AIBU about "designer" dogs

[mommymooo]

Now I know I'm gonna cause chaos get torn into hopefully agreed with but it's getting silly now with all these new silly new "breeds" of dogs. Cockerpoos sprocks. Jugs. Yorkipoos. Labradoodles. To name but only a few. After reading an article from the man who breed the first labradoodles and fully admitted it was the worst mistake he ever made. It made me think that yes I'm not the only one plus the people at the dog care home. Vets. And rescue I know that also Agree all these dogs that people are paying silly money for hundreds of pounds are nothing but mongrels.
When they breed again the new pups will be even further down the line as mongrels.
Now I know all you Mumsnet people are gonna start going loopy at me but if you think the dogs are so perfect and I do think they are all beautiful I love dogs more than most people there's not much I don't know about them I work with them everyday I have my own.
But try entering one for best in show for the kennel club. Try for any show for the kennel club.
They are not pedigree dogs.
Sorry. Xxx

I have fostered and rescued. When I lost my last dog I wanted to get a different breed, circumstances had changed and prev breed wasn’t ideal. Was impossible to get a rescue as we have a young family and work. Prev dog was never left alone. Always used daycare. But rescues won’t hear you out and have blanket rules. If I had stayed with prev rescue I would have been ok as they knew me for several years and had successfully rehabilitated a few dogs.

The KC are no champions of healthy breeding. Some truly awful ‘pure’ breed dogs out there that the KC have done nothing to try prevent. I have a doodle and was well aware he wasn’t a ‘pure’ breed. I agree that that issue is around irresponsible breeders but u can do your homework ensuring that they didn’t come from a puppy farm and have a healthy lineage. I can trace my doodle back 6 generations and have eye and hip certs for both parents.
He doesn’t shed (well no more then myself) and has a fantastic temperament. Absolutely no regrets, in fact I frequently think it was the best money I ever spent.
I can’t understand breed snobby, surly everyone has a reason for wanting a certain type, big, small etc.
Too many fantastic dogs in rescue but I believe there should be much more responsibility on ownership. If u give up a dog you should not be allowed own another unless you can show you can provide a loving stable environment. Of course there will be times when an owner has no option but these cases should be extremely rare. Any cruelty towards animals should prevent u owning for life.

I agree in part with you on the high, unnecessary price tag on cross breeds and I agree they are often puppy farmed but I think you've come across both very unpleasant and very naive indeed here OP.

Your comment about never being best in show is beyond ludicrous.

The Kennel Club wouldn't know a good example of a breed if it smacked them in the face..

They destroy every breed they get their vile little hands on.

If it they don't destroy them through ugly exaggerated features - Flat faces leading to BOAS, droopy eyelids leading to entroption, massively exaggerated flews leading to dogs that have to wear bibs due to constant drooling etc etc etc they destroy them through too small gene pools and not allowing outcrossing to fix the problems they introduced in the first place.

All of the Collies - bearded, borders, roughs, smooths, they were not bred to fit a certain standard of looks, they were all bred to herd livestock and that was how you judged a good one.
By their temperament and work ability.
And they were far, far healthier for it.

Show me a single 'herding' breed at Crufts that can herd.

A crufts titled bearded collie as far as I am concerned is no collie.
It's a pretty pet.
It's an insult to term it a 'collie'.

Same for the vast majority of titled, Kennel Club Cocker/Springer/Clumber spaniels, English/Irish/Gordon/red and white setters, Labrador and golden retrievers, Beagles, Bassets and a myriad of other working dogs who couldn't do what they were actually bred for if their life depended on it.

How tragic that we actually have distinct work lines and show lines for so many breeds.

Pedigree breeds are in crisis, because of the Kennel Clubs obsession with looks above all else.
No thought to health nor temperament.

It's very telling that all the 'pure' breeds have a (usually long!) list of inherited diseases yet the Kennel Club insist on virtually no health tests whatsoever and where they do, it's a fraction of what the breed actually requires.

