A couple of teenage dog questions

[Norecallpup]

Hi, my working cocker spaniel is 11 months old. She’s just finished her first season.
Here are my questions..

1. A month or so ago my dog’s recall went down the pan. I’m assuming it’s because of her age. She used to be really good at recall but now on the beach she just flies off after every seagull. She does come back eventually but it’s scary.

I’m considering buying the Total Recall book. Is it worth starting something like that with her or will she just go back to being good eventually by herself? I take her on a long line but she just arses about at the very end of it racing about like a loon and completely ignoring me. I’m concerned that this is rehearsing bad behaviour.

1. My other question is about leaving her by herself. When she was 14 weeks we tried leaving her for 10 minutes on a morning in her covered crate while we went to work/school. The daycare would then pick her up (we kind of planned to extend the 10 minutes so that eventually she’d get used to being left longer). Anyway, she made such a fuss barking and carrying on that we stopped leaving her after about 5 days of trying and would drop her at daycare on our way to work.

The thing is we’ve never dared leave her since. Not even to go to the shop. Obviously it would be nice to be able to go to the cinema etc and we’d like to start leaving her. Is it likely she’ll go mental again? She’s not crated now and is fine by herself at night with the run of downstairs. Should we just go for it? I don’t want to traumatise her. She does still sometimes have a whinge at the bottom of the stairs if I go up, regardless if dh or the kids are with her. Sorry that was such a long post. I clearly have too much time on my hands at the moment!!

1. Completely normal. Just go right back to basics with recall training, so high value treats, call her then run in the opposite direction, reeling in the long line so she has to follow.

1. You could try it agin now she is more settled and comfortable in the house, compared to only being there a few week.

A routine is important when leaving a dog. So into the garden for a wee, then downstairs with a treat/chew, then out the door.

Dogs tend to prefer baby gates to closed doors if that possible? So I shut my dog downstairs with a baby gate rather than closing the door.

I would start really small, one or two minutes. Return when she is quiet and calm if possible. Little fuss when you return, just a calm stroke.
If she is that attached to you, you may want to try leaving first, letting her settle down, then the other family members leaving.

Keep the time you leave her short and build up only when she is happy.

Total Recall is a very useful book and totally worth your time and effort.

There is a FB page called Gundog Training for Novices which is helpful even if your dog is a pet. There are a lot of knowledgeable and spaniel-savvy people on there.

As for the crying when you leave her, @WolfieFan has dealt with a dog with this issue and should be able to help.

Total Recall Is brilliant.
My big girl had awful separation anxiety. (Are through a wall when I left her so I could have a wee. )
I followed the advice on Dog training advice and support on FB. Run by really good forcefree and positive dog trainers. The trick is to never leave a dog with separation anxiety for longer than they’re happy to be left for.
Filming your dog could help you decide if it’s proper separation anxiety. My pup will moan if she can’t see me sometimes. But she’s not anxious. She’s nosy!
It’s a really hard thing to break but you made absolutely the right start by not leaving her to get upset.
Thanks for the tag Grumpy! It’s a hard thing to tackle and much advice is unhelpful or likely to make the anxiety worse. That group is brilliant. (They will also have files on recall.)

@Wolfiefan thanks I’ll have a look at that group on Facebook.
I don’t think she has separation anxiety I just don’t want to cause her to get it by getting the leaving thing wrong. She’s fine if dh goes out early and the rest of us are in bed, she just settles down to sleep. I don’t know if that’s just because she knows we’re upstairs.

I’m just too soft perhaps. People in RL can’t believe we’ve never left her by herself!
@GrumpyMiddleAgedWoman is the total recall thing a verrrrrrrry long process? Do you think that as she was good at recall it will just come back when she’s no longer a teen?
@LochJessMonster thanks for replying. She has access to the whole of downstairs so no doors to worry about. We’ll carry on with the longline. Should I pull her back when she ignores me then or just call her again when she’s finished sniffing/under the hedge/acting like an arse at the end of the lead?

To start I would try and only call her when she isn’t distracted. Call and immediately start running and reeling in the line so she can’t ignore. Don’t set her up to fail, such as calling when you already know she is not going to come back.

