Puppy survival thread October/November!

[HappyThursdays]

hello all - will hopefully link from the old one!

just realised we'll all have fireworks night to get through shortly. Went out for a walk with dpuppy who is getting much better at walking though we met a big dog which scared him a lot! We can only get him into puppy classes in November which is a shame but at least it's something

I need to get a nice collar and harness - any recommendations? Should I get a double ended lead and a front and top-attaching harness for lead work? She's also a gundog and her thing is investigating and bombing about the garden. Am anticipating lead-walking to be very hard work :)

she's gorgeous @DoubleTweenQueen and she sounds v similar in nature to pupthursdays

we have a halti collar and we did start with a halti harness www.amazon.co.uk/Halti-Front-Control-Harness-Black/dp/B005D4NZ50/ref=sxts_sxwds-bia-wc-p13n2_0?hvlocphy=9046132&psc=1&hvnetw=g&keywords=halti+harness&hvadid=259000610775&pd_rd_i=B005D4NZ50&qid=1605777323&cv_ct_cx=halti+harness&dchild=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIqODJ06KO7QIVBrp3Ch1czwxdEAAYASAAEgIu-fD_BwE&hydadcr=18074_1769699&pf_rd_p=bc54d678-36cb-4126-bb48-d9575267d544&pd_rd_wg=y37hS&pf_rd_r=Z1TEKQY149Y2KS3G17FH&hvdev=c&hvqmt=e&pd_rd_w=y6ChR&tag=mumsnetforu03-21&hvtargid=kwd-326431412364&pd_rd_r=24a67164-c4fb-4190-9797-8cc558a0093e&adgrpid=53511499819&hvrand=11785071176097529533&sr=1-2-79e1db8b-ac0e-4e53-86a0-e4b4f9bb89cd that looks like that with a double ended lead and we clipped the lead to the front ring

but tbh, he is such a strong puller on the lead that he was pulling the front bit right round and causing himself issues so we have gone back to the harness on the back www.amazon.co.uk/RUFFWEAR-Harness-Reflective-Training-Everyday/dp/B082FQVRR1/ref=redir_mobile_desktop?pd_rd_wg=kixOF&hsa_cr_id=6356385090002&ref_=%5BREF_TAG%5D&pd_rd_w=qik4k&tag=mumsnetforu03-21&ie=UTF8&aaxitk=Zx9YZnJ96z-LVcg3EjA.Bw&pd_rd_r=b1dcdc59-c0e0-4f7a-ad94-38c693f58415 this ruffwear one that has a high chest bit (you can attach to the front but he can't walk like that - it's designed to stop them but he just got frustrated)

I think you have to make a decision on walking now. You can decide you want to train them to walk to heel in which case I would start now in the garden and only let her move forward if she isn't pulling. There are loads of videos on this about how to do it. We started doing this but unfortunately pupthurs got attacked while out and we spoke to a behaviourist who recommended we just let him get on with it for a month or so because we were really concerned we'd end up with a reactive dog.. So we've let pup just enjoy his walks out for now. I realise we've created a bit of a monster though and going back to try and teach him walking without pulling won't be easy!

btw all the ESS we see locally (and there are loads) are on slip leads

Hi all we had a slightly better day yesterday with 'walk fear' - managed to get Puppypup out with a continuous supply of chicken and managing people wanting to pat his head. Small steps but feels a bit more positive.

Can someone talk me through enforced naps? We are basically open plan downstairs so only safe confined space would be in his crate but he never goes in there during the day although sleeps happily all night in it. I am worried if I use it during the day it'll make him crate-averse! he does have two beds downstairs (one is a rejected cat bed! So getting a bit small) which he sleeps in. We got rid of the puppy play pen quite quickly as it became a dog/cat conflict zone and he hated it.

btw I mean adult ESS have slip leads

the behaviourist told us once pup was ok going out again, the best way to start training to walk properly is having them walk by your side without any lead in the garden and once they master that, putting the lead on shouldn't cause any issues. I can see the principle - it's all based around having the dogs attention on you all the time - but we are definitely not there yet!

@Puppypuppypuppy good news on the walks! we are lucky in that we can close a door. We haven't got a crate so I don't know whether making him nap there during the day would cause an issue. Would he let you sit with him to go to sleep for a nap if he was getting overtired?

