Help/advice please - our dog bit (nipped) the baby....is there only one answer?

[bloggingmamatotwo]

Aghhhhh so stressed, trying to avoid drip feeding....so adding detail... we have had our miniature short haired daschund 5 years, loving, never showed aggression, never bit, never anything...DS was born nearly 3 years ago she got a little grumpier and started eating the post, chasing people as they left the house, but all manageable and calmed down....DS1 is 9 months and yesterday, at stress o clock, teatime,end of the day, waiting to go and puck OH from the train etc completely out of character she nipped yes I know that is the same as a bite, but a bite makes the end result appear much worse than it was the him on the nose, it was a warning nip/bite rather than a bite to hurt, but it was a bite and it was my baby......so there are two small bloody cuts on his poor nose, little teeth marks......

So does this mean, I rehome her ASAP? Or is it worse than that?
Does the baby need a tetnus?

For info; the baby is fine in himself and was after the initial shock.....

Today I've kept the dog in the study and during the baby's nap time she has come out......

Any helpful advice would be greatly appreciated....

I wouldn't have my dog pts for snapping at one of my children. I wouldn't. A snap in a high tension situation is not, in my book, a reason to get rid of a dog who is part of my family. I would take any steps necessary to ensure my children, and my dog were both safe in the future but I wouldn't have her pts

Op, you know dachshunds. They have their 'ways'. You need to think about if and how you can manage future situations before making big decisions

OP i wouldnt PTS under the circumstances you have so far posted, daschunds can be snappy little buggers!! i doubt very much that it meant to seriously hurt him, had the dog had wanted to do serious harm to your DS it would have done, believe me!!

What were the circumstances leading up to the dog biting your DS?

In your situation i would make sure that the dog was NEVER alone with either of the your DC alone EVER!! i know how hard it is having very young DC and a dog and tbh unless you feel totally 100% confident to do the them i wouldnt keep the dog, its not fair on the dog or your DC. It will be your fault NOT THE DOGS if it bites again. However it will be the dogs that pays at the very least it will lose its home or even worse its life . Sorry if any of that sounds harsh, its not meant to just some of the posts (not yours ill add) have been totally fucking stupid!!

OP should you decide to rehome do not rush into it and ASK here for advice on how to do so, NEVER EVER re home via the like of gumtree, pets4home, freeads, facebook ect!!! only rehome to a very close relative or via a good NO KILL rescue, ideally a breed specific one.

Thanks again for all thoughts/advice/opinions all appreciated...the tetnus is covered in his baby jabs but will check with the practice nurse tomorrow, but he is up to date with jabs and I know it is in there so feel confident that is covered...

My honest feeling is for the next minimum of 2 years I don't think we can put our hands on our heart and say we could be 100% watching/guarding either the baby has he grows or the dog, when we had just one child, it was/is easier to watch them both, with my first I hardly left him alone but with two children as lots of you know it is impossible to be on watch all the time, sometimes the older one wants the loo, the younger one is left, etc etc therefore I feel it is unfair to keep our lovely dog. After discussion on the phone with my OH and reading this thread, we feel it is selfish of us to keep our very loved dog, someone posted earlier about trusting the dog, this has resonated the most deeply and the answer is no, I couldn't/can't now....

Yes I know Daschunds, I know she thinks she is the queen and I know she was probably put in a situation where she felt threatened, scared, etc which is/was not the baby's or her fault...therefore I am going to find a loving home amongst people we know and trust where she can be the queen....

Like i said earlier, if something happened again and anyone; doctor, police, HV, other parent etc asked had she done it before or where there warning signs.....well yes and we ignored them....this is the part that does not feel right....

Looking at his little nose with two cuts on it while feeding him earlier is the warning, it could have been worse and for the dogs sake we have had a lovely 5 years together and she must be able to go somewhere she can have many more years as the queen bee that daxies like to be.....

Thanks again....looking forward to 2 children in bed so I can open the

Your last

Sorry - lost internet!! Your last post was eminently well thought out and expressed Op. I can sense your sadness but also your resolve... Good looking homing the dog. I'm sure she will be loved elsewhere away from young children

What actually happened before or at the time of the bite?

