Our dog has bitten DS - what can we do?

[BirdyArms]

This evening our 1yo saluki cross bit DS1 (11) on the face making a quite a deep puncture wound above his mouth. DS was lying on the floor next to dog stroking his ears, DS2 stepped over dog and he bit DS1's face without any warning growl. This came completely out of the blue, he has never snapped at the DSs before. He is quite an aloof dog and I realise has always tolerated being stroked rather than enjoyed it. Occasionally he has growled at DS1 (never at the rest of the family) and DS1 knows that he needs to leave him alone then. I was in the room and the boys definitely weren’t being cruel to him, and as far as I know have never been. We are staying at my mum’s for a few days and dog doesn’t really enjoy being away from home which I think is a factor.

Having talked it over with my DH we really don’t think that we can keep the dog. The boys love him and this isn’t an easy thing to decide, I have been in tears and am dreading telling the boys. We've had him since he was a puppy, from a rescue that found a pregnant dog so he hasn't had a traumatic life, and I feel that we have failed him but am not sure quite where we’ve gone wrong. We took him to training classes, socialised him by the book etc. But I know that if the boys were more badly bitten in the future, or if he were to bite any of their friends or cousins, I wouldn’t be able to forgive myself. I know from having read posts on here before that some of you will say that the DSs shouldn't touch him on the head, step over him etc. and I can see that this wouldn't have happened if we'd been stricter about these things. But I feel that now he has done this we have gone beyond that. I'm not sure that it's realistic to have a family pet that the children can't stroke.

I have emailed the lady who runs the rescue that we got him from but have just read on their website that they don't rehome aggressive dogs, so I don't think that they will take him. Is there anyone who will? He is a stunningly beautiful dog and I am often stopped by admirers. He's good in lots of other ways, calm and well behaved but he is generally nervous, despite being well socialised. It would seem dreadful to have him put to sleep but I'm not sure what other options there are?

OP. I am really sorry this has happened to you, I hope you and your DS and surrounding family are ok

Firstly, yes, the dog should be re-homed. I assume you don't want him to go to an abusive home, or be used as bait for dog fighting or another home with children? Then don't advertise on Pet4homes of similar, that is probably the stupidest suggestion I have seen on here for a long while. A reputable rescue all the way, who will assess the dog professionally and vet any potential home. Good for you for knowing this to be the case.

Second, this is an aloof dog, a dog that you know is uncomfortable and aloof at times. The problem is, we attribute human emotions to canine behaviour. Dogs have to learn to accept being touched on their face. Many learn to love it. But it's not that natural for them. Some never feel comfortable. Sounds like yours doesn't.

You son was lying on the floor with your dog, touching him. Your other son stepped over him. Put yourself in the dogs position. He's uncomfortable anyway as you know. He reacted. He will have given warning signs, they are entirely subtle though, I don't always read mine properly, it's an art!

We do horses in this family too. I have a rock solid old 22 y/o who tolerates all manner of dogs, kids noise under and over and around him. I cannot be 100% sure that, if I was behind him, and he spooked, he wouldn't kick out. Thing is, with a horse, they are big dangerous animals, so you take better precautions. But dogs are too, or can be, yet we subject them to all sorts of situations and don't give them the respect that they deserve.

Hugs to you

Also has the dog been checked for any medical issues? If he is in pain somewhere and a child is hovering over him he might have snapped out of fear of being hurt.

A representative from the Kennel Club was interviewed by Claire Balding who in the animal world hasn't been! and he was giving a clear warning on these new "designer breeds" where 2 pure pedigree dogs are crossed to make, what is essentially, a mongrel. He was saying that, even because we know the genetics of the pedigree breeds and their problems, we can screen and breed away from them to help avoid them (think, Labradors for their hips and eyes for example). When 2 pedigree breeds are put together, it has to be done properly from screened parents to ensure that the genetic combination doesn't bring up a new problem (by putting a labrador with hip dysplasia to a newfoundland with cardiomyopathy, you could get a paralysed pup that has a heart attack).

What is increasingly worrying is how many "designer breeds" are ending up in the same position as your dog is finding itself in. Salukis are pretty chilled dogs but they need a lot of exercise, same with a lurcher - put them together and you get a very highly energetic dog! They get bored really easily and need mental stimulation as well. If they are not getting this, then they will snap.

When you own a dog, you shouldn't "humanise" them but you can see them from a psychological angle. If you don't tend to their emotional needs as well as their physical needs, something's gotta give!

At the end of the day, you don't have a lurcher, you don't have a saluki, you have a "both" and you actually have no way of knowing exactly what to expect......... and that has proved dangerous in this case.

I do hope this friend thoroughly disinfected it? I would keep an antiseptic dressing on it, and a very close eye on it. You don't want that getting infected on his face.

