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Crazy puppy and confrontation with neighbour

53 replies

NK81dfff7X118c77cc322 · 06/05/2014 09:23

Just had a rather upsetting experience and looking for some unbiased opinions.

We have a 12 week old whippet pup. He came to us at 8 weeks and is doing really well so far - no problems toilet training, well socialised, started puppy training classes last week and fantastic with the DDs 9 and 8. However - every now and again (for around 10 minutes a day) he becomes possessed! Growling, nipping, barking, haring around the house, launching himself at people and things. I understand this is normal puppy behaviour and after a few minutes he calms down again and order is restored.

So this morning the madness came over him as we were getting ready for school. Really bad timing as we operate to a v tight schedule in the mornings. He had discarded the kong, chew sticks, puzzle toy, etc. In order for us all to complete brushing teeth, combing hair, checking bags, and getting shoes on I shut the puppy in the garden for a few minutes. He is quite safe as the garden is completely enclosed and it is a sunny day. As we finished getting ready he was barking to come in - admittedly sounding frantic. Before I could open the back door there was an enraged knocking on the front door, which I opened to a red-faced shouting neighbour threatening to call the RSPCA and local council and informing me I was unfit to own a dog.

Have I got this completely wrong? Still upset from the confrontation but more upset that I am traumatising our puppy. How do others cope with this mad half hour?

OP posts:
slartybartfast · 06/05/2014 11:02

no, pretty sure dogs quieten if you tell them to stop barking.

Floralnomad · 06/05/2014 11:03

I agree spicy !

SpicyPear · 06/05/2014 11:06

I would maybe go round there and grab the bull by the horns. Say you thought their behavior was out and unacceptable but moving forward could you to to discuss things before they felt the need to behave like that.

Re barking, it is intrinsically enjoyable and self reinforcing for a lot of dogs, which is why it is so hard to crack. Training a quiet command is useful but also really trying to minimise the occurrence of situations that lead to the barking.

SpicyPear · 06/05/2014 11:10

Oh yes silly me blarty spending months training a quiet command and supervising my dog when I should just tell him to stop it. You really are demonstrating your extreme ignorance of dog behaviour.

slartybartfast · 06/05/2014 11:15

blarty are you referring to me with your unreasonable posts?
Confused

the op was considering ignoring the barking and hoping it goes away by not enocuraging it, which is how i read it.
you yourself manage your terrier's barking.

of course you tell your dog to be quiet. dont you? Hmm

slartybartfast · 06/05/2014 11:16

and that was to the confrontational spiceypear.

SpicyPear · 06/05/2014 11:22

Yes I manage it by spending many months training him to stop when told and in the meantime making sure he is, for example, not left outside unsupervised to bark. You're basically suggesting that anyone whose dog barks just hasn't tried or bothered telling them to stop it, which is both ridiculous and offensive. You are assuming that because it worked for your dog, it will work for everyone else. As it happens it is one of the toughest behavioural challenges for some dogs.

Wolfiefan · 06/05/2014 11:27

It can be very difficult but some owners just don't bother. (That is not to say that because a dog barks that the owners aren't trying!(

SpicyPear · 06/05/2014 11:34

Yes some owners don't bother. That is not acceptable. But dogs have differing temperaments, drives, preferences and behaviours. That's the whole point of having breeds.

Merrylegs · 06/05/2014 11:54

You say you were up at 6 for an 8 am start. Perhaps it was just too early for your neighbour to hear the noise. Perhaps the dog had woken her up. 10 minutes of frantic barking when you have been disturbed from sleep might make anyone ragey. I would probably crate in future if you need space to get ready.

We have a whippet and I really do remember those mad moments. The good news is they don't last and whippets grow up to be - usually- very quiet dogs. Ours certainly went through a whiney phase (they do suffer from separation anxiety) but hardly ever makes a sound now.

Owllady · 06/05/2014 11:55

Ok, I would just apologise. There is no need to explain anything yo het
Then I would keep out of her way as much as possible because normal people are generally not aggressive and confrontational at the drop of hat!
I hope you okay, it does sound upsetting.
I crate my dog during the morning routine as all the bus catching makes her anxious

moosemama · 06/05/2014 12:08

OP, when we first moved here our border collie cross, unbeknownst to us, started howling whenever we had to go out without her. The move had unsettled her.