Such a helpful thread, thanks everyone for sharing and support.
Please can we talk about pup meeting other dogs before second lot of vaccinations?
It would be a mature healthy and safe dog + owner who is a friend and more experiencened than us.
Literally just a 20 second - 2 minute closely supervised hello in our garden, depending on how it goes.
Would this be really risky for pup's health? I'm trying to weigh up pros and cons: Risks of illness vs missing out on important social interactions ie Vanpup forgetting 'how to dog'?
Our pup is 11 weeks and hasn't seen another dog for 3.5 weeks.
First lot of vaccinations went well, second lot happening 1st Dec.
Are we better off waiting or would you let him say hi to our friend's dog now? Any input really appreciated thanks!
(Pup is generally a delight, gets a bit over aroused/nippy around the kids when he's tired ot has his 'happy hour' so we minimise their interactions. He responds really well to 'benign disinterest'/calmness, we had a lovely dog trainer over for a session in the garden just before lockdown which was priceless.)

you can meet other dogs as long as they are vaccinated I think and if it's in your own garden it should be fine (just shouldn't be out anywhere)

@Puppypuppypuppy

Hi all we had a slightly better day yesterday with 'walk fear' - managed to get Puppypup out with a continuous supply of chicken and managing people wanting to pat his head. Small steps but feels a bit more positive.

Can someone talk me through enforced naps? We are basically open plan downstairs so only safe confined space would be in his crate but he never goes in there during the day although sleeps happily all night in it. I am worried if I use it during the day it'll make him crate-averse! he does have two beds downstairs (one is a rejected cat bed! So getting a bit small) which he sleeps in. We got rid of the puppy play pen quite quickly as it became a dog/cat conflict zone and he hated it.

We have open plan downstairs and we have the crate in there too in between the family seating and the kitchen and table. The way we have enforced naps is to sprinkle a few treats into the crate so she jumps in about 10 mins before she needs to sleep (she usually plays for 1 hr) then we shut the door and cover the crate so she doesn't get distracted by us moving around. We have her favourite toys in there too so she can chew on them until she falls asleep. If she gets really bitey we put her in there too as we have learnt its a sign that she is tired / hasn't had enough sleep and again cover the crate. Our challenge is her biting, I am at the end of my tether with that as we cant enjoy her anymore. We can't sit on the sofa without her jumping on us and trying to bite arms. Does anyone have any advice please?

@HappyThursdays Thanks for the links! We're mostly bonding, making sure she feels at home and comfortable, and finding some sort of routine! I have started short sessions of trying heelwork in the kitchen and will see if we can build up over time. I have Lez Graham's and Pippa Martinson's books and finding them helpful. Hope to get to where I can try lead walking as soon as she's able to be out and about! Slip-lead is for when she graduates with honours!

We've put her crate (oversize for her but comfy) in the kitchen not too far away from door to garden. If she does a wee/poo when we go out she is directed back into her crate (door open) and asked to sit for a treat. She is free to come and play in the kitchen with us after, or play on her own with toys, have some bivvies or drink, or chill in her crate and sometimes she will settle herself for a nap. We try to ignore bad behaviour and praise when she's calm and polite (not barking, not jumping up, not nipping & biting). This seems to be taking positive effect. She was allowed to look around the house when she first came but is too exciting for her. She is confined to the kitchen (small kitchen/diner) and garden. I can't stress enough how important ignoring her for periods of time seems to be. We're getting on with our lunch now and ignored her for about 20mins and she is taking a nap of her own accord. We only close crate door when she's calm or asleep. I am hoping we have a good balance of boundaries and freedom :D Another pic cos they're particularly sweet when sleeping x

We've got a pupper coming home to Tanqueray Towers next month and this thread has helped and terrified me in equal measure!

Biting is horrible - I have to make sure she is in a good frame of behaviour before the children can spend any time with her. I accept it's part of being a puppy and saw how roughly she and her littermates played together - she is now expected to learn some manners, living with humans, so we ignore bad behaviour - if she gets bitey we leave her to play by herself. She will often come back to us a bit calmer and nicer. She will also sit between our legs or lie on our feet quietly. I hadn't thought of putting her in her crate as thought she would resent it &/or go a bit nuts and not like her crate anymore - I am a bit soft! We are also repeating with a firm voice her name and 'leave it' if she gets hold of us/clothing and also if she puts something in her mouth I don't think she should have. We are all going to do this, before any necessary ignoring to help her calm down a bit. She is starting to learn to detach her jaws when we say this - after 24hrs. Also 'get down'' if she's jumping up at things/cupboards/people. We are trying being consistent and using the same words so she learns the meaning. There are times though when the children just won't be able to interact with her - it will take time for her to get used to it as she grows up, I'm figuring

@coolmum123 We are also open plan and I wondered the same as you about putting off her crate altogether but she never really slept as I was working from home and she would get up every time I moved. This meant she was terribly bitey and beside herself for a couple of hours every evening. I now put her in her crate for an hour in the morning and the about the same length of time in the afternoon. I also cover the crate up so she cant't watch me and she has been so much happier.

She will also watch Puppy TV on Youtube in the evening and that also calms her down - the ducks are a particular favourite but she gets angry at the squirrels

I'm off to find puppy TV........

