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Why do puppies go the their homes at 8 weeks old?

36 replies

AllergicToNutters · 02/03/2012 20:41

Just wondering as it seems there is quite a narrow optimum window. Does anyone know the reason for this timing?

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MrsDeeBee · 02/03/2012 21:58

Most pups don't go at 8 weeks.

Most go between 8 and 12 weeks, which seems to be the preferred option for a lot of breeders.

It is generally considered that most pups are ready to leave Mum and litter mates from 8 weeks onwards, and are 'ready' to be a lone dog, and are ready for socialisation, etc...

If you have a breeder who is quite insistent that a pup can go at exactly 8 weeks or even before, imo I would consider very carefully the breeder. Much more preferable to have a breeder who is happy to ensure that the pup is ready to go, rather than trying to 'get rid' of them.

AllergicToNutters · 02/03/2012 22:04

MrsDeeBee - yes, I did wonder why it was that age. It does make sense as even 8 weeks is still so young. thanks Smile

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MrsDeeBee · 02/03/2012 22:24

You're welcome !

By the time pups are between 8 - 12 weeks they have pretty much gained all they can from Mum and litter mates, as in learning how to behave etc, and are ready to be indepenent, so to speak.

8 weeks is very young, if you think about how a pup grows, they literally double in size, from week one to two, week two to three etc, and then comes the walking and talking and learning behaviours. Most dogs are considered pups till they are 12 months and reach 'adolescence' so it's a lot of learning in a relatively short space of time. I suppose one way to view it is that at 8 weeks they are ready to form new attachments, to other dogs and people. If you think about the 'alpha' aspect, I guess between 8 and 12 weeks would be the optimum time to get 'used' to a new owner, and find their place in the world.

If you are thinking of getting a pup, but you feel that the breeder is trying to push the pup onto you, I would give careful consideration. Check out all other aspects of the breeder and other dogs. What's the home like ? Where are all the dogs kept, inside or out ? What temperament and behaviours do all the dogs have ? If you have any doubt at all, DON'T !

You are perfectly entitled to locate a breeder who is happy to wait a little while, to ensure all is well with the pups. Any breeder worth their salt will be more than happy to chat, at length, about any aspect of ownership and their dogs, and to answer as many and any questions you may have.

It's a huge commitment to have a pup, which grows into a dog. You should put as much effort into finding a good breeder of your potential pup, as you do into finding a partner for your children, imo. Smile

noinspiration · 02/03/2012 22:40

Based on personal experience I really do think 8 weeks is too young. I am sure there are lots of theoretical reasons why 8 weeks is considered to be optimum, but the pups I got at 12 weeks were far more independent and confident, and had fewer problems and were easier to deal with as a result. Fear aggression is also thought to be more common in dogs that have left mum very early. Certainly the case with mine.

Flatbread · 02/03/2012 23:34

When I got my dog at 8 weeks, she was still a wee girl and didn't want to be separated from her siblings. One of the first thing she did at our place was to put my stuffed elephant in her crate, as she was used to sleeping cuddled and didn't want to be alone. It was so cute and it almost broke my heart Sad

I definitely agree that eight weeks is very young.

AllergicToNutters · 03/03/2012 07:42

a breeder is selling her pups at 7 weeks, I am not going through her but had rung her because the dog I am waiting on is probably going to be kept by the breeder as a show dog and I wanted to broaden my choices jsut in case we get let down. i was quite shocked!

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LtEveDallas · 03/03/2012 07:54

These days a decent breeder wouldn't let a pup go before vaccination, so 12 weeks, ready for socialisation.

I wouldn't touch a breeder that did anything less. Breeders make more than enough money to allow for this. If they are set on bringing more dogs into a world where rescues are overrun with unwanted dogs, and dogs are being killed at a rate of 33 per minute, then morally they should ensure they do their best for their irresponsible breeding.