The vast majority of puppy farmed dogs are actually Kennel Club registered so not crossbreeds which are ineligible for registration.

And there have been very many cases of appalling abuse by Kennel Club breeders.

Indeed, one of the main puppy farmers who provides puppies to 'dogs4us', who is licensed for the one of the biggest puppy farms in the U.K, with hundreds of bitches was once famous for his Crufts titled dogs..

But you carry on feeling virtuous with your 'pure' Collies that aren't Collies with their sky high COI and health problems that will only get worse over time because of the Kennel clubs stance on outcross until they go the same way as Cavaliers and Dobermanns and will be unfixable without the intervention of those nasty cross breeders.

Agree about KC standards and effects on breeds. I have a basset hound who is from working lines, so athletic and lean and loves running. It makes me very sad seeing KC bassets in shows that are bred for exaggerated wrinkles and droopy eyes, I wonder if they can even run properly.

I have a golden doodle.

We chose her for temperament and to fit our outdoors lifestyle, and need for a dog who can be trained to provide therapeutic support.

She came from a responsible breeder with health-checked parents who we saw, and who provides after care support for all her pups.

I couldn’t give a shit whether my dog is a pedigree breed, a cross breed or a mongrel. She’s right for us and we’re right for her.

The real problems in the dog world are puppy farming, irresponsible breeding, neglectful owners and those who don’t train their dogs properly. And none of those issues are limited to any particular breed, cross breed or mongrels.

@TheMemoryLingers This is it exactly. My friend bought one of the poo cross breeds, when I asked where from she was so excited to tell me about all the various cock/shit/poo mixes they had there. Another friend collected her puppy shit mix on Christmas Eve 😞. These puppy farms are targeting certain people, usually the clueless ones who have no idea.

There’s been shitty owners and shitty breeders since the dawn of dog ownership.

It’s not a new “poo” related phenomenon.

A crossbred pug will be able to breathe. A crossbred cavalier is less likely to have heart disease etc.

This is absolutely wrong. You have no idea what you are getting. A cross bred pig has no guarantee of being able to breathe. a cross bred cav, has no less likely chance of having heart problems because it's a cross breed. The dogs can be worse or better or exactly the same. Lots of dogs are worse off for crossbreeding because the dog selected both have issues and are unhealth tested. So many people think health checked and tested are the same thing.

The problems I have with these cross breeds is the same problem I have with a lot of breeders and potential dogs owners.

Breeders often lie. And potential owners dont do enough research. Poodle crosses are not hypoallergenic. If you have an allergy and dont react, that's luck more than anything else. Cross breeds can come out following either parent (I have known cockerpoos look exactly like my cockers when they are full grown, with the cocker coat) of anywhere in between. And you cant always tell at the puppy stage. A large amount of poodle crosses come through the spaniel rescue I work with. Most surrendered because they didnt get what they were expecting. People dont realise a poodle is a working dog. They believe the poodle will make a spaniel calm and easier and not moult. It's not true. However, this information is widely available and the purchasers have a responsibility to research the breed and breeder too.

That's said this happens with pure breed dogs too. I am on spaniel pages the amount of people who dont know what type of cocker (working or show), even after they bought one. The amount that think they have one type of cocker and they dont. Even people who have bought an older puppy, from a family who is rehoming and the discover the dog is actually at least 2.

I rescued a spaniel pup just before Christmas. I took her on as an emergency foster and decided to keep her. A colleague of mine spent £1600 on a show cocker pup around the same time. I nearly died. He described where the dog came from. Clearly a puppy farm type situation. Lots of breeding bitches, lots of litters of puppies. I am organising him a behaviourist because the dog is so anxious all the time.
He has another cocker so knows the breed but still didnt research the breedwr too much. He believed that because the dog came with papers and was expensive it was a decent breeder.

Its madness but its not exclusive to crossbreeda. However, finding a cross breed where both parents have been health tested is alot more difficult in my experience than a pedigree.

