The investigation of Lucy Letby on Netflix

[TheRozzers]

Anyone watched it yet? It’s a really excellent documentary with loads of footage of her police interviews.

You see the police asking her questions about those ‘confession’ notes.

I won’t put spoilers in the OP but I’d love to hear what others made of her responses.

Mid way through I thought she’s 💯 guilty but by the end I’m really not sure. A lot points to her being innocent.

I feel for the parents of those babies so much, the uncertainty must be horrendous 😞

That alone explains the jump in deaths.

Yes. One might add that the consultants never acknowledged (perhaps never recognized) this shift, suggesting that they never wondered about their own limitations, as paediatricians and not neonatologists, in taking more vulnerable babies into intensive care. It's a sad situation.

oy don’t be catty now!

I can’t read everything and I’m not as invested in this version of events as a reason for the deaths as you clearly are

It is really hard to get medical experts - most doctors do not want to go anywhere near the courts as they are too busy working and it can be risky. Medicine also doesn’t lend itself well to legal work, as there is so much uncertainty and the courts do not like this.

This is partly why the courts end up with experts like Dewi Evan’s, who are retired and overly sure of themselves

Ah interesting

I thought the courts didn’t mind the uncertainty as long as it was clear to the jury

Exactly, it is completely obsessive, and inappropriate, and it is certainly not the "norm." Which ever pp mentioned ND as well is an insult to those medical staff who are, and would never break a single rule! Infact it is actually more common for ND people to follow rules and procedures to the T.

1. ND people are not a monolith.
2. I note that you have both conveniently overlooked the point of the pp.
3. Are you saying that people should be sentenced to a whole life prison order for taking handover sheets home? That's not very rational.

You seem pretty invested.

Im not particularly invested in the structural or scapegoating explanations

Some information of what the parents are thinking. There is more but don't want to clog the thread. I feel for them. It must be horrific.

Poor parents, but there's no real argument against the panel's expertise there. They're just wrong to think the panel members are from a single discipline - they're from a range.

And Neena Modi had no responsibility for RCPCH reviews - that was a different section of the institution. If there was any prospect of her personally being criticised as an outcome of Thirlwall, she'd have been named as an interested party like Jayaram, Brearey and the hospital managers, who had legal representation.

These aren't real problems, and anyone telling the parents they are is just prolonging their suffering

I did think the same as parents about the overseas experts - do you know why only one is from the UK?

those cultural
differences in practice and protocol that people
keep
putting forward for defence - well
this is common practice with notes etc

At least two of Lee's panel work in the UK, but I don't know who on the panel is what nationality. I think if you want the best you go international (as well as, not instead of, the UK)

But there is another panel made up of experts working in that UK, including Neil Aiton, Svilena Dimitrova and many others.

Then there are Helen Shannon, Jane Hutton, Gillian Tully, Jenny Harris, Tariq Ali, Philip Dawid who are all UK based and contributing to expert reports.

I can see the argument that you need some people with inside knowledge of the NHS and British neonatology but that certainly hasn't been neglected

It really isn’t https://x.com/NeoDoc11/status/2020825991464005829?s=20 - the reality is very different - and there are no hospital guidelines on what you can search for online in your own time. The problem is more common the other way round and you are more likely to be contacted by patients on social media

It really isn’t https://x.com/NeoDoc11/status/2020825991464005829?s=20 - the reality is very different - and there are no hospital guidelines on what you can search for online in your own time. The problem is more common the other way round and you are more likely to be contacted by patients on social media

1. I found it offensive to label a convicted baby murderer with an "Oh she is probably ND" attitude.

1. I was replying to a poster I agreed with.

1. No, clearly not. My opinion is that she did it based on everything presented.

1. Your opinion is valid; if you don't think LL did what she is accused of that is your view, and that is fine.

Edited to say bullets have gone mia

Didn't she take confidential records home that she had no business or reason having/no ongoing care as babies were already dead?

Autistic people are more likely to be wrongfully accused of a crime, so it is relevant to consider if someone has autistic traits that might have made them easier to scapegoat

Honestly I don’t think it is relevant as it’s speculation. I don’t for a moment think she is autistic but the only important thing here is whether a miscarriage of justice has occurred.

I understand your POV, but personally I really struggle with this theory. From everything I’ve followed, there isn't any actual medical evidence to show she’s autistic, so it feels like a bit of a weak argument to me. I also worry that linking neurodivergence to these types of crimes is quite unfair and potentially hurtful to the autistic community. It just doesn't sit right with me.

Very unfair.

You spend what, two years removed from your job and filing a grievance for bullying at work, just when it’s upheld and things might get back to normal you are informed the police suspect you of murder. Then you’re arrested, then bailed, then arrested again, then bailed again, then arrested again, kept in custody.

You’ve lost your home, your job, your pets have been taken away, people who you previously liked and respected think you’re a murderer, parents you tried to support think you killed their son / daughter, you’re on the strongest anti depressants just to make it through each day, your own parents are distraught and to use letbys own words, you’ll never marry or have a family, and people are saying ‘oh, maybe she came across oddly because she’s autistic?’

Blimey …

Does anyone lnow who is paying the PR company? Matlin. Are they pro bono like MM?

They are waiting to hear if the CCRC are going to refer it back to the COA. These processes take time.

The PR company is pro bono too.

No. She had handover sheets. These are the informal notes nurses make at shift handover, and they refer to them when handing over at the end of their own shift. Many, many nurses have reported going home with them in their pockets accidentally. If you read the link to X from Svilena Dimitrova you’ll see her take on this too.

Only a fraction of the sheets she had kept related to the babies Letby was convicted of murdering or harming.

She should have disposed of them in the confidential waste before going off shift, but failure to do so does not mean she’s a murderer.