on with the playing.

Rather than working on the recall part, you could look at it the other way around. If he finds other dogs so exciting that he won't come away, you need to make the dogs a bit less exciting. Look at desensitising. See where his threshold is, where he becomes excited, then avoid letting him get in that state for a while. Reward him for calm behaviour. Then give him positive interactions with other dogs in a controlled way (long line) and heavily reward each time he comes away from the other dog.

Kikopup on YouTube explains these things very well.

Ylvamoon · 24/01/2021 16:40

Religiously give your dog a treat every time you call him and he comes. Including in the house or when coming in from the garden.

Dandelionflower · 24/01/2021 16:40

I'm going through this with my 13 month old lab. We've started whistle training him, it is working well... unless there another dog.

teatimetreat · 24/01/2021 18:08

@ThunderwingDoomslayer you're right in that he has an issue with being too full on and over stimulated with other dogs. I'm putting some of this down to age and down to breed.

I've been managing this by encouraging calm on lead encounters but feel like if his recall was strong that would be half the battle with managing his overexcitment. I could give him more chance to play knowing I can get him back.

He is such an amazing boy and I hate people thinking the worst of him (and me!) when I give him a chance and it totally backfires!

OP posts:
Elizabethlovejoy · 24/01/2021 18:13

If you are finding it hard to clip his lead on when he is excited , you could try leaving a short length of rope attached to his collar ( about 9-12 inches depending on size of dog- maybe shorter if tiny dog)I did that for a short while when my german shepherd was being a teenager about letting me catch him and it really helped. He is 3 now and luckily past that stage.

MissShapesMissStakes · 24/01/2021 18:21

I have a mini poodle. Standards are so beautiful! I'd love one one day.

I wouldn't say it's a breed issue particularly that you're having but more age.

My mini is now 2 and a half. I saw a trainer when he was around the same age as yours because he wanted to say hi to every person he saw. He wasn't bothered about the dogs, it was all about the people.

She said that you don't often see a dog under 2 that has a solid recall. No dog has 100% recall and to wait till he settled around 2 but to keep working on recall.

He's so reliable now at recall. I do think age played a large part in that. But also I found a type of squeaky ball that he loves. So I also have that as backup. We 'loaded' the squeak up so that every time he responded to the squeak (at home as well out while out) he'd get either a fun ball game or a treat.
I don't need it that often now but I like having it as my backup plan.

I would also say make sure you do lots of on and off lead whilst walking. So he doesn't need to avoid it so much as the chances are he will be let off again.

PollyRoulson · 24/01/2021 19:18

could he just be a dog I can't ever properly train to recall? No Smile

Do not beat yourself up about being more exciting - there is more to this than that and making yourself feel boring will not help (and is not the reason)

Recall is so much more than recalling from a situation.

From a dogs point of view recall needs to mean more fun things are about to start and not finish (eg recalling from a dog and getting abit of sausage will not be enoughSad).

So start at home, for a few days reward for eye contact. Have treats on you all the time and everytime your dog looks at you reward. Every time.

Go into the garden and just stand still reward when you have eye contact.

Get a tuggy toy and in a small room with no distractions play with your dog (no excuse he does not play with toys have fun and he will play with toys) get down and make the toy move slowly and then quickly hid the toy behind your back, hide the toy in your arms and dont let him get it, get him interested in the toy and then pull it out of his way, then run away and let him have the toy.

When he has his meals for the next few days, have him in another room and call him when the food is ready, he should charge in from the other room.

Over the next few days have him indoors and go out into the garden and call him to his supper which he can eat outside (scatter feed if it is possible)

Start to give him events to enjoy with you, searching for food, tuggy games, hide and seek games all of these will be at home.

THEN and this is the bit that people miss, slowly and gradually build up distractions to when you call him to his food. The distractions will depend on the dog, for my collies I will throw a tennis ball and then call them to me. They will come to me rather than chase the ball. So maybe have a family member being exciting and you calling your dog to you.

If you can't call off distractions at home there is no way on earth you will call him off dogs out and about.

Then look at the Distance you are calling him from so call him initially when you are close together and gradually incrase the space between you and him.

