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Original poster

15 week old puppy attacking 9 week old puppy

64 replies

CadburyChocolateCrunchie · 04/09/2016 08:04

Good morning,

I have a 15 week old Shih Tzu and yesterday I brought home a 9 week old Shih Tzu as a playmate. I know that a lot of people will say you shouldn't have two puppies at the same time, but I weighed up the pro's and con's of having another puppy and decided to go for it. I went into this fully expecting and knowing that it is going to be incredibly hard work until both dogs are older.

The older one absolutely loves other dogs, plays with them in the park off lead, gets excited when he sees other dogs etc. So I wasn't expecting the reaction that I've had from him towards the new puppy.

He ignored her to begin with and then started trying to play with her (all she wants to do is sleep!) and now he is constantly trying to bite her. I don't think he's being vicious, probably just trying to play.

How can I help him to learn that biting is not acceptable? I live in a bungalow and have got a stair gate between the lounge and the hall, so one side there is the lounge and kitchen and the other side is the hall, bedroom and bathroom. I've been shutting the bathroom and bedroom doors and every time he bites, putting him the otherside of the gate from me and the younger puppy so he is just in the hall. But he barks and cries and gets destructive.

I am prepared to do anything (other than rehome the little one!) to help him to accept her.

OP posts:
AlpacaLypse · 04/09/2016 12:26

Cadbury absolutely everyone here (and we're all experienced dog people) has advised you to rehome. By insisting on keeping both, you are putting your own needs way above those of the two little dogs whose welfare you are responsible for. Puppies are not children and your comparison is absurd.

TrionicLettuce · 04/09/2016 12:28

Split them up. They should be spending more of their time apart than together. Don't allow free play between them if it just descends into biting on either side.

The older puppy won't learn to stop biting quickly if a) he can bite her with wild abandon without retaliation (not that you should be putting her in a position where she needs to) and b) she's going to be biting him until she's old enough to learn not to. Which again will take longer if she has the older one to act as her permanent chew toy.

They need to be raised independently of one another, not as a pair. If you don't have another adult on hand to take charge of one puppy whilst you have the other then chances are this is not going to work.

Bubble2bubble · 04/09/2016 12:29

At a guess whoever sold you these pups didn't give a damn what happened to them, so returning is not an option.
It's easy to get sucked into the idea of your pups playing happily and wearing each other out but in fact the reality is quite different.
It's tough to come on here and ask for advice when you realise you've done something daft, but please understand that because of the difference in ages you are going to have to keep these two separate for quite some time.
Stairgates around the house are a good idea.
Each pup in time will need to be socialised and walked and trained separately. Even with this they are not guaranteed to become friends for life or even like each other, but it is your only chance of making it work at all.
Please don't listen to anyone who tells you to leave them together to sort it out themselves everyone has an opinion on puppies

miserablemoo · 04/09/2016 12:29

If you are determined to keep them then you must keep them separate. Only have them together when you can watch them carefully and at all times! But please have a think about returning one of them. The situation is unfair on both dogs.

Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost · 04/09/2016 12:32

If you'd got them at the sametime it mightn't have been a problem. But. As Far as your older pup is concerned.
This new little pup is a rival to him who is taking his lime light from him.

phillipp · 04/09/2016 12:33

The only way you can guarantee the female doesn't get pregnant is to have tem done early. Which can cause a whole host of problems.

You say you know exactly what you are doing but did not anticipate that a 15 week old pup would struggle with how to treat a younger pup and already having problems a few days in. So you can't know exactly what you are doing.

Again....what was on the 'pro' list?

PolterGoose · 04/09/2016 12:37

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

PolterGoose · 04/09/2016 12:40

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Swatsup · 04/09/2016 12:40

"I went into this fully expecting and knowing that it is going to be incredibly hard work until both dogs are older.

The older one absolutely loves other dogs, plays with them in the park off lead, gets excited when he sees other dogs etc. So I wasn't expecting the reaction that I've had from him towards the new puppy."

You say you knew it was going to be hard but yet seem surprised by his reaction to the new puppy???

sealsandbeachballs · 04/09/2016 13:05

I feel the same Polter. It smells a bit of omg pups like this are selling for x amount think of how much we can make.

Otherwise I see no explanation for not wanting two pups when the first one came available and not allowing the first one to settle in for more than five weeks before deciding you desperately wanted a second and a female at that.