We had no clue it was happening until our neighbour (moved from detached to semi) came round a shouted at my dh. I turned out that the previous occupants had a dog that they'd left at home all day every day to bark and he was determined it wasn't going to happen again. At the time, we'd probably only left our girl for less than an hour, perhaps twice and his reaction seemed disproportionate - until we found out the back-story.

We did a lot of work with our girl to ensure we was settled and made sure she wasn't left at home alone until we were sure she could cope. We also kept the neighbours informed of what we were doing and apologised in advance if they heard her at all, but explained that we were doing everything in our power to sort the problem out. They were fine about it and relaxed as soon as they realised we were responsible dog owners. Their hearts must have sank when they saw us arriving with two dogs after their experiences with the previous occupants. We helped our girl over it and she was fine.

Fast forward 11 years, we've lived here peacefully and got along with those neighbours all that time - in fact we increased the number of dogs to 3 during that time and all was well, until last year when we lost the bc cross that had the howling problem. By then we'd already lost our oldest girl and there was only our Lurcher lad left. He grieved terribly and started to howl whenever I went out to do the school run. School is across the road and it takes me a maximum of 20 minutes to do the drop-off/pick-up, but at the time I was having to do it three times a day and again the neighbour went postal about it - this time leaving a rather rude post it note stuck to our front door while I was at the school, two weeks after we lost our old girl.

Again we went and spoke to them, explained we'd lost our other dog and he was grieving and that we didn't know he was howling, but thank you for letting us know, as now we can do something about it etc. We also reinforced that we wished they had told us before it got to the point where they are furious about it, especially as we couldn't possibly have known there was a problem if it only happened while we were out. I explained that I take my responsiblity as a dog owner very seriously and never want me having dogs to impact negatively on any one else, it's my choice to live with dogs, but that doesn't mean I have the right to allow them to annoy other people etc. Finally I reassured them that I would be doing everything in my power to retrain my boy to be able to cope when left alone and to ensure he didn't bother them if at all possible in the meantime.

They said they didn't know we'd lost our old girl and were sorry and said to let them know if they could do anything to help us with the separation anxiety. I spent the next couple of months staying at home, arranging dog-sitters when I couldn't be and very slowly building up the time I left my boy and doing lots of behavioural work until he learned to cope alone. There were, I think, two occasions when I had no choice but to leave him (important hospital appointment type situations) and I let them know in advance so they could choose to go out if they wanted to - but also put him on the opposite side of the house to minimise any disturbance. By that point though the neighbours said not to bother moving him and that they could easily cope with an isolated occasion (I still moved him though).

Once I went round and apologised, explained the situation and told them I was actively doing something about it they were fine, both times, but both times they had stewed for a while before coming and telling us there was a problem. I think this is probably what's going on with your neighbour and would recommend trying for a less confrontation chat. I am very shy by nature, hate confrontation and going to talk to my neighbours was my worst nightmare, but ultimately the best thing to do and definitely no worse than living with the constant anxiety that we might be annoying them enough for it to build up to another angry doorstep confrontation.

Incidentally, we then took on a rescue pup who - oh joy - also had SA due to his bad start (we didn't know when we took him on). So now I have been working with him for 8 months - making sure I spoke to my neighbours as soon as we got him and again, they've been fine.

moosemama · 06/05/2014 12:09

Do I win a prize for biggest post of the morning/week/month/year? Blush

Owllady · 06/05/2014 12:15

Yes, you get a £5 voucher to spend on brownhills market Wink

tabulahrasa · 06/05/2014 12:31

"You say you were up at 6 for an 8 am start. Perhaps it was just too early for your neighbour to hear the noise. Perhaps the dog had woken her up. 10 minutes of frantic barking when you have been disturbed from sleep might make anyone ragey. I would probably crate in future if you need space to get ready."

That - I'd not be happy with a dog barking for ten minutes at that time in the morning, I might have been politer about it, but inside I would be furious tbh.

JingletsJangletsYellowBanglets · 06/05/2014 13:36

slartybartfast, if you read my post, I didn't suggest she call 101, but tell her neighbour that she would IF the neighbour decided to repeat/continue the verbal harassment that she experienced this morning. The neighbour seems to be under the (wrong) impression that she has the right to scream at the OP.