Where was you baby?
What else was going on?
What was the baby doing?
What were you doing?

snoopyknine Im not sure what the hold head and rocks is meant to mean and being fairly new to MN I'm not sure on the MN etiquette on ending a thread...but to be polite and answer your thread....

I do not feel the answers to your questions are going to help the bigger picture, whether we/I identify to you that it was the babies, or dogs fault as even if she was trapped in a corner with the baby climbing on her it was my fault or snapped at her over a piece of old rice cake etc, I'm responsible for the action....I am not an irresponsible pet owner - my pet CV would hold up pretty strong (for what's it worth, I grew up with dogs, this is my third dog as an adult, known to save birds that fly into windows, take home the 3 legged stray, etc, etc, this is not an easy, light choices....and all the suggestions regarding 'well you can keep the dog, but you can never leave them alone together ever etc' I can't put my hand up and say this will never happen, I am not a helicopter parent, said children are left alone for/during various intervals while I continue doing house things etc etc before SS are called it's not for long but long enough that the dog and the crawling/cruising/walking with a walker and the barely 1 foot high dacschnd may meet...

It is unfair for the dog to be locked out/away for the 12hrs my children are up and it is unfair to out either of them in a situation that it may happen again, for a few weeks we may all be on guard and then it may happen again...yes a trainer could come and help her, but really she was just being a dog and the baby is a while off understanding...I feel Ive worked through it all, I know the judgement is out, which I presume is where you questions/post about head holding was going...? unless I've got that all wrong so for now my thoughts are to rehome....

If you had answered the questions you would have got answers that would have prevented the dog from being locked but hey hoy. Send your dog to rescue and pass the problem on rather than deal with it. The reality is that you are sending your dog to death ........

Not sure of the relevance of the rest of your post to be honest

I'm not sending the dog to death, we would as stated in previous posts be/may be/are looking into rehoming to trusted realtive or friend, we would not do the the dogs home route, although I'm sure there are many good, anti putting down ones...our rehoming list is and always would be to someone we know and if it did nt work out have alredy said we would have her back and we would work things out...

Sorry if I read your message wrong and put a spin on it that was not intended....

The rest of my message to you was meant to demo that Im well thought through and responding to the situation rather than reacting....

To respond to the passing on the problem bit, well technically the second baby is the problem.... I'm not going to hand him over....

The dog is not a problem, there is no problem to fix, she bit, out of character she bit but may/will she do it again even a top behaviourist, vet, with many precautions in place we can't be sure.....if my son was scarred by yesterday's bite or future bite it is me that is/has been ridiculous in keeping the two together....

I haven't blamed the dog, I do know/feel it was the baby meaning my fault, too close etc, but I can't be sure this situation will not happen again....so I'm not sure what options are left....the soft muzzle is a good temporary one and I'm going to buy one tomorrow, maybe a relative/friend will have her for a short time....

Anyway sorry I snapped, I'm stressed - thank you for replying...

I work in a rescue and daily treat and change dogs behaviour so the situation you describe never happens again. (I also see the hundreds of dogs that are turned away from rescue as there is no space for them). It is not inevitable that your dog will do it again hence asking what was happening at the time.

I disagree with you and would say the dog IS the problem at the moment not your lovely DC's. Of course no child should ever be bitten. There is a problem and it can be sorted. It is possible to ensure this does not happen again and I do really understand how horrific and stressful a situation it is. However there are people that can help you prevent it from happening again.

Thank you snoopy will have a further think, taking her to the vet to check her back and will ask her about behaviourist, will also get soft muzzle for the daytime when I'm alone with the kids for the next few days and as as we hear back from our first choice family member will then move on from there....

Thanks...

Sends more . I hope you do find a relative or friend to take her and you will be able visit her in the future.

In response to the question above about having dogs: I don't currently out of terror or having dog and toddler in the same house. From when we had a housing situation which meant we could consider our own (as opposed to my parents') dog, we were actively TTC and I was too frightened of a situation like this. This does not mean that I haven't had pets I would have been heartbroken to rehome, but children always come first.

