Off-lead dogs approaching my dog

[goodwinter]

I recently adopted a lovely 6yo Lurcher from the RSPCA. All that's known about his background is that he was used for badger baiting and he was found, badly injured, in someone's front garden before being rescued.

Because of his high prey drive, we were advised never to let him off the lead. This is fine for us, but I'm wondering about the etiquette of off-lead dogs. A few times now a dog has come running up to my dog, sometimes barking and/or getting overly excitable.

So far, this hasn't ended in anything other thers make an effort to call their dogs away until after they've reached my dog and started sniffing him. My dog is really laid-back but I have no idea what his history with other dogs is.an a friendly sniff, but what's bothering me is that none of the own

Is the onus on me to shout over and ask someone to recall their dog if it's running up to mine (although sometimes the owner is so far behind the dog that I can't see them at first!)? Or should people call their dogs away before it gets to that point? For the record, if we're about to pass by off-lead dogs while on a walk, we give them a wide berth, but it happens anyway.

And more generally, what's the deal with on/off-lead interactions? I've read that being on a lead can make some dogs feel "trapped" and therefore fearful/aggressive, so I'm always on the watch for that. So far it's all been pleasant, and it's nice to see him interacting with other dogs, but I don't want anything horrible to happen.

@April I'm impressed! Cats are the one and only thing I've seen my dog get wound up over.

My whippet girl snapped and snarled at another dog today, only a young dog, maybe 10-12 months old, who came bounding over to say hello.

My girl is generally off lead, but it was busy where we were walking, lots of kids and swans and ducks and people milling around so I put her on the lead. 2 stupid women with 3 dogs between them, 2 off lead and one miserable looking lab on a harness and headcollar thing were letting the 2 off lead dogs bound over to other dogs, young kids and families with a cheery 'oh he's quite friendly, he just wants to say hello'. I did warn them my dog felt vulnerable on the lead and would may e snap. Then a sad face when she did. Sigh.

As the owner of a dog that could fight your puppy not just growl and maybe give your poor dog issues for the rest of his life, please use a long line to teach recall and believe me your dog will not learn a lesson by being attacked by another dog*

Bloody hell @WFTisgoingoninmyhead, I hope you muzzle your dog before it really hurts another dog. I couldn't live with the knowledge I had a land shark on a lead with no preventive measures to stop it biting. *

There doesn’t seem to be any etiquette as far as I can tell OP.

It makes me pretty cross actually, because if I’m somewhere with lots of dogs (beach usually) I’m usually with my children too. What I don’t need is two growling dogs in the middle of our group!

My ILs looked at me as if I was a loon the other day because I absolutely roared at a Dalmatian to get it to bugger off - owners approx 500m away, windy day, obviously zero control.

I’m extra paranoid partly because we have a staffy (likely to get the ruddy blame) and partly because he got bitten quite aggressively recently by a 'don’t worry he’s friendly' dog.

Sorry, that was useless!
Thanks for the chance to rant though!

CallMeRachel
I don’t muzzle her as she will not hurt a dog unless it is bothering her, she is kept on a lead and in my control at all times, she does not like to be approached by bothersome dogs off lead and any damage to a loose dogs confidence will be done before she even had the chance to try and defend her space. The reason she is so bothered by loose dogs is because she was attacked by one years ago so I keep her safe and with me at all times.

Have you tried the yellow dog method? Awareness needs to increase but is getting better.

I know to recall my dog to on lead dogs and especially when I see a yellow lead/harness. I have a young pup just now who's in training, his recall is good 95% of the time but I'd hate for him to be attacked by a dog who the owners know to be aggressive yet don't muzzle.

I generally avoid others though as I want my dogs to run free without stress.

Sorry to hear that @Frouby, I had no idea I'd have to deal with so much of this kind of behaviour when I became a dog owner. It's not something the research prepares you for!

Ha, no apology necessary @ThursdayLastWeek. Staffies are such gorgeous creatures and it's such a shame the way they're viewed.

CallMeRachel
Yellow dog doesn’t really help this is how my dog goes out and still people let their dogs bother her.

Its a pain goodwinter. She is 7 now. Ds is 5 and dd 14 so a lot ofour walks have involved children and prams. She has bern turned over by bigger, over boisterous dogs chasing her if she runs away, chased onto tge road by a lab and a greyhound, jumped on by a lab and lunged at by a jrt who was on those stupid extending leads while walking off lead but at my heel. She's pretty well trained, 99.9% recall (the one time she didn't come when called was the dogs chasing her and she tried but they kept cutting her off so she ran for home instead), knows to sit and wait and knows 'to me' which means walk to heel.

