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Original poster

Help/advice needed re: DC and DM dogs

28 replies

DogProb · 01/09/2017 23:48

Genuinely unsure what to do here so could really do with some advice on how to handle this situation.

My DM and her partner (DSF for ease) have two terrier type rescue dogs that they have had for around 10 and 7 years. They are quite barky and yappy.

The eldest one seemed to be not so bad to start with but is now about 12 and is getting quite cantankerous with old age.

The younger one is quite playful but also a bit nippy when excited.

I have DD8 and DS4. Last summer the younger dog nipped DS on his finger, no blood was drawn and it was in play rather than aggression but he's remembered and both kids are quite nervous of the dogs.

We've come to stay and I've tried to ease their fears whilst at the same time keeping them away from the dogs as much as possible (not hard as they don't want to be close to them!).

However last night DS was saying goodnight and went to hug DSF who was sat on the sofa with older dog. Out of nowhere (i.e. No growling etc) the dog snapped at his face.

DS was inconsolable and I took him straight up and calmed him down. However today he's clearly more nervous and is asking to go home.

I'm not sure what the response was to the dog but when I came down DSF had disappeared upstairs to bed with both dogs (apparently because he felt bad) and my mum was very upset and apologetic.

I'm due to stay another couple of days however I'm finding it quite hard work now as the kids are very clingy and every time the dogs bark (i.e. A lot) they jump out of their skin.

We are due to stay at a cottage with the wider family over Christmas and I now feel very anxious and stressed over it. I feel so bad for the kids as they clearly dislike being around the dogs (and as an aside, we have other family members with friendly dogs who they love so it's not a fear of dogs generally). I also will feel like a can't relax and have to keep an eye as in a situation with lots of people and excitement I feel that a nip could happen quite easily.

There is some history with DSF and his relationship with the dogs and our children so I know whatever I do (other than doing nothing) is going to lead to an issue, but at the moment I just feel like it's unfair on the children (and us) to spend Christmas on edge.

So, advice. Is there anything that can be done about the dogs behaviour considering their age? They are very dominant and allowed on sofa/to sleep on bed and not much discipline as far as I can tell so I'm not hopeful of this. There are other (lovely, larger and used to children) dogs going to be there at Christmas and the smaller dogs totally dominate them.

WWYD in this situation? Accept that we should change plans for Christmas for the kids sake (would be very upsetting for my DM and also other family members who rarely see DC and are really looking forward to having kids around at Christmas).

Suggest kennel for the dogs (I do actually think this is cruel on the dogs and will definitely cause a fallout with DSF)

Something else I haven't thought of?

Can't sleep, this is really stressing me out. I feel like my first priority has to be to protect the kids. I just want to spend Christmas with my family without this stress.

OP posts:
Ummmmgogo · 01/09/2017 23:53

protect your kids. they have already been bitten it could be worse next time. tell extended family you can't come because of the dogs. leave it up to your mum to decide whether she wants you there more or the dogs there more. there is literally nothing else you can do do go to bed! xx

Original poster
DogProb · 01/09/2017 23:56

I know you are right and I do need to do this. My mum wants us there more
I am sure, it's DSF.

He never had kids and the dogs are his 'babies' (he's said this) so it will result in him probably not coming and issues between him and my DM.

I know that's not my fault - I guess I just needed to hear a few other opinions that saying this is definitely the right thing to steel myself
For the fallout

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Dontfuckingsaycheese · 01/09/2017 23:57

I can't imagine a crowded cottage is any dog's idea of a good time. I also have a little terrier who is completely loved by all but he has real resource guarding issues and his main resource is me, sofas or beds. If a young child came up to me to hug me he would snarly scary growl.

Wolfiefan · 01/09/2017 23:59

Dogs separate from kids or don't go.
You don't need to crate the dogs. Stairgates or use of a room divider would work.
FWIW there's no such thing as a "dominant" dog. Pack theory is outdated. These dogs are untrained. That's different.
Your kids come first.
And yes. I'm a dog owner too.

Dontfuckingsaycheese · 02/09/2017 00:00

I could understand them wanting their dogs around them for Christmas but not fair on them or you really. There are nice home stay carers but may be tricky for Christmas.

Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:00

So what would you do in that situation Duck (other than not book the cottage in the first place!)

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Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:02

Sorry I meant don't not duck!

A home cater is an interesting idea

Not sure stairgates etc viable where we are staying due to layout

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Wolfiefan · 02/09/2017 00:03

How about saying it was clearly stressing the dogs and kids out last visit. Either dogs separate from kids at cottage or one or other of them stay away. (Dogs and them or kids and you!) leave it to them to decide which.

Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:03

And yes they are definitely untrained and undisciplined. I'm nervous of them and I grew up owning dogs!

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BlueKarou · 02/09/2017 00:03

You need to start from scratch with the kids and the dogs. For the rest of this visit dogs and kids need to be kept separate. The dogs can have their sofa space after bed time whilst you're visiting.

Slow socialising can be restarted at a speed your kids are happy with - nothing is going to make a dog more snappy than fearful and jumpy kids. That's not fair on either the kids or the dogs.

If you don't see your mum often then it's unlikely you'll get back to a comfortable place by Christmas.

Dandeliondelilah · 02/09/2017 00:03

Since the dogs have already snapped (and once drawn blood), I think the only sensible choice is to keep your kids away from them.

My grandmother had a jumpy, highly strung and badly trained dog when I was a child; I hated it. She was very good about keeping it away from me and my brother, but I remember the sheer terror of the occasions we did cross paths - and the relief I felt aged about 11, when it died a horrible death in a road accident.

To this day, while I love animals in general, I am utterly ambivalent about dogs. That one dog really coloured my attitude to canines. And I was never bitten, just jumped at.

Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:05

That's my fear Dandelion, that this experience will give them a phobia of dogs.

So hard to keep the bloody things separate in my mums tiny house. I need to have a quiet word tomorrow without the whole thing kicking off

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Ummmmgogo · 02/09/2017 00:07

I don't know him but I don't trust dsf to keep the dogs separate enough. I would be saying me or the dog to dm xx

Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:07

They haven't actually drawn blood though, luckily the face snapping didn't make contact

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Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:11

I don't trust him either.

I didn't stay with my DM for the first two years of DDs life (she came us) due to a truly psychotic rescuer terroir that had probably been used illegally for badger baiting. Stayed once and dogs were put in kennels and it led to a massive fallout with DSF where the 'babies' comment came out and he told me I shouldn't drive with her if I felt like that as it's far more dangerous. This is a dog that I had seen go for various adult family members and which would alternate between jumping on your lap
For a cuddle and then snapping when she'd had enough. He never ever properly disciplined or chastised when this happened so for everyone apart from him the dog was thoroughly unpleasant to be around

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CornflakeHomunculus · 02/09/2017 00:12

There's no reason the dogs' behaviour couldn't be dealt with (either via training or by appropriate management to keep them and everyone else happy and safe) but your DM and DSF would need to be prepared to put the effort in to do so.

Have you any idea if the older dog has been to the vet recently? There are all sorts of age-related conditions which could be causing the older dog to be more short tempered than usual. Being cantankerous is a common early indicator that a dog may be uncomfortable or in pain. Failing sight and/or hearing can make a dog anxious and easier to startle.

It doesn't sound like a busy family christmas is going to be either safe or enjoyable for people or the dogs themselves. It's not fair on you to have to try and keep your children away from the dogs, not fair on the children to be scared all the time and not fair on the older dog to be put in a position where they feel insecure enough to snap.

Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:12

Was so relieved when the dog died TBH

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Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:13

No idea about the vet etc, but as above, I have zero faith in any kind of training happening.

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fairypuff · 02/09/2017 00:15

They haven't drawn blood.....yet OP. It's only a matter of time by the sounds of things and I would be saying no way to the dogs at xmas. Seriously, what gets priority, your kids or the bloody snapping dogs?! It's a no-brainer and if ur DSF can't see that then fuck him, he's an idiot.

Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:16

Will mention the vet thing though, and frame it that DSF should be concerned because if there was a proper bite to someone I'd imagine the chances of the dog being PTS are fairly high? (No idea really?)

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Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:21

Yes I know you are right fairy

Also DH not here and doesn't know so when he finds out he will be furious so us and dogs going together is not going to happen, just wanted to check I wasn't being unreasonable (we don't really do confrontation in my family!)

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HeartsTrumpDiamonds · 02/09/2017 00:23

You can't put your poor DC through this.

I would start the conversation with "Mum, what are we going to do about Christmas?" It's not fair on the dogs or the DC. See what she says.

Could you rent the cottage next door?

HeartsTrumpDiamonds · 02/09/2017 00:23

*Wishful thinking

Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:30

Well there are actually two (interconnecting) cottages!So potentially the dogs could be kept separately in one. Still not sure how that will go down with DSF (i.e. He likes to have them on his lap) but it's worth suggesting that we keep them apart in the smaller one. Might actually be fairer on the dogs to be in a quieter place and DSF could then visit whenever he wanted

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Original poster
DogProb · 02/09/2017 00:31

Actually feel a bit stupid not thinking of that. Though it still depends on DSF actually keeping them apart

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