I would rehome straight away. Sorry :(

I am not sure what you mean by soft muzzle so sorry if I am telling you to suck eggs.

The best muzzles for the dogs are the baskerville muzzles. muzzle

The dog can eat drink, pant, be sick if needed and come to no harm. But not bite.

The soft muzzles keep the mouth shut and are not safe or recommended for wearing. The dogs can overheat, choke, dehydrate etc wearing soft muzzles.

snoopyknine Much as though I applaud your work with dogs via rescue please do not infer that you can 100% guarantee that a dog will never, ever bite again .... you can be very, sure but never 100% . Animals have instinctive behaviours that can be overridden by training for sure .. but the instinct and the potential to react is always there.

The gsd lying on the settee next to me right now was so nervous aggressive when she arrived she had to be muzzled and even the sight of a man or a child resulted in snapping and snarling. Now my grandchildren cuddle and pet her without fear and all she does is lick them and cuddle up ... but I cannot say that she would never, ever bite. There may be some trigger lying there I dont know about and one day someone finds it.. although I hope not !

Tazzle I know with advice from a qualified professional that with management you can prevent the situation so that the dog never needs to bite again.

I have to say, I agree with Snoopy that with proper advice and management it can be guaranteed that the dog would never bite again. This may mean muzzling the dog when the children are around, as well as close supervision and/or seperating the dog at certaint imes in another room or in a crate, plus behavioural training so the dog makes positive associations with the DC, but you can certainly make sure the dog never bites again. It is something that requires professional advice though, for both the dog's and DC's sake.

OP, I think it is fairly clear from your first post that the dog has been unhappy for some time and probably anxious regarding the DC, so even so on thsi occasion there may have been no obvious trigger, I doubt the dog's state of mind has been good for some years. Of course, I haven't seen the dog and I am not a behaviourist, and this is why you should seek, good professional advice. the APBC is a good place to start.

The best thing for the dog here is to stay with you, even if that means the way he lives with you has to change. It doesn't mean your DC need be at any risk at all.

Dogs generally hate to be muzzled, the OPs dog is clearly unhappy having the children around, it is not "passing on a problem" for the OP to rehome the dog, the dog just isnt suitable to be around families, she may never bite again, but WTF would you keep her in an environment where she is unhappy. I would rehome this dog if it were mine, not for the childrens sake, but for the dogs sake.

I certainly woudlnt consider PTS it is not necessary.

Contact Dacshund resccue and see if they can help you - best of luck xx

I think you are right to rehome. One of my best friends has terrible facial scarring from her cousins dog biting her in childhood. The dog was much loved, highly trained and looked after but nipped a couple of times in play one week. This was totally out of character for the dog. The next week my friend walked into the house and the dog attacked her. She has had to live with the scars as has her family had to deal with the guilt.

Unfortunately on police advice the dog had to be immediately put down. Very sad for all the family. I know it is rare but I couldn't take the risk.

Dogs can love being muzzled if it is introduced correctly. I train dogs to wear muzzles for a push the football game. They are trained to like muzzles and think it means a game is going to happen.

People can just give up on their pets when things are hard. Or you can get in a qualified professional who work out a plan. Simple things can make a huge difference to a dog.

there is a difference between what you said first
"change dogs behaviour so the situation you describe never happens again "
and managing the situation so the dog never needs to bite.

The first implies that the dog itself will never ever want to bite no matter what cos its "cured", the second is managing the environment so that the trigger is avoided.

One can desensitise / habituate / condition / counter condition depending on what behaviour change we want but we still have at the end of the day a sentient creature that can react instinctively.

I do agree with your second scenrio btw .... one can mange the situation so the dog never needs to bite again. ... and yes , that can and does take skill and knowlege and time and the conducive evnironment. Sometimes that can be provided and sometimes not.

Like with our elderly poodle dying of cancer anyway who was showing signs of stress with dS3 toddling around and who also stressed without company as she had been MIL lapdog and wanted be near me all the time.