This takes time, it takes a long time and it has to be consistent.

Consider using toy for recall rather than food, call his name and run off with the toy and see if he prefers this reinforcement, it is longer reinforcement than food and most dogs prefer it, although dont often get offered it.

Also someone said up thread reward him for every recall always. I DO NOT do this. The criteria for all my dogs recalls is a fast straight line run to me immediately they hear the recall cue.

If they take time to come, or dawdle they have not made criteria and will not get rewarded. They may get some praise, I will evaluate why they did not return immediately look at distractions, distance etc and train initially with less. But then give them the chance to offer the full belt recall and reward like crazy.

Sorry I've gone on a bit BUT if you feel you have done all of the above consistently then you need to look at distractions and distance. You are asking too much in a highly stimulated environment. Keep at the basics for longer.

Do not allow the behaviour to continue so long line, (if he is quaranteed to run off to dogs I would be holding the line at all times not letting it drag on the ground) whie out with dogs and treat for eye focus on you when around other dogs. Again start with huge distance and gradually get nearer. If you cant calmly walk past a dog on lead you will not be able to recall from the dogs.

tons of books, talked to trainers, watched videos this bit made me smile I have done this with yoga still cant do a head stand though Smile

Thermalpants · 25/01/2021 08:51

@teatimetreat, our dog used to be just like yours. Always wanting to rush over to say hello to any dog he spotted. I tried long leads, high value treats and playing hide and seek. None of that stuff worked for us. Dogs were far more interesting. I decided to get his focus on playing with me. I bought two balls, the type on a rope and played with him for a couple of weeks in quieter fields. Rotating the balls to encourage him to return for the one I had. Sometimes I would hide the ball for him to hunt out. This changed everything for us. It only took a few weeks for recall to improve to the point he ignored other dogs. Our dog loves his food, so I always thought the key to recall would be treats. That wasn’t enough for our dog. He needs his brain to be engaged.

Crampon · 26/01/2021 02:45

Have you tried running away from him? Sometimes the movement helps.

Chevron383 · 26/01/2021 08:20

I just wanted to say we're going through the same with our 17 month old, he has a high prey drive and once he gets the scent of something he bolts. My nerves have been shredded by it and its so demoralising after months and months of training.

I've taken a break from it. He's on his lead now and we use a long lead (which i hold) to give him a bit more freedom to sniff. I just needed a breather from it and to be able to just enjoy walking again. It limits where we can walk though.

I'm going to start again next month. I'm hoping now we're through the worst of his adolescence he might be easier.

All I see everywhere we go are dogs happily trotting alongside their owners. I've never once seen a dog on a long line.

Our friends have a cockerpoo. They've never done a days training with him and he comes everytime they says his name! Turns me into a green eyed monster just watching them!

PinotPony · 26/01/2021 16:02

Same issue with my 17mo male Lab.

Pretty consistent recall unless other dogs are about and then he's off. So now, whenever there is another dog in the park, he stays on the longline. Not worth the risk in my opinion.

The worst thing you can do is try to recall (voice commands or whistle) a dog who is totally ignoring you! It just teaches him to ignore you more.

The second he buggers off and ignores your recall, you should growl or yell at him to let him know he's doing wrong. Then reel him back in on the line. Before continuing your walk, just do a few short recalls on the longline from a short distance away (could be a few metres) to hammer home what you actually wanted him to do.

Good luck!

teatimetreat · 26/01/2021 21:18

Wow everyone, some great advice here. Also nice to know I'm not the only one going through it! Seeing other people's dogs beautifully recalling all around me is pretty demoralizing.

@PollyRoulson what an answer - a full training plan right there! Some good things I've not tried so planning to start working my way through what you've suggested.

@Crampon triedbthw running away thing and he will stop and look at me, run towards me then circle round and away off to the other dog again Grin, at the weekend even lay down in the snow to intrigue him over...that didn't really work either!

Ps. Sorry for the late reply to all your great responses, I'm caught up in the work/home school/cooking/cleaning/laundry rat run at the mo!

OP posts:
New posts on this thread. Refresh page