Doesn't seem to matter though. She still gets harassed. She loves to play too, but on her terms, is friendly and polite to other dogs with manners etc. She just can't stand being mugged.

My rottweiler wears a muzzle and people still allow their dogs to approach!!

“I don’t mind other dogs growling to teach him dog manners”

The other dog minds, why should someone else’s dog be stressed to save you training your dog?

Btw, a muzzled dog can still injure yours, being muzzle punched hurts, a lot, and I’m bigger than most dogs...so I assume it’s worse for a dog and leaves worse bruises.

Does your dog heel and sit under distraction?

I have a dog aggressive dog, she has learnt to sit and stay under distraction and heel properly with no reaction to other dogs so recently I started letting her loose again and when we encounter a loose dog if she looks uncomfortable now I call her and she returns and either sits and stays or walks at heel (depends on how easy I think the other dog can be disuaded) and I use my body to physically block and move the other dog away from her whilst asking the owner to hold their dog for just a moment while we pass, to date, not a single owner has actually been able to successfully recall them straight away..

And to the poster who thinks it’s fine for other dogs to growl to teach manners, it is really really not.

I used to think that way, whenever my dog growled ‘oh she is just setting boundaries, manners etc’.
Then it grew and grew until suddenly I realised I had a very real problem.

It is YOUR job to protect your dog from others and correct poor behaviour.

This is why I no longer walk in places where dog owners don't feel the need to teach recall.

When mine was an adolescent with no recall I drove miles to places and walked at the times when we were unlikely to encounter other dogs to avoid pissing off other dog owners. If there was another dog I could spot them in the distance and walk away.

However as you see on this thread some owners think their puppy will simply learn recall by bounding up to other dogs and getting 'told off'.

MattMagnolia I just hope you have good insurance if your puppy gets attacked because off lead you will be completely liable for any injuries if they get attacked by an on lead dog which they are pestering. Imagine as a person you are walking minding your own business and someone runs up to you and starts shoving and pushing you around? And yes I have been in emergency vets many times and seen owners bringing their dogs in having been attacked by another dog. It happens more than you think and it can take weeks for injuries to heal. It isn't nice for the dog or owner.

My dog isn't aggressive but I have seen him get bounced on a lot by off lead bouncy dogs and he doesn't like it. All he wants to do is play ball and other dogs coming and wanting to play with him again upsets him as he doesn't want to play with them. I therefore still drive to places where most owners have good recall and more importantly are simply wanting to walk their dogs and aren't looking for other dogs to tire them out iykwim. OP maybe look for different places to walk and at different times. Some places do attract owners who don't care more than others.

Mine is always on lead because he’s an idiot an ex-hunting dog with a very high prey drive. He’s also quite anxious and quite submissive with other dogs. I try and do the ‘quick greeting’ with dogs who approach him - 5 or 10 second sniff then ‘good boy, let’s go’ and walk on. I do worry that at the moment he’s actually pretty good with other dogs, and I don’t want him to have a bad experience that makes him aggressive. (I do also spend quite a lot of time thinking grumpily ‘well you’re bloody lucky he’s not on lead because he’s dog reactive, aren’t you?’)

We rescued two very large sister dogs. They had been horrifically treated & had many injuries. They had not been walked or socialised, so when we got them they were very reactive to anything that moved.
They were also in full protection mode, for each other.
In the house & with humans & kids they are perfect, just like two teddy bears.
We have had numerous problems with off lead dogs running up to our (on lead) girls, I always shout & ask the owner to call their dog back. 9 times out of 10, the owner says, it's alright my dog is fine with other dogs!!!
That may well be, but ours most definitely are not!!
I actually had a lady ( use this term very loosely) who stated that if our dogs are that dangerous they shouldn't be let out of the house, all because she couldn't control her dog.
We now get up at 7 to walk our girls so that they have a fabulous free run

OP maybe look for different places to walk and at different times.

Thanks for your replies @BiteyShark :) It's tricky because neither of us drive - there's tons of green spaces and river walks around our house so we didn't anticipate having to go elsewhere to stay clear of badly-mannered dogs/owners!

I actually had a lady ( use this term very loosely) who stated that if our dogs are that dangerous they shouldn't be let out of the house, all because she couldn't control her dog.

See the flip side of this is that it's actually your dogs that have the issue and you that's unable to control them around other dogs.

Dog ownership and walking used to be an enjoyable, social pass-time but it has now become over run with inexperienced people 'rescuing' all these reactive dogs and expecting others to keep away. It's not fair.

