How to deal with runners who 'hold their line' and run directly at you / dog

[Twitterqueen]

Any advice? My small dog was not moving - neither was I - on a path. A 6ft+ tall heavy male runner came directly at us. Dog didn't see him (she was sniffing) and I was on the phone. I assumed he would run round us. he didn't.

He ran straight into my still stationery small dog, kicked her in the head and then ran on. I yelled at him and got the usual "Keep your dog under control." response. Regardless of the fact that he was moving and we weren't, and that he was unable to stop in time to prevent injury so he was the one out of control.

Plus, I'm not generally thinking "oh I must look out for runners or any one else who I may offend"

But you should, especially if you're using an extendible lead. They're hard to see & you'd be the first to moan if someone cycles through the lead at speed & breaks your dog!!

I hate dogwalkers that bimble along oblivious with 20 feet of black tripwire between them & their black dog on a dark evening.

and there might be a huddle of ddogs and people talking together

On the towpath? Blocking the way?

What a horrid thing to do. Obviously he was totally wrong.

As a runner (and also not a bastard I hope!) I'm never quite sure what to do around dogs obviously I know not to run into them and kick them in the head!

I've never had a dog so have no idea how to behave. I try to cross over the road or if I can't I slow right down. Some owners have tutted me in the past and told me 'they're perfectly friendly' (even the woman who let her dogs chase me then got stroppy when I stopped dead and waited for her to call them back)

I'm never sure what I should do. Advice from dog owners?

think it is all about good manners from everyone
Kitty you are doing everything you can so ignore the grumpy ones

The runner should obviously make best efforts to avoid a dog but extendable leads on a mixed use path are an absolute menace if the owner isn't paying attention. Dog on one side of the path, owner on the other, tripwire between them.

Horrible man!

I wish people wouldn't run along busy pavements in towns - drives me mad.

Good to know I'm doing the right thing. I figured those people were just grumps.

To be fair most of the dog walkers I meet are lovely and friendly, I try to be polite and say hello but what I usually manage is a pained grimace and sometimes a panted 'morning'

Cyclists on pavements or bombing around woods them I do moan about
as pointed out to one what happened if it been a child walking round corner they have sent flying

As a runner, I run around or stop, but I am not in training, just doing a bit of keep fit. A runner timing themselves, who won't run round people and dogs, should join a club and use a running track.

As for cyclists on tow paths, there have been a couple of incidents I'm aware of where dogs have jumped at the cyclist and knocked them to the ground, causing severe injury. One of the cyclists I know of was doing her job. She's a rowers coach, has no choice about being on the tow path cycling, and obviously must be attentive to the rowers she is coaching. Dogs on tow paths should be on short leads, and pedestrians grouped on a tow path should make sure there is always space for others to pass.

Some people pick a line and are able to stick to it, fairly predictable. Some dogs, even on a lead (maybe especially if they're on an extendable lead) seem to wander all over the place - changing directions and crossing the path, less predictable.

Runner man sounds completely horrid to kick the dog, but please explain how walkers and runnners can predict where a dog will wander and how to avoid them?

When running, I am petrified of actually running into dogs, because I simply don't know / can't predict where they'll be on the path - I have never seen an owner hold their dog still to avoid it jumping around.

Interesting points here. to Schnitzel I would say that I was not obstructing the path. I am a walker, I was on the path, and was using it! By your definition everyone is an obstruction - very odd, but illustrative of my point that seemingly, to runners, everybody is in their way.

Phones - I hadn't expected people to pick this up. I don't do it generally as my walk is my peaceful-away-from-the-office-time, but I don't get the problem. People are on phones everywhere - in shops, trains, restaurants etc, why not on a walk? It doesn't mean I'm not paying attention to what's going on around me.

What would I like runners to do? Run around! Not through. I run sometimes and I always, always, always move round others. I go into the road if there's a person with a buggy or small child, or I move onto the grass. I simply don't understand why people believe it's acceptable to run directly at someone / something and expect them to get out of their way. It's very intimidating.

there might be a huddle of dogs and people talking together,

you see I think that is anti social.
Lovely for you to stop and talk, but you should leave enough room for other path users to get round.

Runners are often trying to time themselves, or at the very least do not want to stop or drop to a walk, it can break your whole rhythm and spoil your run. Also, if the grass is wet, running shoes are often not waterproof.

If cyclists are allowed on the path, they should be able to cycle along it, without having to stop for a dog in the path.

I often use a path used by all three and most people are aware of others and move round each other, but dogs on long leads are a pain, how can I tell which way they are going? Just pull your dog in if someone else is coming.

BUT in this case the runner was completely out of order in every way.

In this weather, it isn't necessarily safe to run around on mud and wet grass/leaves. If stopped, stand to one side.

