concerned about puppy and cat

[lovelylurcher]

Hi everyone,

Would love some advice as my anxiety is ramping up a bit over this. We've got a 5 month old female lurcher who has been with us since 8 weeks. We also have a 14 year old male tabby cat - who is still extremely fast and spritely.

Since the beginning, the cat has shown the puppy who's boss - hissing and swiping if pup gets annoying/too bouncy. Puppy will sometimes persist in trying to make friends (play bowing to cat etc ) but generally seems quite subservient to cat at all times, to the point she won't walk past the cat if he's blocking her way etc, and generally being respectful and calm around her in the house.

However, as we seem to be hitting dog adolescence, I'm seeing more boldness around the cat - and it worries me. We've had a couple of garden 'chase' episodes, though it seems that puppy stops before she really gets close to the cat, almost like she remembers she's frightened of him - and the cat of course gets away anyway. So that hasn't worried me TOO much. Until this morning when the cat got near the puppy's food and she really 'went for' him, aggressively snarling at the cat to back off - which he did.

We normally feed the cat BEFORE the puppy and she's fine with that, so this was entirely my mistake and I know not to do that again. However, I can't help but worry a bit. Various dog have reassured me that if the 'cat is boss' dynamic is set up early enough, that we should be fine. It's certainly seemed to be the case so far, but I'm fretting about instincts and I don't want to stress out my lovely old cat

that should have said 'various dog owners have reassured me'

I think I'd monitor closely, maybe a training lead on the lurcher so you can correct her when she chases the cat. Some lurcher just aren't good with cats, but most canbe trained. Expecting your cat to do the training isn't fair, it needs to come from you too so the dog learns what is and isn't acceptable. Feeding the cat up a height so that it has its own safe space, also using a child gate can help.

@bodgeitandscarper - thanks. we do use a training lead in the house sometimes, but with the comings and goings of 3 kids it's not always possible to have her on the lead whenever the cat is around. We do also praise her when she doesn't chase the cat and monitor closely.

Ultimately I'm really not expecting the cat to do the training - but a dynamic has been set up from the off where the cat was the boss....I just want it to stay that way.

Personally, I really despise the whole ‘cat show dog whose boss’ thing, I just think it’s fraught with so many issues.

The cat being stressed enough to act aggressively, dogs becoming terrified of cats, dogs having enough and fighting back and the cat getting hurt etc.

I would keep an incredibly close eye and I’d start trying to train the dog to ignore the cat.
Definately don’t allow chasing, keep dog permanently on leash if necessary because chasing is very reinforcing, once the dog has experienced the thrill of cat chasing a few times they are, imo, past help because nothing really compares to the thrill.

Lurchers do tend to have a fairly high prey drive, in rescue we don’t tend to rehome to ppl with small furries or cats unless dog previously live dowry a cat.
Just work at the training as he is young enough to learn to leave the cat.

*lived with

Lurchers tend to have very high prey drives - I'm afraid to say there is absolutely no way I would risk having one with a cat, unless I could guarantee I could keep the two separate at all times.

However, now you have the dog, I would recommend environmental management as opposed to trying to train the dog - lurchers (and sighthounds in general) want to chase small furries - training it out of them is like trying to train a cat not to hunt birds.

Make sure the cat has lots of high up spaces he can jump to - cat trees, tables, shelves etc. Use baby gates so the cat can escape the room easily. Feed them in separate (enclosed) rooms and don't let them back in together until both have finished eating - it's not fair on either of them otherwise - far too stressful.

There is an Australian podcast called the Canine Paradigm and in one episode one of the hosts goes into enormous detail about how he desensitised his sister's greyhound to her cat. He said it was a long process and took massive commitment, but this was a dog who already had bad habits.

It might be worth a listen for useful ideas.

Cat is boss is kinda rubbish. They both need to respect each other.

I've got 3 lurchers and 2 cats. 2 rescues who have very high prey drives and the other I've had from a pup. The cats are also rescues. They've all had to learn to live together but it took a lot of effort on my part too. The pup definitely got a lot bolder and started chasing the cats around 12 months old so we just went right back to basics with training. Reward with high value treats for ignoring and distract, distract, distract! If she does chase then a verbal correction might be necessary (I use "Ah ah ah!" and all the dogs know that means NO STOP).

If you let the puppy get away with even a tiny bit of chasing it will just reinforce the behaviour.

Thanks everyone. Maybe I used the wrong wording for ‘cat is boss’ there...I just meant that the puppy came into his home, the cat will understandably react if the puppy gets annoying (just like an adult dog would react to an over-exuberant puppy), and that the puppy has - rightly, in my view- learnt to give the cat space.

The cat also has lots of space to jump up to and a cat flap (and a whole part of house to chill out in where the puppy doesn’t go). I’d say they do have a healthy respect for each other largely - not friends, but they will sleep fairly close to each other on the sofa, for example.

What I was interested in learning was how to help a healthy dynamic between them now the puppy is getting bolder. I’m more than aware that lurchers have a high prey drive (as do certain terriers and retrievers) ....and this is one of the reasons that I didn’t get a retired greyhound or a rescue. Thanks to those who offered training related advice, very helpful

Ddog is pretty subservient to our cats but he won’t let them near his food. He barks and lunges If they go near his bowl but not to the extent it worries me as he doesn’t get close enough to make contact and they scarper anyway

I have a dog and a cat, the dog is older but has always lived with a cat if not the current one. The dog doesn't have high prey drive and he is the same size as the cat. The current cat and the previous cat were not particular feisty. I think it's fair to say they tolerate each other.
We do a similar thing to you the cat can get upstairs and the dog can't, we feed him upstairs and the litter tray is upstairs (he wont go in the garden). Like yours both will sleep close to each other on the sofa and happily walk past each other or for example sit close together on the kitchen floor. The cat has never showed any aggression to the dog. The dog has very occasionally growled at the cat if he's eating and the cat walks by although the cat has zero interest in the dogs food.
Having said all of this I don't 100% trust the dog and we are very strict with our dogs and he has always know that we expect him to behave around the cat he has never chased the cat he knows this would be totally unacceptable. We live in a rural area on a river lots of rabbits etc which (I consider to be vermin) ducks swans etc but I never allow him to chase other animals either.
I guess what I'm trying to say OP is that I suspect you'll never be able to totally trust your dog no training in the world will make a dog totally trust worthy. The problem is once they start chasing their natural instinct to chase and ultimately kill takes over training goes out the window.

What I was interested in learning was how to help a healthy dynamic between them now the puppy is getting bolder. I’m more than aware that lurchers have a high prey drive (as do certain terriers and retrievers) ....and this is one of the reasons that I didn’t get a retired greyhound or a rescue. Thanks to those who offered training related advice, very helpful

The problem is that all the training in the world won't override their natural instinct to chase. There was an episode of a police programme once and the professional handler had lost his German Shepherd who'd bolted after a rabbit - nothing he was trying was making any difference!

Having cats and dogs is always going to be potentially dangerous (no judgement, we have three cats with our dog) especially with a breed with a high prey drive. What you have going on at the moment sounds fine but I would never, ever leave them
unattended - all it takes is a split second.