As dog owners we should be, being responsible. Too many people are notm both cross and pure owners.

As an aside I have seen an increase in sprockers coming through the rescue. Another 'cross' that's becoming increasing population and for some reason being sold as a great family pet. Which they are if you have a lot of time and energy to invest in the dog. But this isnt pointed out, often. Also Its not really a cross as cockers and springers are essentially the same dog. They just used to be sorted into size. The small ones then bred as cockers the large as springers. Theres a big debate in Spanish circles wether they should be closed as a cross or pure.

Anyone who pretends that pedigree breeding and buying if pups does not have the same problems as crosses are very misinformed

Kirkman - great long rant/post there. You're spot on, people don't research whether they're buying a pedigree or a specific poodle cross. The internet is full of misinformation, that the poodle crosses are healthier, hypoallergenic, easy to train and good with children.

I have an almost 12 year old 4th generation labradoodle, family tree is standard poodle and working lab. She taught me more than I ever thought I needed to know about poodle independence and the high prey urge that many labradoodles have. I volunteer for a charity that re-homes poodle crosses, so I'm well aware how many labradoodles, cockapoo's, jackapoos etc etc are rejected because they aren't what the owner expected or wanted.

People will buy from puppy farms, pick up puppies on car parks etc. Always make sure your breeder is reputable, not breeding several of the current fave puppies, ask to see health checks on both parents and their family tree/pedigree. Always see the mother dog and if you can't see the sire, ask to see photographs, pedigree or family tree. Don't ever rush into buying a puppy.

A crossbred pug will be able to breathe. A crossbred cavalier is less likely to have heart disease etc.

Not true. There is heart disease, hip dysplasia, eye conditions and hernias in a lot of different breeds. They are mostly GENETIC as in faulty genes. They can only be "eradicated" through selective breeding. Which in turn is done by health testing the parents.

If you cross any 2 dog that carry faulty genes you will still get the same problem as you have with a pure breed.

Totally agree @kirkman and with the pp who said these dogs are expected to be magic dogs.

Some cross breeds are absolutely, melt your heart lovely. But they are not magic. They are a selection of the genetics put in and that's all they can be.

Crossing breeds doesn't magically mean a healthier, non shedding. calmer, friendlier dog and it shames both breeders and owners when they fall for the lies. It also doesn't magically undo generations of poor genetics. Hybrid vigour is not as immediate and straight forward as that.

Wanting a cross breed means you should research two breeds, not one. You should be prepared to end up with any variation of both breeds. And you should put even more effort into breeder selection because you're already starting with the odds stacked against you - as are people who want the more popular/vulnerable pure breeds, such as pugs and frenchies.

All of the (valid) points made on here about cross-breed "breeders" can also be made about "straight" breeds too.
When I got my cockapoo 9 years ago (when they were relatively rare), I scoured the rescue sites looking for one. I couldn't find a single one. Not one, nationwide.
We were possibly lucky, but he has turned out to be THE most fantastic dog. On the odd occasion he's at the vet (he gets ear infections which are also prevalent with spaniels), they rave about him. He's a real "people" dog, and a brilliant family dog, temperament-wise.

What's the point of this post? Were you bored? I have a cross breed, mongrel, designer dog and she's lovely. Healthy, happy, easy to train and she has a great temperament.

I don't need a KC certificate to tell me my dog is great thanks. We did months of research and even longer looking for a great breeder. I'd go for a cross breed any day of the week 🐶👍🏻💕

There’s been shitty owners and shitty breeders since the dawn of dog ownership.

It’s not a new “poo” related phenomenon.

This.

A bonus is that crossbreeds are cheaper to insure and if, like mine, he’s clearly a mix of several breeds, insurance is much cheaper.
I wonder why this Is? Anything to do with mongrels being less likely to have inherited problems?

Given the cost of the 'designer cross breeds' insurance would have to be significantly cheaper to balance it out

Some go for in excess of £1000.

I am not sure an f2 cockapoo is cheaper to insure tbh

F1 or F2