Rescues are different - they aren't making money off the pups so cannot afford to vaccinate. A rescue will let a pup go at 8 weeks, as the pup is unlikely to be with it's mum in any case, but these dogs will quite possibly suffer seperation anxiety so a cuddly toy or hot water bottle in the pups bed is essential.

yesbutnobut · 03/03/2012 13:26

I bought my pup recently and she came home at almost 9 weeks. I disagree that pups are going routinely at 12 weeks - though pedigree cats do. If you look on Champdogs, for instance, mostly you'll see pups will be ready at around 8 weeks. According to The Perfect Puppy (the Gwen Bailey book always recommended here) you should get a pup at 8 weeks otherwise you will miss the vital window of socialisation between 8 and 12 weeks. I guess the 8 weeks coincides with the pup 'leaving the nest' or no longer suckling its mum? Certainly some breeders of show dogs will keep pups back as by 12 weeks they can see more clearly whether they will be of show quality. Otherwise it seems to be 8 weeks. If I did it again (or should I say whenI do it again!) I might try to get a slightly older pup as 8 week old pups are quite tiny and vulnerable.

nannipigg · 03/03/2012 13:32

We have always had pups at around 12 weeks of age......I think kittens can go from about 6 weeks but I always had mine from about 10 weeks or so.

I think 8 weeks is a bit young for pups to be on their own!

higgle · 03/03/2012 13:38

When I was young we had a dog tht had several litters ( Bad old days for dogs, over 40 years ago) Once the puppies got to about 7 weeks the mother dog would withdraw from them, and was quite strict and snappy with them if they wanted much attention from her after 8 weeks, probably just natures way that this is when they are ready to leave.

LtEveDallas · 03/03/2012 13:46

Yesbutnobut, you shouldn't socialise an unvaccinated pup. Vaccinations aren't effective until 11 weeks, so I don't get how Gwen Bailey could advocate that? Seems irresponsible to me.

Flatbread · 03/03/2012 14:00

We got the first vaccination right away and our vet told us it was ok to socialised her before the second one.

The dog met loads of people and animals, no harm done. I imagine the risk of catching something must be very small.

cutegorilla · 03/03/2012 14:06

It's not about socialising with other dogs, although that is fine so long as you know they are vaccinated, it's about becoming accustomed to their new home. The optimum time for that is before 12 weeks when they naturally become more nervous and less inclined to accept new things.

LtEveDallas · 03/03/2012 14:26

OK, I must be wrong then Smile.

I suppose my view is tainted as I'd never use a breeder, backyard or otherwise.

I've taken dogs into my home earlier than 12 weeks, but never let them be with other unknown dogs until after - I honestly thought it would be irresponsible to do so. Never had an issue with a 'socialising window' though. All my dogs (and all the one I know from puppyhood) are excellent with other dogs.

I suppose my hatred of breeding is seeping through.

AnEcumenicalMatter · 03/03/2012 14:31

LtEve, on what information are you basing your sweeping statement that no good breeder would let a pup go before 12 weeks?

Certainly, it is the norm for toy breeds to remain with the breeder for 12 weeks as they are much slower to mature and need their mother for loger but for medium and large breeds, 8 weeks is considered the norm. This is because there is a very narrow window of socialisation between 8 and 14 weeks and, with the best will in the world, no breeder would be adaquately equipped to fully socialise each pup unless the litter was exceptionally small.

Up to 8 weeks, they need their litter and their mother to instill proper dog behaviour in them, beyond that they need much more one to one time and exposure to their environment to enable them develop and adapt to the surroundings that they are expected to fit into for the next 12+ years.

It is perfectly possible to properly socialise a puppy that has not had it's full course of vaccinations. After the first injection, they can go anywhere where there is a minimal risk of encountering other unvaccinated dogs. So, for example, sitting on someone's lap on a bench in the town centre, on the bus/train, standing by a busy supermarket entrance, being carried around a car boot sale etc...all perfectly safe socialisation opportunities.

