Blair and Brown: the New Labour Revolution

[PermanentTemporary]

Really enjoying this. Can't say there's huge revelations we didn't all know but it's still gripping. Just got to Princess Diana's death.

I loved it. Excellent documentary. I'm not especially political and certainly wasn't a fan of either of them but really well made and fascinating.

It does strike me though that although I wasn't a fan, they all at least seemed capable of running government unlike the current crop of politicians.

It's fascinating. I've only watched the first one and it's nothing new, but it was a brilliant mix of a reminder that there can be hope in politics, and entertaining petty bitching. Gordon making a point of saying he met Clinton before Tony made me chuckle all day.

Absolutely. And Tony returning to his marvellous schtick 'gosh it's amazing this all happened to little old me' is fascinating to watch, and I like the guy!

Sounds like a horror show. The UK is today so badly suffering the legacy.

I expect the programme doesn't mention Blair's war on the disabled (or Gordon Brown's housing benefit cuts that began mass social cleansing)?

May 1997 was a dark day for the country. Not only but particularly for the disabled.

Watching it now. It's fascinating.

Loving the bit where the WI reduced Blair to jelly!

@AlexaShutUp

Loving the bit where the WI reduced Blair to jelly!

Yep, totally missed that at the time 😆

I remember it all very well indeed. The main thing I remember was the sense of overwhelming optimism (not shared by everyone) after so long under the Tories.

I didn't like Teflon Tony much myself; his self - deprecating "what, little old me?" act grated a bit but I think he captured the mood of the nation pretty well at the time (for a while, at least).

It’s a great documentary. I was a teenager at the time so lots of it passed me by although I was vaguely aware from the news being on at tea time etc. Really interesting to watch now as an adult.

I have just binge watched the entire series. It made for very interesting viewing. The BBC did very well to get the key players involved.

Both Blair and Brown had major flaws, and those flaws clearly got in the way of what I believe was actually a genuine desire in both of them to serve the country. I wonder how history will reflect on our current leaders.

I’ve been enjoying it. Not a huge Blairite especially, but just hearing him and GB speak has made me long for the days of competent politicians.

@AlexaShutUp

Loving the bit where the WI reduced Blair to jelly!

I quite admired the way he talked about it in retrospect. He didn’t try and make it seem less embarrassing- I liked the way he sort of shrugged and was like “yeah, I looked like a tit that day” 😂

It was Alastair Campbell sniggering about it that made me smile! But yes, it was refreshing to see him admit that he looked a bit of an idiot!

Started it last night and it’s great. I remember some of it quite well but had missed the WI showdown

Interesting the stuff they missed. I was very surprised they totally skated over the "bigoted woman" episode... Which is surely one of the most memorable points of brown's tenure? Never brilliant with the public...

For all of their mistakes, and there were many, I feel that they were of a different calibre from our current crop of politicians on both sides of the house.

Yes, there was so much hope in 1997 and for many of us, it ended in disappointment and disillusionment. There are certain mistakes that it is hard to forgive, and so many things that they failed to deliver, and yet much was achieved in those years too.

The thing that really struck me after watching it all is that I cannot even imagine feeling that level of hope and optimism about a political party ever again. None of the current lot seem capable of inspiring a nation. I wonder if we will ever get that again in the future?

I always saw Blair for the snake oil salesman that he was.

His war on the disabled wasn't a mistake. He pushed for it. Brown is culpable too. He was chancellor when it happened, and as PM he continued the attack on the vulnerable.

Brown's housing benefit cuts put us on the road to the social cleansing and public health housing and homelessness emergency of today.

Then there was the wage suppression - propping up poverty wages with taxpayer money (tax credits). Better would've been to sort out the brewing affordable secure housing crisis, so that people could afford to live on lower waged jobs.

Those who came after - and the policies - were very much the consequences of Blair and Brown (remember Cameron was the self described heir to Blair). As are many of today's problems (including the HGV driver shortage - the legacy of poverty wages and worsening conditions of employment).

As for the warmongering. Mistake indeed.

It was fascinating but I thought they came across as two damaged men. Blair was in denial and Brown looked like he was still suffering the hurts he endured.