NK81dfff7X118c77cc322 · 06/05/2014 13:39

Thanks everyone. Helpful to hear your experiences (especially moosemama). So relieved to hear there is hope!

Fwiw, I did apologise straight away this morning but it didn't quell the tsunami of rage at all. I think we both need some time to calm down before broaching the issue again.

OP posts:
IAmNotAMindReader · 06/05/2014 14:37

Give her time to calm down but I would keep a diary and note times you let the dog out and times you go out and the times you take him out with you.

This one could have already decided you are evil incarnate and she must rescue the poor neglected dog from you.

Hopefully that is not the case and you can salvage a happy neighbourly relationship but be prepared to defend yourself just in case.

SirChenjin · 06/05/2014 16:23

You could also use the fact that she is a dog owner to your advantage perhaps (depends what she's like, of course) - ask her for some advice on what she did that worked to stop a dog barking, has she got any hints and tips?

WeAllHaveWings · 06/05/2014 17:19

As soon as we hear our 12 month old dog bark once he is back inside. We have a few neighbours with dogs and very rarely hear more than literally a passing bark or two.

10 minutes of barking would drive me potty if it was my dog never mind someone else's especially before 8am in the morning. I think it is very inconsiderate to leave a dog out barking.

I would go and apologise later today once she has calmed down, but its still fresh, in the hope of finding out why I seemed to cause such an extreme reaction and if I had been at fault resolve it, and I'd also bring the dog in as soon as it starts barking.

Booboostoo · 06/05/2014 17:22

It doesn't sound like she really had a welfare issue to pick with you, more that she was annoyed by the noise. I have to say that if you live in a residential area you can't really leave the dog to bark for 10 minutes, difficult as it is you will have to teach him not to. It does sound like you already have a very early start, I don't envy you, but perhaps you can arrange your morning differently so that someone is always available to play with the puppy? Unfortunately they do tend to have huge bursts on energy and they are very likely to have one first thing in the morning after a long sleep.

OnaPromise · 06/05/2014 18:16

I have a whippet cross pup and I know what you mean about the morning maddy. I have an adult dog who was quiet and calm until she arrived and now he joins in as well.

If she is running about mad and we need to do something, I put her in her crate with a kong. I know DH feeds her in her crate in the morning or puts her breakfast in the kong while he takes dd to school. If no crate then somewhere with a baby gate across or something.

The neighbours behaviour sounds ott. Personally I'd probably just leave it but not have him barking in the garden again.

NK81dfff7X118c77cc322 · 07/05/2014 07:33

Update.

Last night there came another knock on the door. I was out at puppy training class (!) but DH answered with trepidation. This time it was a different neighbour who said that the shouty lady had approached him and his wife for support, but that he had declined as they have no problem with the dog or us. Not sure whether to be heartened or depressed by this.

In the meantime I do realise that I didn't cope with the puppy behaviour very well yesterday and I hadn't really appreciated quite how much a barking dog would upset people. Clearly this is something we need to work on.

OP posts:
Owllady · 07/05/2014 08:21

Oh dear, live and learn :) I really would stay out of her way though if it was one incident and she is trying to rally support.

moosemama · 07/05/2014 09:30

Oh dear, she does sound determined. Perhaps approaching her yourself would be a bad idea.

Fwiw, she would need a log of 'nuisances' over a prolonged period of time to get anyone 'official' involved. It's actually pretty hard to prove dog-related nuisance noise, even when there's a genuine case. As for the RSPCA they wouldn't be interested in the slightest, your dog is loved, cared for, taken to training classes etc and therefore has all his needs met and more. The RSPCA are in fact only interested in basic care and your lad has all that and much more.

I would accompany him into the garden for all trips - you probably should be anyway at this age - particularly those before 8.00 am and after 10.00 pm. You could also check on your Local Authority's website to find out what constitutes dog-related nuisance noise (each LA will have slightly different rules) just to reassure yourself.

If it was just one incidence of barking outside before 8.00 am then she is totally over-reacting by trying to get other neighbours involved. She's spoken to you about it, you have apologised and said it won't happen again and she should leave it there unless it's a regular occurrence.

I am so sorry you are going through this, as I know how much anxiety it brings. Flowers