The fear clinic

[Hallelujah2020]

Did anyone watch the first episode? Not sure how I feel about it, was very interesting but also uncomfortable at times.

So you can try yourself 🤔 😆

I've been really enjoying it and wondering whether this is the year I try and get rid of my phobia. They do explain the science in simple terms at intervals. My favourite episode was the last one as I loved the 180 turnaround for the moth guy. I also find it fascinating how irrational fear can be (experiencing it myself!), and how it's different for different people. I also thought Brian the rat was particularly cute 🐭

Well they give an explanation which isn't really an explanation if you ask me

Yes! I have a phobia and remember where every 8 legged freak has been. Even had one on me 😱
and I have two types of beta blockers! Only thing is can I make myself be in a room with them!

Yes I’d like more detail. To facilitate self experimentation maybe.

They must do much more that they don't show just get them to go in the room in the first place otherwise anyone could do that.

Me too! What is your phobia?

So Tirza is Actually acting?!
I mean she could have just played a video of the sounds of being sick from another room anyway couldn't she... Can't see her being sick on command...

The one with the frogs really didn't seem that bothered to be honest...

I watched this and the guy afraid of balloons made me cry. He was so terrified and vulnerable, yet so determined to do all he could to get over his fear for his family. I was so pleased for him when he went in the room the second time.

How does it work if she didn't face the fear or seeing it?

If someone in my house is ill and I hear it, then pop a beta blocker is it going to work? I just can't see it happening

I presume they're saying that she's ok with seeing people being sick as well now.
But yes it does seem to be saying that we can cure our fears ourselves by facing it head on (maybe with someone else's support) and then take a beta blocker and then be cured?!

Interesting!

I guess she couldn't see someone being they couldn't get someone to be sick on command could they

In principle self-treatment may be possible, but in practice I think it is more of a science to get the exact formula right than it appears on the programme. In particular, the exposure needs to be planned to a) be long enough and challenging enough for you personally to invoke the right amount of panic, and generate some new learning and b) not so long that your brain accustoms too much. Plus of course you have to fight against all your ridiculously strong inbuilt instincts in order to stay in the exposure and to not use normal safety behaviours (closing eyes, keeping distance, hiding behind people, keeping constant eyes on the thing etc) which may block the effect. I think this is addressed in this podcast:

https://amp.listennotes.com/podcasts/theories-of/merel-kindt-on-eliminating-myKUtjzTdJB/amp/

Interesting

Hmmm very interesting. I take beta blockers twice a day. Now thinking can I time the exposure to just before I take them..

Habibf said that I think the skill is in the support. My instinct would definitely take over.

That's not how it works. The only purpose of taking the beta blocker is to change how the way the brain processes the fear while you sleep afterwards. You would have to have gone into the MRI (or a box or similar) without any medication first, sat with the fear, THEN taken the beta blocker.

I think this is both amazing and super interesting, especially that it's also worked on people with phobias with associated trauma (the lady with emetophobia because of hearing her mother throw up repeatedly during the traumatic divorce of her parents). This makes me wonder if something similar could be used/adapted for other anxiety disorders which (although more complex) all have the same disordered fight/flight response system at their core - anxiety and fear are the same thing. Would be interesting to see some studies on this.

Absolutely, that's where the skill is. I've been watching what they do and trying to work it out - they encourage the person to stay with the fear, to give in to it/not try to control it, avoid moving away, or doing other protective behaviours like hugging themselves, or hiding behind the therapist, plus they need the fear response to be as high as possible, so there needs to be the right amount of exposure, and for the anxiety/fear response to plateau (which it almost always does eventually if you sit with fear or anxiety). Very hard to do on your own, or even with an untrained partner, when everything is screaming at you to run away!!!

It worked for her because hearing someone being sick was a bigger trigger for her than seeing it, probably because when the phobia was formed she was repeatedly hearing (but not seeing) her mother being sick.

If your biggest trigger is seeing someone being sick, then you’d need to face that, not do any behaviours that make you feel better in the moment, like look away, hug yourself, not moving or running away, let your fear really build, challenging yourself more than you ever have before, and then wait for the fear to plateau, then stop. Then take the beta blocker, don't talk to anyone about it before you sleep, then retest your response the next day.

Very hard to do on your own.

Well there must be something in it to make it work, they don't really have time to explain it on the show.

Seeing someone throw up would be horrific for me, but the worst is being sick myself.. how on earth would they do that? 🙈

Plus, I though she was originally going to puke in the big clear bucket, but the lady freaked out so they put her in the other room? 🤔 I though she was at least going to walk out with the gross sick bucket lol

Yes good point thinking about it
Was she actually going to be sick in front of her? Or would she have made an excuse up in the end to go in the other room anyway?

She didn't look that sick to me considering this is a person who's going to be sick very imminently!

Why did they ask Jack to take off his shirt???

Quite touching with James tonight

Yes it was very good tonight. But i cant help thinking the beta blockers use is very misleading.

If only it was that easy..

What did they actually do with the woman with emetophobia? I had to turn it off cos I couldn't watch but I realise that's the whole point!!!

We didn't see anyone being sick. The 'sick person' (who must have been someone pretending to be sick although she didn't look sick to me anyway lol) went into a different room in the end and you heard her being sick (but I presume this was a video being played rather than her being sick on command).

Although she was in the same room to start with with a 'sick bucket'. She only went into the other room cos the person afraid couldn't do it. (But it still worked cos she was afraid of hearing sick too.

Don't know what would have happened if the person managed to stay in the same room to start off with...