Alternatives to parasite treatments

[blueskypink]

I had a lecture from a fellow dog walker yesterday about 'poisoning' my dogs with monthly parasite treatment. She uses garlic, apple vinegar and other natural things to prevent parasites. I was quite dismissive but now I'm wondering if I was too hasty? I don't want flea infestations or my dogs to suffer from the effects of things like lung worm, but equally I don't want to overload my dogs with dogs toxic nasties.

usainbolt I get what you are saying and yes if you had the time then you could probably do it and it sounds like you do.

But a lot of dog owners like myself use dog walkers and day care and it is not possible to do that and get them all. For my situation I know the ticks will be killed before they can transmit disease. Lymes disease is not nice and very prevalent where we are. I am sick of finding them on me even after doing a bit of gardening. I am not prepared to take the risk whereas for others the risk is not as great to them so yes chemical treatment may seem harsh.

Along with worm counts it relies on the owner to do that religiously. It would be interesting to know if the OPs dog walking friend bothers to do worm counts or just assumes her dog won't get any especially as they were so vocal that the OP is poisoning her dog.

Lint roller is interesting. Would still have to check ear folds and foot webs ...that's where I find most of the crafty little sods.

Sigh. It's NOT naive to think that your vet isn't vaccinating just to make money!

I'm a vet and religiously vaccinate my own dogs. I've unfortunately seen lots of cases of parvo which end in heartbreak, and this week I euthanased a dog whose kidneys and liver were failing horrendously , we suspect due to leptospirosis. We would make a lot more money doing titre levels. In my practice all vaccinations are given a full check up first, so the actual cost of the vaccine is about £5. A year. If people don't want to vaccinate Im not going to try to persuade them, but PLEASE don't say it's a money making gimmick.

Similarly if you'd seen a dog die of lungworm you might feel differently. Garlic does NOT repel fleas! I eat plenty of garlic and still get bitten by fleas from some of my less maintained patients! And garlic IS toxic to dogs, not necessarily in huge doses, I have seen dogs with garlic toxicity due to eating the wild flowers.

And while we're at it, it's NOT good for your bitch to have a litter. And vets typically earn around £30k a year, not the millions people think. And your elderly animal that has "never needed to see the vet" probably has.

And breathe.

I agree it does not suit everyones lifestyle and I am not suggesting it is what people do - just giving safe alternatives.. The link roller is kept in the car and it takes a few secs to do each dog (I have 5) before they get in to the car so for me no problem ,it is easier than getting chemicals from the vet, and putting them on the dogs each month tbh or the Seresto collars which do not seem to be very effective in my area.

Worm counting is the easiest thing to do. You have to pick up dog poo anyway so it is no extra task at all.

TropicPluder if you run the roller over the ear folds and feet after the walk the little tic buggers have not had time to get too far under the fur so it does get most of them.

We had sometime 6 tics on each dogs daily but after lint rolling we may get 1 a month and that is spread over all 5 dogs.

Can I make it clear that I am not in a for or against argument and am not lecturing - it is no concern to me what people do - I would hope they will keep their dogs safe and well. I am just giving alternatives.

ThePlatypus - thank you. You've said everything I need to know and have put my mind at rest.

On the subject of tics, we use Advocate which I don't believe covers fleas, lungworm and tics. Because we get loads of slugs and snails in our garden we've always felt it more important to guard against lungworm. Our dogs probably pick up 1 or 2 tics a year. I regularly check their ears, groin and armpits and have a good feel around generally, as part of general fussing but also as our oldest dog has quite a few lipomas which we like to monitor. I hope we're doing enough.

Our eldest is an 11 year old lab - a bit lumpy, arthritic and hard of hearing, but otherwise in rude health - despite her monthly treatments, annual vaccination and six-monthly check up at the vets.

I like the lint roller idea, and for me there's definitely a need for multiple approaches. We're in the tropics and have ticks year round in the garden so not only picked up on walks. I might add lint roller to: spot on, tick collar and daily 'search and pick'. The vet thinks our local ticks are getting resistant to the only available spot on, so waiting for some to be imported

I used to use advocate and a tick collar but BiteyDog didn't like the smell (kept him awake) and I hated not being able to wash him. I now use nexgard spectra which does worms, fleas and ticks which is a monthly tablet. Much better for us personally.

