Dog walker calling me out of work.

[tockityboo]

So dog is 2.5 years old.
She's always been a bit hit and miss with recall at the end of a walk, so her recall is 100% during the walk but when it's home time she has in the past given me the run around which meant a few of us have spent an hour trying to catch her on numerous occasions.
She doesn't go far, only 10 metres away, but when you get close she'll spring back, basically playing a game with us.
She point blank refuses to take treats from us when out, even steak, bacon, liver, she will not even take it from our hands or if we chuck it down she'll ignore it.
At home she wolfs down anything and is a greedy madam.
In the end she spent the best part of a year with a long line trailing behind her which we could step on if she was playing up.
Anyway back to the point!
For the past 9 months she's been absolutely spot on with coming back at the end of her walk for me and my husband. We call her, say "down" and she lies down for her lead to be put on.
So that's 2 x walks a day for 9 months she's been an angel.
However she has started messing around for the dog walker.
Twice she has called me at work saying I need to get my dog back as she's running laps round her refusing to have her lead on.
Each time I've left work, called the dog, asked her to lie down and clipped her lead on with no issues.
I'm getting a bit fed up of being called out of work and my manager is getting pissed off.
She is a high breed working type dog so cannot be kept on lead for a walk.
Any ideas?

The loose lead walking thing does need sorting, I agree.
Believe it or not she's done 3 levels of dog training classes and was perfect taking treats and walking like a dream inside a hall or our house. She got the "top dog" award for her class.
The problem is that for some reason she refuses all treats when we are out of the house, so we can't get her walking nicely on a collar and lead as the dog trainer taught us outside of the house.
We've also tried halti harness, gentle leader, canny collar, k9 harness, figure of 8 lead, slip lead.
She doesn't pull so much on lead now on pavements, but has started screeching with frustration.

She's a high energy dog, but you only walk her twice a day for 20 mins, and yet expect the dog walker to walk her off lead when she's had past experience of bad recall?
You should walk her longer in the morning and evening, and allow your dog walker to just take her on a walk with the lead on on a path somewhere.
She's your dog, not the dog walkers.
Would you prefer the dog walker just left her in the park instead of having you come out to get her under control?

Because I only stand of the long line once at the end of a walk, and generally by then she's not running full sprint, just galloping in laps around you playing the fool.
On a retractable lead she would get yanked at full speed at the end of it 20+ times on a walk as she would sprint at top speed

She did used to get a long walk with us morning and evening but the minimum walk the dog walker does is 1 hour.
She was losing weight having 3 hours of walks a day so the vet advised us to cut it down.
Perhaps I'll just scrap the dog walker full stop and do 1 hour off lead in the morning, leave her home alone for 4 hours and then 1 hour again myself in the evening.
I think I worry because the dog rescue wouldn't consider anyone who would leave a dog more than 3 hours, hence we've always paid for a dog walker mid day to break the 4 hours up.

Surely there must be some treat she can't resist- really smelly cheese or a nice fresh bit of hedgehog or something?

A retractable lead for a quick large dog would be dangerous.
Training leads are much better. Annoying that your dog walker doesn’t want to use one, that would solve the problem.

Genuinely re the food when out, we have tried everything! Cheese, bacon, steak, liver, hot dogs!
All she wants is her ball! We've scattered steak on the floor in the field and she's ignored it, if we manage to get a treat near her mouth then she'll turn her head or spit it out! So bizarre.

I would also scrap the dog walker. Being told he/she doesn't use long line leads period and phoning you when you're in work to come and get the dog back on a lead is quite a piss take. Four hours isn't that long to leave a dog in the grand scheme of things.

Ok, if she wants her ball, use that instead of treats. Teach her to walk to heel by using the ball and that if she comes back, she gets her ball. She doesn’t get her ball if she doesn’t come back. You can also use the ball for addressing the issues with the screeching on field walks. Just because your dog is in a field, doesn’t mean she gets to go off lead and play.

Change your dog walker. Your dog walker should be willing to adapt to your dog. All dogs are different and to refuse to use a long line with one is ridiculous or insist she’s goes off lead. Our dog walker adapts to her dogs. Our dog is very adaptable and our walker takes ours along with her to different dogs so we know the different walks our dog gets. So some days ours gets an off lead plod with an older dog, sometimes she gets an on lead walk with a nervous dog and sometimes she gets a manic field run with other dogs. Our dog walker also asked us when we were ready for our dog to go off lead with her and we kept her up to date with her training and what worked for her. Our walker also makes sure she can control any dog that she takes out, which clearly yours can’t. It sounds like your dog walker is actually quite inexperienced around dogs.

Our dog has instant recall ...whatever she's doing, whatever she is interested in but...she pulls like a train when on a lead and we haven't come close to solving this so I understand your problem. They are all different and you can be very successful in one area of training and not so good in another.
However, as others have said, it's not your dog walker's job to have to train your dog. He/she is just paid to walk her. If she really won't come back, it seems you only have a few choices. Either let the dog walker keep her on a long lead or dispense with the dog walker's services. A long training lead would give an adequate amount of freedom but obviously the dog won't be as well exercises as she would be if she could run free. This way she would still be getting two short walks running free at each end of the day. Alternatively dispense with the dog walker's services all together and walk the dog for longer at the start and end of day. Bear in mind though, that winter is coming and you may prefer to compromise with the dog on long lead with walker rather than longer cold, wet walks at the start and end of dark days.