In fact, Guide Dog puppies go to their new homes at 6 weeks and many people who work their dogs prefer to have a pup at 6 weeks because it is considered that the pup develops a stronger bond with the owner from this age. GDBA would hardly be farming out pups to their puppy walking homes at such a young age if there were considerable risks to health, would they? No, they do it because it has been proven that it maximises the chance of success of the dog becoming well adjusted to the outside world and going on to become fully trained guide dogs.

AnEcumenicalMatter · 03/03/2012 14:32

x post.

yesbutnobut · 03/03/2012 14:33

LtEve - it's not socialising with other dogs that I understand is important as much as getting used to the sights and sounds of everyday life. Socialising with other dogs is ok as long as the other dog is vaccinated and the dogs meet, for instance, at home or at a puppy party. I guess it would be fine for pups to stay with their breeders longer if the breeder did all of this for the pups (and I know some do), including taking pup in the car, to the shops, to meet various different people. As far as I understand it pups begin to be more wary around 3 months and that's why it's important to expose them to life before then. Plus, as higgle says, by 8 weeks mum won't want to know the pups anyway. My pup is small so I could carry her round with me before she'd had her 2nd jabs and we went to school, the park, Pets at Home, and the local shops. Don't know how those with large breed dogs manage to be honest.

yesbutnobut · 03/03/2012 14:35

X post with AEMatter!

AnEcumenicalMatter · 03/03/2012 14:48

yesbutno

It's a bit harder with a large breed pup but still doable.

I have a giant breed. At 8 weeks old she weighed 8.6kg (nearly 19lbs) so a bit heavy to carry! We mainly drove to places and spent a lot of time sitting on benches in all sorts of locations where she could meet people of all ages, observe traffic, see other dogs and animals and generally be exposed to everyday life. Of course, all the adoration and attention that she got on those few weeks now means that she firmly believes that she is irresistable to all people and gets most narked if someone passes without acknowledging her Hmm

Some people I know with the same breed as me keep an old puschair to put the puppy in for socialisation purposes. They get a few funny looks but you can pretty much take the pup anywhere in one and it works a treat Smile

yesbutnobut · 03/03/2012 14:52

I'm surprised someone hasn't come up with a doggy push chair for precisely this reason! Years ago on holiday in Miami I recall seeing a lady with 3 perfectly groomed and matching bichons being pulled along in a carriage - they certainly looked a sight. I must say all the walking about I did has paid off as my pup is very confident in public and meets dogs and people, including toddlers, very nicely [proud mum]. It's just the joggers who prove too much of a temptation ...

nannipigg · 03/03/2012 14:57

We took our pup out 5 days after his first injections, I took him out later on a night when it was quieter traffic wise etc and walked him about for about 20 mins each night before dusk. He never caught anything and vets okayed it so no harm done. Just our pup was rescued at 12 weeks and we took him home at 14 weeks, his first outing he was nearly 15 weeks old, which is quite late to start socializing I think :-s
He is great tho, loves everyone, loves other animals and so playful :-)

MrsDeeBee · 03/03/2012 16:55

yesbutnobut

There are 'doggy/puppy pushchairs' out there, just google ! Smile

AllergicToNutters · 03/03/2012 20:38

OMG!!!!ShockShock I got a friend to ring this 'breeder' as there were questions I wanted to ask to get a clearer picture of what she was actually doing. She told my friend that the pups have been away from Mum for about two weeks (so at 4 weeks old) and were fully weaned and ready to go next week (at 7 weeks). I am shocked! Shock How wrong is this?!?!?!ShockAngry

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AnEcumenicalMatter · 03/03/2012 20:40

Fully weaned and completely away from Mum at 4 weeks? Very wrong! Avoid like plague.

AllergicToNutters · 03/03/2012 20:54

Oh, I am doing, don't worry. I just feel so bad for the puppies. The bitch had 11 pups. In her advertisement it says that Mum and Grandparents can be seen but I don;t understand how they can if the pups have been removed from her. Poor Mum too SadSadSad

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