We had a Saluki lurcher and she was quite aloof, and was known to guard food. She had snapped at my children on occasion if they tried to take food off her and grazed DD3's arm once, but we learnt to leave her alone around food and she was okay.
She was the sort of dog that lip licked, yawned and stared into the distance if you made too much of a fuss of her, and I would not have felt comfortable letting the kids lie down next to her. She used to curl up on the sofa next to the kids though, and was fine when it was on her terms.
She always reminded me of a cat and I'd always let her come to me for some fussing, we never went to her.
I do think this breed is not that great around kids and your dog would probably love to live with someone who had some lurcher experience and didn't have kids.
She died last year and we didn't get another lurcher but another rescue crossbred who has come with his own issues, but biting isn't one of them!

If you're going to rehome him, please do not do it yourself, you are absolutely right about what sort of people are likely to want him. If the rescue you got him from won't take him back then look for another one.

For what it's worth I think with the help of a behaviourist you could potentially live happily with him (safely) but whether you want to or not is a different thing, it will take a lot of work.

I suspect you have a dog on your hands who has been ignored for a long time, he's been throwing off all the signals he knows to tell you all what he's uncomfortable with and you haven't spotted them because they're not verbal...dogs don't unfortunately always read the handbook that says humans expect a growl.

Am absolutely not piling in, OP - it sounds as if you have tried to do things right and are thinking sensibly now.

For my opinion, this is a dog now who is only just starting to come to maturity, and I would imagine things would only get worse. I absolutely agree this dog is not in the right home, but it sounds as if he would be fine in a breed appropriate home. I hope the rescue that you got him with will work with you to that end.

I do get a wee tad frustrated (in general, not at you in particular) at the lack of acceptance of dog types, and the fact that many seem to think that 'a dog is a dog'. They really really aren't. 'Aloof' is in a Saluki's DNA, to the core, and it sounds as if your dog has taken that side of his heritage very strongly.

When buying a dog people - whether it be a pedigree or a cross - look at what the breed(s) are meant to do for a living, whether crossed breeds are compatible, and with crossbreeds look at whether you can live with it if your dog inherits 99% of its characteristics from the one parent, cos Nature doesn't often give the ideal mix!

My DH had a very disabled but strong brother, they also had a lurcher his brother used to pet and pull that dog about very roughly, the dog did nothing because he was a good trustable dog

You know little monkey that there is more in that kennel club interview about the justification of pure bred dogs. Mutts live longer and healthier in general- go ask the insurers.

Op poor you, it's a shock but lots of people who are good would have your dog but you need to find them via breed rescue (often do crosses too) or the breeder or another decent rescue.

Or you change how you manage everything - I never let my dogs around my babies and toddlers unless I was there leading the activity and the kids were doing As they were told. I don't leave babies and toddlers by dogs even when I am right there. By the time kids are 3-6 depending on the child/dog then they can hang out - maybe changing your set up would work for you?

Good luck with what you decide

Actually ClassicCoast, the most recent research seems to show that crossbreeds are not inherently healthier: www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/pets-health/10762988/Pedigree-dogs-as-healthy-as-mongrels-say-vets.html

This is perhaps due to the fact that 'mongrels' used to involve a good deal of natural selection, rather than someone deciding to breed Fluffy x Poochy (who probably weren't the best examples of their breed in the first place) for some holiday funds.

There is also some argument around the fact that insurance statistics are skewed, because pedigree owners are more likely to insure than crossbreed/mongrel owners.

I frankly don't care what dogs people own. I personally wouldn't buy any dog - pedigree or crossbred - that I couldn't see temperament and official health statistics for several generations, but that's me.

Anyway, that's not helping the OP LOL.

I know that there are things that we should have done differently. I thought that I was getting more a general Lurcher. His mum was part saluki and dad unknown but I think now his dad has a lot of saluki in him and my dog looks more or less like a full saluki. I didn't do enough research into Salukis, I've had spaniels and retrievers before and knew some lurchers and whippets but have never come across a dog that is quite so cat-like.

We have worked hard on some aspects eg resource guarding - kids used to put bits of food in his bowl when he was eating, and this has never been an issue. But I haven't been strict enough about the kids letting him have space. I really hadn't realised how stressed he was by it. But having said that whilst I'm typing this he has just layed down and put his head on DS1s feet so he's not completely aloof, but it just has to be on his terms. His warning sign is yawning, I know this but I haven't taken it seriously enough. It genuinely was a shock that he bit.

Also I know that ds1 is his least favourite family member and do remind him to do training with the dog to strengthen their bond, but not been conscientious enough about this. I'm not sure there's any one incident but ds1 doesn't respect him enough eg there are lots of chicken shop bones on the streets near us, ds1 used to be very quick to take one from the dog if he got one, ds2 wouldn't dream of it. Dog let ds1 do this, and after the first couple of times I told him that I needed to do it, but think this might be where it started.

I really don't want to cause you further upset but you need to contact a suitable rescue. He doesn't need to be pts like some people are saying. Ridiculous to say that. How do you know there's not a very good reason he doesn't like your child? You say he's not his favorite but there maybe a reason why that you don't know about.