Blair seemed more honest about his premiership but it was telling that Richard Wilson, the cabinet Secretary, said that TB was the centre of TB's world. I guess you do need an arrogance or the pressure of the job would crush you. But it seemed to me as the interview went on, TB remembered things differently to how they happened so of course its easier to be honest if you've changed the story in your head so that you were right. I thought Gordon Brown came across with more political commitment but he also lied. He remembered things clearly except the bits where he was haranguing TB to leave office. Probably the most important bit in his career. 🤔

Overall it felt like TB lost interest in domestic issues and he enjoyed international issues where he could be feted and admired. Sending men and women to their death so he could hold court on centre stage.

I really enjoyed it. I lived through it. I remember it. I'm surprised to say that I thought that actually overall they and the LP came across pretty well.

Tealightsandd I thought that family income support was brought in by the tories. Wasn’t that to top up poor wages?

You can say what you want about Tony Blair but he won the 1997 election & he changed the Labour Party from the red flag waving party to the red rose party who won the election. He had the right face for modernising the Labour Party & turning a party that was unelectable in to a winning party ready to govern. Like the party changed before the 1997 election, it needs to change again now.

@madisonbridges

It was fascinating but I thought they came across as two damaged men. Blair was in denial and Brown looked like he was still suffering the hurts he endured.

Blair seemed more honest about his premiership but it was telling that Richard Wilson, the cabinet Secretary, said that TB was the centre of TB's world. I guess you do need an arrogance or the pressure of the job would crush you. But it seemed to me as the interview went on, TB remembered things differently to how they happened so of course its easier to be honest if you've changed the story in your head so that you were right. I thought Gordon Brown came across with more political commitment but he also lied. He remembered things clearly except the bits where he was haranguing TB to leave office. Probably the most important bit in his career. 🤔

Overall it felt like TB lost interest in domestic issues and he enjoyed international issues where he could be feted and admired. Sending men and women to their death so he could hold court on centre stage.

I really enjoyed it. I lived through it. I remember it. I'm surprised to say that I thought that actually overall they and the LP came across pretty well.

I think that's a very good summary. I agree that they both came across as deeply flawed and damaged men, but I believe they tried to do what they thought was right as well.

@Nat6999

You can say what you want about Tony Blair but he won the 1997 election & he changed the Labour Party from the red flag waving party to the red rose party who won the election. He had the right face for modernising the Labour Party & turning a party that was unelectable in to a winning party ready to govern. Like the party changed before the 1997 election, it needs to change again now.

Yes but I won't fall for it twice lol.

@Tealightsandd

I always saw Blair for the snake oil salesman that he was.

His war on the disabled wasn't a mistake. He pushed for it. Brown is culpable too. He was chancellor when it happened, and as PM he continued the attack on the vulnerable.

Brown's housing benefit cuts put us on the road to the social cleansing and public health housing and homelessness emergency of today.

Then there was the wage suppression - propping up poverty wages with taxpayer money (tax credits). Better would've been to sort out the brewing affordable secure housing crisis, so that people could afford to live on lower waged jobs.

Those who came after - and the policies - were very much the consequences of Blair and Brown (remember Cameron was the self described heir to Blair). As are many of today's problems (including the HGV driver shortage - the legacy of poverty wages and worsening conditions of employment).

As for the warmongering. Mistake indeed.

I was disabled under the Tories and under Labour and I can say without any hesitation at all that it was much better under Labour so I have no idea what you are talking about. As a teenager I was treated as a sponger under the Thatcher Government, things improved hugely under Labour and then the real assault on the disabled began under the Coalition during austerity which is why George Osborne was booed at the Paralympic Games in 2012. Fortunately for me my personal situation had much improved by then but I remained a member of many disability groups and the way disabled people were treated at that time was absolutely heartbreaking.

I am much better now, have a flexible, professional job and earn good money but I’ve never forgotten how I was made to feel when I was ill and vulnerable - and which governments were responsible.

I really enjoyed the documentary, although I was sorry they did not show this masterful and hilarious speech by William Hague, when Gordon Brown was Prime Minister.