I was pleasantly surprised at how she watches it. At first I just used the music ones and that appeared to calm her down but drove me mad so we moved on to the nature films so here is tweets, quacks, etc but it is not so annoying for me and she loves it. I do save it for the evening though

I am wondering now whether a bigger crate might be the answer.

[quote grannycake]@coolmum123 We are also open plan and I wondered the same as you about putting off her crate altogether but she never really slept as I was working from home and she would get up every time I moved. This meant she was terribly bitey and beside herself for a couple of hours every evening. I now put her in her crate for an hour in the morning and the about the same length of time in the afternoon. I also cover the crate up so she cant't watch me and she has been so much happier.

She will also watch Puppy TV on Youtube in the evening and that also calms her down - the ducks are a particular favourite but she gets angry at the squirrels[/quote]
It's really difficult to know about putting them in the crate. When we first brought her home, she slept in the crate but apart from the nights we kept the door open. We discovered that she wasn't sleeping enough as she was falling out of the crate as the door was open and she had nothing to lean against, so now we keep the door closed if she is in there day and night. We kind of came to the conclusion that more than space she wanted cosy. Hence her favourite soft toys, a towel (which she likes to curl up against are in there all the time and we make sure to put them in if she has dragged them out of the crate to play with.
Then we figured out that by not covering the crate she was being distracted by us moving around so now we cover it (its the second week we have done this) and now I think she gets that if crate is covered then she needs to sleep. We don't cover in the nights its all dark anyway.
She is starting doggie day care next week so not sure how that will go re the sleeping but I think it will be good for her to play with other puppies. I wfh and am struggling with keeping her occupied when I have meetings.

@Puppypuppypuppy Our crate is bigger than would be 'advised', but she has space to really stretch out and move around when relaxing and sleeping, and she seems to like it. We don't feed her in there either. We might not be doing the right things as suggested, but she seems to be responding well, so works for us. Might not for someone else/a different pup/breed.

Today's 'training' has been not biting, trying to tolerate a collar, not biting, sit, not jumping up and biting, tolerating the hoover, brushing, playing ball/fetch in the garden, sit and heel (spectacular over-excited failure), toilet outside, seeing me in baseball cap and wellies, chasing leaves, trying to steer away from biting. Exhausting!

I have also been experiencing major puppy blues, but it helps when she is lovely. She is currently lying at my feet. I am sleeping on the sofa in sitting room so I can hear her if she needs to go out and pee. Two-three times - not bad. Haven't seen my bed for over a week. Tomorrow I will attempt a bath! (for pup, not me. I have showered)

@Puppypuppypuppy our pup is a lab, breeder advised us to get 36inch crate with the divider which we have and we have been making her sleeping space bigger as she grows.

Hi All, I haven't been on in ages as life is frantic. But, Daisy has finally got the hang of peeing and posing outside - we are so delighted with this!!! She loves her walk and we are about to move on to "no biting" training with a vengeance (I decided early on I could only manage one task at a time with her).

I also need to train her to be alone - she is never alone and she cries if I leave her for even 5 minutes - I must read back on what you all do.

We have our first puppy training session tomorrow (by Zoom as we are in lockdown). SO that should help.

But she is a delight and we all adore her - to all of you with the puppy blues, it gets better (I was one of you on week 2!!!!).

We have a 5 month old Greater Swiss Mountain Dog. We're working on not tackling the kids!

@annasgirl - send all hints and tips our way :)

Gave puppy his dinner on a licki mat tonight, he’s spent the last 3 hours biting our legs and feet and won’t settle because he’s convinced he hasn’t had his dinner as it wasn’t in his normal bowl

Finally gave in and just gave him an extra bit of food mixed into his bowl as he normally has, he’s ate the full lot and is about to fall asleep...give me strength!

No more licki mat for dinner time

How much do your pups eat? Frenchpup isn't that interested in food. I've been using the guide on the back of the package but she doesn't finish her bowl and needs encouraging to eat.

Our old ddog would wolf her food down the second her bowl hit the ground so this is new for me. It's only been 6 days and she is eating, just not enthusiastically.

took about 3 weeks for ours to eat the recommended amount @Frenchfancy. Before that I was really worried that he wasn't eating enough - at some meals, I'd actually spoon feed him because he was so disinterested

then something happened and he now wolfs down everything and I have to measure out his food!

we did have to change the brand a few times till we settled on something he likes - I don't think he particularly liked the stuff the breeder sent him home with but I also now (with hindsight) wonder if it was a side effect of him settling in

sorry to hear about the lickimat @C4itl - if it's any consolation pupthurs tried to eat the lickimat so we had to throw it away (it's actually remarkably easy for them to rip it, I'm surprised there aren't more issues with that!)

@HappyThursdays Retrieverpup bit off the corner of the lickimat but then I discovered there’s a puppy and tough chewers version which is much better!

Thanks for all the crate advice.

Does anyone use Butternut boxes?