Starting Raw Food diet

[Eloisedublin123]

Hi there
Was hoping for some practical advice please for changing from a kibble diet to a raw food diet for my two big dogs. A golden retriever and a rescue big hound.
Any advice much appreciated and many thanks

Have a look at Facebook groups eg raw feeding advice, and rawsome and holistic. Loads of info and help. Basically you need to feed 80% meat, a variety of protein eg chicken,beef, duck, Turkey, tripe etc, 10% bone, 5% liver and 5 % other offal, eg kidney. Feed about 3% of body weight if adults, maybe less, depends on dog. When you start you need to change over completely as not a good idea to mix raw and kibble. When starting at first just use one protein eg chicken for a week or so while digestive system gets used to it, then introduce another. Good bones are chicken wings, duck necks, chicken carcasses, lamb ribs. My dog is a chewer, check what your is like by holding a bone for then to chew on 1st. Some dogs will try to swallow bones whole, eg chicken wings maybe too small for a large dog. Avoid weight bearing bones unless purely recreational. Leave offal for a few weeks as can upset tummies. I started on a commercially prepared complete though, 'Nutriment', Google for suppliers or order online, same for 'Natural Instinct'. I avoided Natures Menu, as some of the completes have high levels of starchy veg and fruit as well as grains. Some raw fooders avoid all veg and fruit, some use some. I use small amounts of leafy veg (Starchy veg like sweet potato, or parsnip can cause yeast infections and most dogs cannot digest them). You can source raw meat from many suppliers who deliver eg 'the dogs butcher' 'paleo ridge raw', MVM, Naturaw, Doggie Dinners. Good luck, but really the Facebook pages are really helpful.

As for things to add, raw eggs and fish are good a few times a week too. If sourcing any meat from a supermarket that is fresh, I always freeze it first to kill bacteria. Lots of people don't though. You must always freeze salmon or trout for 3 weeks as has a nasty bacteria on its parasites sometimes.

Just started ourselves this morning. Normally she is really slow to sit to be allowed to eat her kibble. I gave her a tiny bit to taste then put the rest in her bowl - when I looked around to say 'sit' she was already sitting and has never been as interested in food.

Why is it bad to transition slowly from kibble nelliee? Also, does that apply to smoked salmon the bacteria? I sometimes give small scraps.

Well, the problem with mixing kibble and raw is meant to be that raw is digested quickly, kibble slowly, if the raw gets held up in the gut by the kibble it can allow bacteria to flourish, and cause digestive problems. Also the gut of a kibble fed dog generally becomes more alkaline. Dogs guts are generally highly acidic to digest raw food, so persisting with kibble will interfere with the digestion for this reason too. The 2 groups on Facebook that I use are against mixing for this reason. There are people who dispute this, and do a 'phased in' change. Others even persist in mixing the 2. To my mind, raw is what I choose for my dog so I wouldn't consider prolonging the kibble anyway. I changed my pup over at about 4 months. No problems at all. Pooping went from about 4 smelly sloppy ones to 2 small, no smell (well, almost) and nice and firm. My dog went from not eating for days at a time, to hoovering up his four in seconds. It takes him longer now as he has chunks rather than mince. His breath is sweet, he has no doggy odour, and I love to sniff his silky soft fragrant shaggy fur.......

Would assume that as smoked salmon is eaten as it is by humans, ie is not cooked before eating, there will be no nasties, so should be OK, although the salt content or smoke may not be the best thing for dogs.
With salmon that is for humans, obviously the raw sort would always be cooked before eating destroying bacteria and parasites. So if eating raw, needs to be frozen. Also dogs will be fed whole fish including entrails, which increases risk of parasites and associated bacteria.

Just following with interest. Very interested in starting my french bulldog puppy on a raw diet too

We have a Frenchie and we changed him over to Raw at about 15 weeks, after a few incidents of having an upset tummy. It made an amazing difference in his digestion. The breeder had him on Arden Grange, and then we changed him over to Acana because it had less additives. We have since changed to Nutriment we haven't looked back. All the problems that they are notorious for.. the wind etc have gone, and his stools aren't as frequent and much firmer.

We do however supplement it with some vege like carrots and a probiotic, I wouldn't feed him on anything else other than Raw.

Thanks nellie - that's interesting. For a dog with a sensitive stomach I have heard that it can iron out problems (due to it becoming more acidic?) - has that been your experience?

I really recommend the frozen Natures menu mince blocks from Pets at Home because it isn't messy and doesn't take up too much room in the fridge or freezer and is low hassle. Then add in veg, carrots and cooked rice if you want, and it is easy.
My 22kg working lab has 1 block per day, split over 2 meals, so it is also a really easy way of doing portion control!