Dogs are social creatures and should naturally be allowed to greet each other and sniff. The problem comes when you've got an off balance reactive dog giving out stress / on-lead aggression which can trigger an attack.

I realise lot of this is down to over/back yard breeding but it is becoming a massive problem when so many people are saying all dogs should be on leads because of the lack of socialisation in so many dogs.

I have learned now to recall my dogs when I see a dog on a lead after mine was bitten. The owner was arrogant, rude and aggressive, just like his staffy. No warning harness or yellow lead or muzzle yet his dog had a bad reputation around other dogs. Yet it's everyone else's fault his dog bites

I have learned now to recall my dogs when I see a dog on a lead after mine was bitten.

I'm confused as to why you only learned to recall 'after' yours was bitten rather than before. You see lots of posts that their dogs become reactive after others have run up to them and attacked them.

People have to walk dogs on lead for a variety of reasons, not just reactivity. What about dogs that are recovering from injuries? Why should they be bounced on by off lead dogs? And the argument that they should walk elsewhere where dogs aren't off lead often cones up but doesn't wash because certainly in the uk parks and countryside are there to be enjoyed by everyone.

Dogs are social creatures is nnot the same thing as them wanting (or it being natural for them to) greet every strange dog they came across.

That's not canine behaviour. That's human-imposed behaviour. It's worth being clear of the difference because otherwise you are expecting dogs to behave one way, thinking it's natural for them to do so. In fact, feral dogs would not necessarily meet strange dogs that way and are as likely to fight than greet them at all.

I'd argue that reactivity upon finding yourself face to face with a strange dog whilst constrained (on lead) IS a natural behaviour for the dog and that humans use techniques of socialisation and habituation to try and reduce it.

I'd also argue that preventing reactivity is not about control. You, as an owner, cannot control a dog's biological reaction to something it is afraid of. What you CAN do is understand it and use scientific methods to try and change emotion which will enable you to then encourage different behaviours. The very first step of which is not to ask your dog to do more than it can cope with. i.e. NOT to confront it with a strange dog. Every single time an off lead dog runs up to an on lead dog who is afraid, it immediately undoes a huge amount of training and puts the owner and scared dog back several steps. Even if the owner is well informed, experienced and dedicated to working to get the dog to a better place, an off lead dog rushing it will undo that work. Keeping away from on lead dogs would make real steps towards the world you dream of - where dogs are relaxed around each other.

If you have a highly reactive dog likely to snap then the onus is on you to avoid off lead areas or muzzle. In areas where off lead is permitted you have to expect some dogs approaching in a friendly way though responsible owners do recall if you alert them to a problem. My dog doesn't approach other dogs but he's quite unusual in that respect - if walking on a lead (when I know he can be reactive) I avoid parks.

I cannot disagree with you more, CallMe. People have the right to walk their dogs without being social, which you seem to think involves being forced to interact with you and your off-lead dog.

If your off-lead dog approaches an on-lead dog otherwise minding its own business you are the one with the lack of control. Your dog was the one who triggered the attack - nothing would have happened if it hadn't approached.

As regards dogs being social creatures who need to greet - a balanced, well socialised dog does not go barrelling up to another dog who is throwing out 'leave me alone' signals left right and centre. No matter what the 'he's only being friendly' brigade might think.

People have to walk dogs on lead for a variety of reasons, not just reactivity.

This is a good point. In fact, the reason I had a rant above at the whippet owner was because I am working with Battendog to prevent him being quite SO friendly with other dogs. Ha! I need him to focus more on me and we've been using a trailing lead to achieve that.

This very friendly little whippet ran up, got one sniff of the hot dogs I was using and tried to help himself. Scattered them everywhere and while both dogs were trying to hoover them up, got tangled in the lead. So now I have a fairly fragile little whippet literally tied to a 23kg springer with food everywhere. I could well imagine, even if both dogs were happy to share the food without fighting, that a whippet leg could get tangled and damaged if the springer decided to run off, jump, fell over etc.

I looked up and owner just stared from the other side of the field. Called several times but the whippet did not respond, so the owner just carried on talking to her mate.

In this example, neither dog was reactive and yet the off lead dog was still (imo) in some danger just because of the lead and size difference. This wasn't in a park. It was in the middle of a field.

Incidentally, I am constantly amazed how little food manners some other dogs have. Being mugged by other dogs for hot dogs happens at least once a week. They are in a pouch on my waist and more often that not, a strange dog that approaches me tries to jump up and just help themselves.