I'm afraid I would think about reporting this man for kicking your dog.
BUT you should not be on the phone whilst dog walking. When I'm walking I get dog on a short lead and put myself in between other walkers, runners, horses.
If your dog trips up a runner you are liable.

I try to be polite and say hello but what I usually manage is a pained grimace and sometimes a panted 'morning'

Not just me then!!

On a serious note, OP in the evenings with either the sun in your eyes or it getting dark, you need to keep aware of what's going on around you - if you are on the phone then check behind occasionally & try to walk in a straight line please!

I've lost count of the number of times I've run past someone on the phone & they've jumped a mile & tutted because they're in their own little box & oblivious to everything else....

I don't think the OP was being unreasonable at all, she was using the path and both her and her dog were fairly stationary. Even if accidents do happen (he should have gone around though) you can always stop and apologise. The poor dog yelped!!

There are lots of weekend runners in my local woods, the majority are really considerate and we move out of their way. Just as runners are asking, I find that ignoring the dog is best as it shows you're no fun to play with, and if possible move to the other side of the path that the people are walking on. It is there responsibility to get their dog under control, and they should make an effort to control the dog if it's likely to jump up.

On another note: (my two bugbears, sorry!)
People that run up almost silently behind dogs and then get annoyed that they either jump up, or bark at them. You do not approach a dog from behind, you may be seen as a threat. If the dog is facing away from you (people walking the same direction as you) try to make your footfalls a bit heavier or click your fingers to make a small noise to alert the dog (still ignore them though)

If you are scared of dogs, and I mean really phobic - do not scream when you run past, wave your hands about and assume a brace position (Yes, this has happened) the dog will think you want to play and approach you. Don't shout at the owner for this happening, you've basically demanded the dogs attention by screaming and dancing about. Just ignore them. Worse case scenario, shout (sorry! Coming through) before you run past and they have a chance to hold their dog back if dogs upset you.

Other than that, runners around here are fairly good and we all try to be mindful of each other. I'm sorry your dog got hurt OP.

You didn't answer people's question as to whether you had the dog on an extending lead, OP?

he kicked your dog?

I think dog walkers should put their dogs on leads and move aside for runners, I absolutely hate running past loose dogs despite being a dog owner and someone who works with dogs. It's the same for horses and cyclists too, if I'm the dog walker it is easier for me to move aside than for faster or larger things to go around. And not everybody likes dogs so it's just basic courtesy I think?

You do not approach a dog from behind, you may be seen as a threat.

Hopefully if your dog regularly sees runners as a threat it's on a lead.

I was chased by a (I thought) playful collie the other day - the owner then said "thought she was going to bite you there, she usually does".

Some dog owners are idiots and some runners are idiots, but at the end of the day it's the dog owners responsibility to control the dog - not to expect the rest of the world to adapt to your decision to have one....

If youre a runner and you see someone with a dog, you slow down or give it a wide berth. Its nearly always male runners (and cyclists) who think theyre entitled to the entire area. Also male swimmers in pools who go in competition mode and ignore anyone else in their path. Male entitlement. Ive noticed this a LOT lately.

Did this happen in dark or dusk? Or brilliant daylight when he couldn't miss your dog?

And was the dog at your feet or further away?

Deliberate kicking is plain wrong, but as you weren't watching your dog right before, are you sure he saw her? If you are, go to the police with a description.

Some dog owners are idiots and some runners are idiots, but at the end of the day it's the dog owners responsibility to control the dog - not to expect the rest of the world to adapt to your decision to have one.... This. The woman whose dog tripped me (while she was on the phone, incidentally) didn't apologise or even ask if I was OK (there was blood, lots of).
Our local woods and playing fields is also full of "professional" dog walkers who often have six or seven dogs each, all off the lead. I simply do not believe anyone can control that many dogs at the same time. But they're all "really friendly" of course

If youre a runner and you see someone with a dog, you slow down or give it a wide berth.

When passing it yes, but how to give something that is sprinting around all over the place a wide berth?

And FWIW I see just as many females runners being "played with" by dogs as I do male runners.

There's nothing quite so disconcerting as running along and hearing the panting and jingling of a dog coming up behind you quickly - are you suggesting that all runners, cyclists etc should moderate their training and pleasure so that your dog can do as it pleases?

I see it from both sides, which is why I keep my dog under control and make way for other path/track users.

I'm a professional dog walker! In a public space like that I wouldn't have more than four dogs off the lead, my insurance doesn't cover it. I think it's a lot to ask, of some breeds in particular, for a dog to ignore a moving target. I just cba with the actual stress and anxiety of something bad and wholly preventable happening so I always recall and put dogs back on their leads.