Once you’ve reinforced that a few times and she starts heading towards you without having to be pulled, you can start calling when she is heading in the other direction, or sniffing etc

Each time the reward of chasing you and treat/toy/praise at the end should be over the top. Just let when teaching a puppy.

Don’t be tempted to give up the long line too early, the more times she ignores the recall and gets away with it, the more likely she is to do it again.

If something happens and she’s ignored the recall and you can’t get her to come to you (no long line for example), then don’t be tempted to keep calling. She’ll just learn to tune it out.

@LochJessMonster thanks for that. I’m on it!!

My WCS was a complete arse for recall during his teenage years. You can look back on threads on here as he had me in tears.

I did the following:-

1. I didn't use long leads but I did walk my dog in places which were remote and miles away from roads to avoid risks off lead.

1. I used a variety of techniques to get him to watch me rather than me chasing him. I played hide and seek or I waited for him to run ahead and I turned and said nothing and walked away from him. The turning 180 degrees and walking away without calling him had a big impact. He didn't want to lose me and suddenly realised I wouldn't wait for him or call him. I only did this in places where I could see him for miles around so it felt safe for me to practice that.

1. I practiced recall multiple times on a walk and rewarded him with ball play etc and if it seemed like he was in an awful mood e.g. the recall was awful I cut the walk short and put him on a lead.

1. I taught him recall by whistle and started to listen to gun dog trainers that said that spaniels are bred to work closely with humans and if you let them get too far away from you then you have lost control. I therefore 'worked' him all the time on a walk so played find a ball, chase a ball, sit and stays and rewarded with ball play so he never wanted to go far because I was more fun than hunting on his own.

Just to give you hope. BiteyDog was awful for months. I hated walking him because of recall. I can now walk him past dogs, deer, rabbits etc and he comes back straight away because he thinks I am more fun than they are because I 'hunt' with him with a ball.

Now for the leaving. As others have mentioned a shut door is far worse than a baby gate. I have a couple of baby gates and BiteyDog is happy to wait behind them whereas he wouldn't be behind a closed door.

I built that up over time using cameras to watch him and generally getting him used to me being away from him in the house and then outside. A camera that streams to your phone gives you a better idea on whether it's a grumble or anxiety when you leave them.

I found that BiteyDog got upset at shadows from glass doors so we covered them up. He would get upset over cars in the distance thinking we had come home so a radio helped but we found a talking channel caused him anxiety as he thought strange humans were around but a general music channel with minimal talking muffled outside noises and helped. A camera will give you insight on what is causing the anxiety for them which will be different for each dog.

Total recall doesn't take too long IME. Also with a WCS, as Bitey says keep the focus on you: tennis balls to hunt in the grass, hide and seek etc (if he has a sit stay, leave him, hide and then call 'find me!' - I've used this with my dogs and it really perks them up: they know you're there and they have to use ears and nose to track you down). Also don't just trundle along behind him: take a different path without any warning, make it his job to know where you are.

I used a long line to get my younger (and very prey driven) dog steady on rabbits. I'd go out with her at places and times where I knew they'd be, let her stalk, and use the stop whistle. She is bloody amazing around rabbits now less so with squirrels-

But keep up with the training: if he learns that he can leave you and have lots and lots of self-rewarding fun hunting and chasing, you will have a bigger challenge on your hands than you do now. We have a dog locally who is allowed to free hunt through the woods and fields and one of these days she is going to cause an accident.

Also, if you haven't taught the stop whistle, it is a very undervalued command. There are YouTube videos on how to teach it.

you'll get there. patience, consistency, long line and lots of treats. Can you walk him before breakfast? so he's hungry. That's made a difference to my teenage dog, my treat bag is much more desirable than anything else.

once you start to drop the long line then a foot on the end of it will prompt him to come to you. Changing direction without calling him makes him look to you rather than you chasing him. I'm almost at the stage where I can take the long line off again....

Our pup was a bit of a nightmare to leave. I tried starting it from young and building the time up but he was having none of it.
Now he is almost 2 he is fine. He has grown in confidence and will happily take himself alone outside with his bone, sit in a different room and leaving him now is no problem. Could be that as she gets older and more confident she will be happier being separated.
I could tell from about 6 months he didn't have true separation anxiety as he would sit in a different room (albeit for only 5 mins) and wasn't my shadow 100% of the time.