Please do not attempt to rehome him through papers or Facebook. You'll have all sorts of vile people that will not be nice to him, quite the opposite,Let a specialist rescue rehome him. He needs a home without children by the sounds of it. Nothing wrong with that at all. He certainly shouldn't be pts and I'm disgusted by other posters suggestions that he should.

My concern is he gets a good, loving, forever home. I was bitten very badly (required surgery) by a dog as a child, I know lots of people who were. I have dogs now and always have. From rescue to grave. Let this poor boy have the best chance in starting a new life.

I have heard back from the rescue that we got him from. They are going to try to find a home for him so hopefully things will work out for him. Thanks very much for all your supportive comments.

Really pleased for you.

Good news op...sounds like you've done most things right and you shouldn't have to be constantly vigilant for warning signs if your dog was happy in your home...better to let him go somewhere he will be happier and find a dog that suits your family

Also seconding what Kelda has said upthread. Dog bites (especially facial ones) need to be thoroughly cleaned before being closed.
When I was 18 the family dog bit my face (very badly). While I was in hospital, the dog was removed from the house and taken to the Vet to be euthanized. Parents didn't think twice about it. You sound very caring +thoughtful OP, tbh, in your situation, I'd be taking the dog straight away, to the RSPCA or similar.

Yes definitely agree with Miaow Give Greyhound Gap a try, they are very experienced with sight hounds.

Don't take him to the RSPCA !!!!! They will just euthanise him.

I agree with contacting breed specific rescue- lurcherlink is a good starting point. The good news is that you quite often get rescue lurcher owners who are childfree or have adult children and a lot of them become very into that type of dog and are great dedicated owners. I fostered a young lurcher once for a client of the vets where I work pending rehoming. He was a gorgeous striking looking dog so I purposely didn't put any photos up in the practice (didn't want people getting their heads turned by him) but instead asked our existing handful of dedicated lurcher rescue owners if they needed another and one did. He lived happily ever after. Worth asking your vet about this. Be completely honest about the bite and the handful of growling episodes. Good luck.

and I feel that we have failed him but am not sure quite where we’ve gone wrong
The dog doesn't like being stroked
The dog doesn't enjoy being away from home

Yet he was away from home, and being stroked. This would be torture for a dog!

I'm not sure that it's realistic to have a family pet that the children can't stroke It doesn't matter how realistic it is, it's just something you have to accept!

When you ignore his warnings (previous growls) this is what he is forced to do.

A dog that bites is aggressive - how anyone can suggest otherwise is beyond me. The lack of warning growl is particularly worrying. Op said that he often growls at her ds, perhaps the dog was just so fed up of being ignored that he snapped.

I shouldn't have a dog because I let my children stroke him? Do you not see the issue? Your dog doesn't like being stroked. You let your child stroke him, repeatedly, with no boundaries around that. Your dog doesn't like being away from home. You were away from home.

If a child didn't like being away from home, or hugged, yet was away from home and being hugged, it would be classed as sensory overload, and a meltdown would be expected. That's what happened with your dog.

You have so little respect for this creature that you took him out of his comfort zone, saw the results and still moan about being accused of being a crap dog owner. All because you think your kid should be able to stroke him, regardless of the animals likes/dislikes.

From the rest of your posts, you went into this (getting this breed of dog) with your eyes closed. You had "expectations" and not realistic ones.

Now, because you failed to do your homework on either of his breeds, or what they are liked crossed together, and further failed to see his cues, or put boundaries around the way your family treated him, this poor dog is leaving his comfort zone AGAIN.

He will hate that, and this may well contribute to further aggressive behaviour in his new home, as he struggles to adjust again. At which point, he may get rehomed again or more than likely, PTS.

Sorry, op, but I cannot offer the same sympaties that others have. Dogs aren't toys, and they deserve owners who take time to get to know them/their breed(s)/their temperament/warning signs etc. You did none of that.

I do hope your son is ok, but at the same time, I feel for this poor pup.

"When you ignore his warnings (previous growls) this is what he is forced to do."

In fairness she quite clearly said his growls weren't ignored, just that she didn't realise quite how stressed he was when he wasn't growling...which is really common. People are hardwired for speech, dogs aren't and it does mean that people expect the growl that not all dogs use.

I'm sure in hindsight she'd do things differently, but, letting your children stroke their dog isn't really up there with the people who let their children climb all over them or dress them up or any of the other ridiculous things people do.

Good news, OP.

You are clearly a very responsible owner who has learned a hard lesson about the differences between dogs. I would venture to say that the fault here lies in fair degree with the rescue, actually, who should have abundant experience of different dogs and didn't recognise that this dog and young children might not be a good mix, but rescues tread a difficult line.

You did well by him while you had him, and you are doing the right thing now x

(To add, yes, I realise he was a young puppy, but they seem to have known the mix of the litter ...)