That should have said 'didn't like the smell of advocate'. The tick collar obviously didn't smell

Can you buy nexgard 'to take away' bitey? Or the vet administers it?

I have a MRD1 gene collie who can not and must not be given advocate as it could kill them so this is exactly why we do need to have all the options.

What do you do for tape worm BIteyshark?

Tropic I get it on prescription from the vets but use it at home.

I do use drontal every 6 months as well in addition to the nexgard.

Ironically then my dogs get more cover with the worm count method of control

Going off topic slightly I am at a wedding reception and would rather be discussing worms on my phone than being involved in real life - I need to get more of a life

Yes it sounds like that set up suits you better usainbolt

Sounds like a prefect conversation for a wedding reception. Or maybe that's just the ones I attend

Also unreasonably enjoying parasite chat

tropic you can buy nexgard to take away. Nexgard spectra is off the market at the moment (annoyingly, as it was great having something that did everything!)

blueskypink you sound like a lovely dog owner! I have absolutely no issue with people asking questions, it's great. It sounds like advocate is a good choice for you.

Platypus why is it off the market (someone said they couldn't manufacture enough a while ago so wondering if it's that)?

I have 5 months supply so ok for a bit.

The factory that made the wormer part of it closed down, so they can still make the nexgard, but can't make the spectra. It means you have to give the wormer separately. The bonus is that, having realised this has annoyed us vets, they are giving us the nexgard free while we are waiting on the spectra coming back. We have chosen to pass this saving onto our clients, giving the nexgard for free and just charging for the milbemax, so it's a great deal at the moment!

Usain do you think the lint roller would work on a hairy spaniel? And does it not risk pulling the body of a tick away leaving the head embedded, which causes higher risk of infection in the dog?

Round here vets haven't been recommending tick treatments, until very recently, because they were very uncommon. My vet started stocking one type of tick treatment late last year, as there was apparently an increase in the area.

Both my dogs appear to have picked up ticks in our garden! Dog1 got one on his head recently and bathing very hairy spaniel dog2 yesterday evening, I found 3 of them on his ear (still very, very small so presumably very recently attached) and he hadn't been out on a walk for 36hrs, so I think they had come from my garden. (they'd missed the walk the day before due to sick child unfortunately, but did go late last night when mom was able to come over to stay in house with DC whilst I took them out).

I'm going to swap on to the tick killing deflea and worming program now.

Re worm count it can't check for one type of worm can it? I can't remember the worm name but I'm sure there was one that can't be tested for. Also dogs don't shed worms all the time, so can have a burden without it being picked up in worm counts.

Re vaccinations I don't know of a single vet who does the ones recommend for booster every 3-4years more often than that.

Vaccinations

• Boosters for distemper, parvovirus and canine hepatitis are needed every 3-4 years

• Boosters for leptospirosis are needed every year.

• you can choose to titre test, which checks how well their immunity to the relevant diseases is functioning. However it's more expensive, so most people don't and just do the booster.

Thanks for the info Platypus, hope they get the manufacturing sorted soon as I really like nexgard spectra and wish I had started on that from the beginning. We get no side effects from it either.

Swimming I know we have them in our garden as I have been gardening before and been reaching up to cut branches and found one attached to me afterwards and that's before we got the dog. I have a spaniel and have found them crawling in his ears before but the worst was when a couple attached close to his eye, right on the edge and eye lid. Fortunately as the medication kills the ticks they fall out easily afterwards.

Ouch your poor dog getting them by his eyes.

They really freak me out - I think it's worse that they were never on my radar pre-dog as they weren't common around here.

I ended up trimming dog2 fairly short all over, to make sure there were none on his legs that I hadn't been able to find. Must say it surprised me how little dog there was under all his fuzz. He looks quite narrow now.

They're vile aren't they? My heart sinks when someone is stroking a dog and says, "hmm ... what's this?"

In a flash I have the dog in question on the sofa, reading light trained on the potential intruder, tick hook in hand ....

Once it's out, everyone gazes in disgust at the wriggly little legs before I dispose of it - usually in the toilet with half a bottle of bleach