New dog walker! The dog doesn't respect her.

I think it’s worth your idea of trying An hour off lead in the morning, 4 hours alone, and another off lead walk when you get home. Forget the dog walker

Surely the ball is key? If that's what she's obsessed with that's what she needs to be trained with to get her back. Pick up the ball and get her sitting close enough to touch before throwing it again, and at random points put the lead on and take it back off. I had a dog who used to mess about at the end of a walk, so I used to periodically put the lead back on at random points just for a minute, vary my route so she didn't know when the walk was nearly at the end, and leave her on it five minutes before getting back to the car.

As a dog walker - if a dog messed about like that they just wouldn't be let off their leads whilst out with me. If the owner wasn't happy with that, they're free to find a new walker.

I walk lots of dogs each day and I don't have time to spend "up to an hour" waiting for a dog to stop messing about and have their lead put on. I walk one dog on a long line and it can be a real pain tbh - I certainly wouldn't do it in a group setting.

If your dog walks badly on a lead then why on earth have you not put any training in to solve it?

I think your expectations are too high. It's not your walkers fault the dog messes her around - at the end of the day she's a walker, not a trainer and she shouldn't have to spend ages at the end of each walk trying to catch your dog. So she either keeps the dog leashed (which you don't want - but you're happy for your walker to spend an hour of her unpaid time catching her?) or you find another walker - but if your dog messes about for them, you'll find yourself in the same situation.

I'd test leaving her for the four hour period and see how she goes.

If that doesn't work then new dog walker. If you're having to leave work in the middle of the day to sort the dog out, then it defeats the object of
having a dog walker in the first place!

Stop with the dog walker
Exercise her yourself. Use the ball to reinforce recall at the end of a walk by finishing each walk with a ball game.

Putting a lead on a dog that has recalled is effectively punishing them for coming back, so there must be a reward for the recall prior to the lead being attached. Otherwise you're simply training the dog not to return to you

You need to do a lot more training. Did you mention this behaviour to your trainer? I’d want to know if a dog was perfect at class but not taking those lessons home, so I could advise - such as using a ball as the reward when our rather than relying on food which clearly isn’t high value enough out and about.

I’d suggest finding a trainer or behaviourist that will come on a walk with you and observe this behaviour so they can give you advice.

@tockityboo

Genuinely re the food when out, we have tried everything! Cheese, bacon, steak, liver, hot dogs! All she wants is her ball! We've scattered steak on the floor in the field and she's ignored it, if we manage to get a treat near her mouth then she'll turn her head or spit it out! So bizarre.

My dog won't eat food at all when out on a walk. We never carry any food but we do carry two balls. One for emergency if we lose the first ball.

You need to work with the dog walker on this whilst you train recall. I am confused, you don't want her on a lead but the dog walker doesn't want to use a long trailing line? Does the walker want to use a short lead?

Lots of ideas on the thread on how to deal with the problem but none as to why the dog is doing it in the first place.

You have an active working dog who is getting very little brain work and stimulation. Your dog requires more than it is getting. If your dogs life has full of experiences it will be happy tired and able to recall.

20 mins walk is not even a warm up for most dogs. The dog does not want to recall as it knows it is now back on its own with nothing to do. The walk is the only highlight of its day so why does it want it to end

Another idea is to try calling her, putting the lead on, praise, and then letting her off again at random times throughout her walk so she doesn't associate the lead with the walk ending. What breed is she OP? I have a Collie and he would be bored out of his mind if he only had two short walks a day and no mental stimulation. What made you choose a working type dog?

Imo, your dog sounds intensely stressed - refusing even high value treats, spinning, pulling etc.

I wouldn’t leave the house unless she was calm beforehand and any OTT behaviour id stop dead until she calmed again.
Imo, the more you take her out spinning, lunging, pulling, whining etc the worse she is going to get.

Also, I have a working breed from working lines and I have annoyed plenty of people in the past on here by suggesting that my breed (and other high energy working breeds) do not need hours and hours of exercise and training per day, I still very much stand by that, BUT* a 20 minute daily walk if I’ve read correctly, frankly, is an absolute joke.
I give my dog a quick 20 minute walk occasionally but it’s exactly that, occasional.
I wouldn’t dream of giving a pug a 20 minute daily walk let alone a high energy working breed.

Quick re read, you take her out for two 20 minutes = 40 minutes and the dog walker an hour so she gets 1 hour 40 minutes daily?

That’s not quite so bad but still too little imo.
I still think and sounds very hyped up and stressed though, I’d prioritise working on that first.

What breed is she. I have working breeds they don't have to be off leash. Some working breeds are not recommended to be off leash. I use a long training line with mine. They go off leash at a private enclosed field. Mine get lots of exercise on training leash plus they are under control.