She was previously on a mix of chicken wings, meaty bones, veg, eggs, cottage cheese etc, but a) it all took up more space in the fridge than the human food b) meant I was shopping for dog food all the time and c) cost 3 times as much as the frozen blocks
Also, the frozen blocks are made from Free Range chicken, which sits better with me than the cheap chicken wings I bought before.
She had a year on mixed raw food and has had a year on this, and there is no difference at all to her condition or energy levels

Yes, I tend to use the all minced meat blocks Natures menu if I am away on holiday as it is easy to get to. You would need to check bone percentage though. On the packets of minced chicken I bought it indicated about 3% bone, so you would need to add in extra. Also need to add in offal as well. Whoeatmytoast, from my own experience my dog stopped runny poops when I changed him to raw, and I have read and heard many cases of dogs with real stomach issues like colitis etc being cured on raw food. Some dogs really can't tolerate wheat or starch which is often high in kibble. I also avoid having too much chicken for my dog. Chicken is a very common allergy, maybe because a lot of chicken are fed grain, whereas you can source grass fed beef or lamb. I also like to get rabbit or venison, as it is less 'farmed', so welfare better, less antibiotics or chemicals. I agree Sparechange that the Natures Menu has welfare standards. I source from Paleo ridge, Dogs Butcher and Naturaw as their meat is British, free range and some is organic. It is true that it can take up space too! I have a separate small freezer and mini fridge just for dog food. The freezer is OK but I'd love to have a bigger one! If you have space, in a garage for example, you can easily make up for the cost of a 2nd hand freezer by buying more. I'm vegetarian, but if you have a local butcher, make friends, as you can get a lot of cheap off its or even freebies that way. Apparently Morrissons is excellent for cut price bargains too, but I would worry about any cheap meat that isn't UK. Europe has much less stringent welfare standards.

Nellie, sadly we don't have any room for a second fridge, so have given over a drawer in the freezer.
Re bones, we also feed a few chicken wings or thighs in the week and the occasional lamb shoulder. Her poo is always white and chalky, which is a good sign for me that she gets enough bone, but would be interested in whether you think that is a good enough indicator?

Sparechange, a white chalky poop indicates too much bone. A good poop is brown (quite light if chicken), and firm but shouldn't be crumbly. However, poop left in the sun will go white and crumbly, so sometimes if I miss a poop in the garden and then find it in the garden the next day, it is white. If poop is really, really dark it indicates too much offal. Honestly, I can't rate the raw feeding pages on Facebook highly enough. Any poop queries, or ratios, type of meat etc are always answered by loads of really experienced people. Sometimes, if you have fed a bony meal, it's fine, just go a few days of boneless. I worked out amounts at the start, so I knew with my boy using half a complete mince and half chunks, for the amount he ate, a duck neck would normally be enough for 2 days of bone, or if I was feeding all chunks, say beef and tripe, it would be a days worth of bone, but slightly under, so next bone day, he could have a chicken carcass which would be a little over the 2 day amount. At the outset, this sort of thing would have scared me off, so using a complete was great.

Oh, would just add that the 10% bone is a guide. I've read that anything up to 30% may be OK for some dogs, but I think that generally 10 to 20 is the normal range. Judge from the poops!

Thank u all very much for your super advice. I've just joined the raw food group on fb. My main concern. Is starting my dogs on it. I'm really nervous! The retriever has s very sensitive stomach and I'm dreading it. I'm guessing they must have a few days at least of upset Tim with such a huge change. Over the summer we had to leave the back door open a night for several days when she was sick ( as a dog!). We had to sleep on the sofa un case burglars strolled in. I suppose we are in for a few more days of that. It will be worth it. Thanks again.

Damn phone sorry for typos. Upset tums. ??

How did the change over go? I swapped my sensitive collie on to raw with no issues, she has been far less sick since she's been a raw fed dog.

I had 2 foster dogs. Each time, after their long journey from abroad, I switched them straight to raw. Just chicken to start with but quickly added, tripe, eggs, sardines. Loads of stuff. They didn't have any problems, absolutely loved it. Bought stuff from butcher, whatever he had and also frozen packs of Nature's Menu/Diet etc.

Tripe is very healthy, you can buy a big bag of frozen pellets in Pets@home
The only thing I found didn't really agree with them was beef, so kept that at a minimum.

Forgot to say, this is a good website and so is the Raw Feeding UK FB group (although I see that you've joined one already). Good luck!

Also, don't worry too much about each meal being in the correct ratios for bone, meat etc. Just try and balance it over a week-10 days. You'll see by their poop if they're having too much bone anyway.

Good morning my fellow dog lovers!
Well I tried! I went to the local butchers on my day off work and tried to talk to them about getting meat from them and they actually laughed at me ??. I asked then to speak to the boss to see if he knew what I was talking about and he smirked ( as if I was a tinker asking for cheap crap for my mutts) and said no. It's an upmarket South Dublin butchers-in case that's in any way relevant- I mean do they not have the bits of meat I want cos they only sell the human grade bits? I don't know. So I'mooking into getting it on line. Im in Dublin. Any suggestions welcome ??

The Raw Feeding UK FB group has a very comprehensive list of suppliers, hopefully they'll include Eire as well. Worth joining the group, just so you can ask for info from all the other group members.

Perhaps you'll have more joy from a less upmarket butchers! Don't really know what to suggest, but keep on looking. Do you have Morrisons in Dublin? They always seem to be mentioned re. good bargains for meat.