TrionicLettuce · 04/09/2016 13:32

Have a read of this article OP. None of it is exaggeration and it's going to be even harder for you given the differing ages of the puppies.

pigsDOfly · 04/09/2016 14:03

Well clearly you don't know what you're doing otherwise you wouldn't be insisting that you're right to do this when anyone who knows anything about dogs would think it's madness.

Not sure why you came on here asking for advice when you then go on to say you're right and everyone else is wrong.

You're not going to be able to stop the older pup biting the younger one and no one on here is going to be able to give you a magic formula to enable you to do it. You're being unfair to both these poor puppies but obviously that doesn't matter to you, as you think you know best.

Madness.

LilCamper · 04/09/2016 14:18

Trionic, that was the first link I posted.

Basically one dog will learn to be a bully, possibly starting to do it to dogs outside the home. One dog will learn to be a victim, become increasingly timid and never get to develop a decent personality.

Yep, totally responsible thing to let happen Hmm

Doubt OP will be back because we are all wrong.

CreepingDogFart · 04/09/2016 14:28

Even a minor amount of research would have shown this to be a bad idea. OP is an idiot.

WatchingFromTheWings · 04/09/2016 14:32

Very selfish thing to do. Those poor pups. Even rescues full to the brim (ones that I know of anyway) will not house 2 pups together within 6 months. Not even from the same litter.

Daftaboutthecat · 04/09/2016 14:48

Cadbury please listen to the advice on here this situation is so unfair on both pups and is only going to end in disaster.

Florin · 04/09/2016 15:04

You need to give one up, it is very unlikely to work. What if you have to keep them separate for life? You say you did your research but you obviously didn't otherwise you would have realised what a disaster this would be. It is not recommended to neuter before 2 so what do you plan to do with them when the female could have 3 seasons during that time? It must have been an extremely dodgy breeder you bought the 2nd dog off as no decent breeder would let you get another so soon.

Hoppinggreen · 04/09/2016 15:56

A good friend of mine got her 8 month old Husky an 10 week old playmate and it almost killed it.
You do NOT know what you are doing, you have NOT weighed up a thing and you are being very selfish.
Good job it's against MN rules to call someone a fuckwit or I might be tempted.

Greyhorses · 04/09/2016 18:15

I have a dog that I made mistakes with as a puppy, she was bullied by another puppy (same age but different litter) owned by a family member and my older dog was very rough with her when playing. I thought it would help her having a friend but it just caused lots of problems with rough play turning into fighting. She also grew up very fearful of other dogs after being accidently hurt a few times.
It was one of the things that caused her to be seriously fearful of other dogs and she ended up dog aggressive.

It wasn't the only thing that caused the aggression but if I got another dog I would not allow any form of rough fighting type play again and I wouldn't get a second until the first is 100% trained. If I was you I would send the younger pup back.

Can you consult a behaviouralist to work with you so you don't make things worse?

I wouldn't punish him as he will resent her even more.

Cherryskypie · 04/09/2016 18:44

It's not fair to punish the 16 week old puppy for being a puppy. Their behaviour is age appropriate. The problem is that they are around a very young pup.

When our big dog was about 6 months old we took them back to their breeder for grooming. The breeder had a litter of 7 week old puppies and he let us have a quick look at them. I said it was a good job they were all taken as I'd forgotten how squishy and lovely they are when they're tiny. He said he wouldn't have let us have one anyway as our dog wasn't old enough yet and could hurt the puppy without meaning to. He suggested we wait until they were 18 months as a minimum before bringing a puppy into the home.

Cherryskypie · 04/09/2016 18:50

I also find it hard to imagine coping with two puppies at once. They demand so much time and patience and you've got such a short window to get them learning to walk nicely and build up recall before the hormones kick in and you have to teach it all over again.

Booboostwo · 04/09/2016 20:09

Come on OP, you've made a mistake but everyone makes mistakes. Don't let it turn into a huge mistake. Think what it will be like having to rehome one of the dogs a few months down the line after they have developed challenging behavioural problems. Rehome the young one.

CreepingDogFart · 04/09/2016 20:40

OP won't come back because she knows best even though lots of experienced dog owners and dog handlers are posting. Sod the welfare of the dogs, it's all about ego. Poor puppies.

phillipp · 04/09/2016 20:44

I think booboo and creeping are right. It's a mistake and I think the op is so determined to not admit it's a mistake that she will carry on regardless.

Which is so unfair.