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His Dark Materials

905 replies

AllGoodDogs · 19/07/2019 22:50

New BBC adaptation, looks so good, can't wait Grin trailer here -

m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10162256439035553&id=683285552&sfnsn=mo

OP posts:
SurpriseSparDay · 09/12/2019 11:34

Apart from the dearth of daemons that was pretty damn magnificent.

The Will actor is utterly majestic in the way he manages to demonstrate the weight of care and mystery on his shoulders.

I am still determined to be Serafina Pekkala in my next life. (Without the tragedy, of course.)

7Days · 09/12/2019 11:35

But it would be 'simple' for Pan to be formed as a trainable animal for the cuddling scenes.
You could cuddle and sob over a real rabbit/rat/dog no problem

purpleme12 · 09/12/2019 11:43

I also wondered why they didn't realise the daemons

But I thought maybe they've lost their connection? No idea I haven't read the books so all I know is the programme and what's said here!

thecatsthecats · 09/12/2019 12:05

But it would be 'simple' for Pan to be formed as a trainable animal for the cuddling scenes.
You could cuddle and sob over a real rabbit/rat/dog no problem

I don't have enough knowledge to claim this is easy, but I just rewatched LOTR on Saturday.

Gollum hand to hand fighting with hobbits, Nazgul snapping horses from the ground, giant spiders encasing actors in goo. I also saw Andy Serkis in a documentary about bringing Neanderthals to life.

It's not a new problem they had to solve!

(disclaimer - I haven't actually seen yesterday's episode yet - but if that's how they treat it, how are they going to manage THAT scene from the Amber Spyglass?!?!)

nibdedibble · 09/12/2019 12:19

I sobbed at the arrival with Roger of the severed children. I don't remember them in the book looking shaven-headed and grey-faced (as if released from a concentration camp in 1945) but I think - to inject a slightly positive note - they showed that the others were feeling discomfort and disgust that they knew they needed to get over (and did).

The young nurse also, who'd been severed - she was very good.

But yeah, they haven't really scratched the surface of what PP wrote into the relationship between human and daemon. It's such a waste of all the good bits - for example, Ruth Wilson is fabulous, Trollesund looked perfect, Iorek likewise, Scoresby is great and ambiguous, I love how they've realised the Gyptians and I love how some of the main characters aren't white, that feels good and right. But you know, to realise some of these things they have spent a lot of money, but saved it on the daemons?

I still maintain that the writers of the adaptation didn't 'feel' the human-daemon bond and saw the books as a story first and a different way of being second.

nibdedibble · 09/12/2019 12:20

That is a ramble!

SurpriseSparDay · 09/12/2019 12:45

That was a great ramble!

Igneococcus · 09/12/2019 13:15

I loved the look on Farder Coram's face when Serafina shows up frot he fight.

SurpriseSparDay · 09/12/2019 13:23

Hmm ... I always have a difficulty with witches; why can’t they wipe out all the evil in the world without prompting and pleading from mere mortals?

IIRC they pretty much solved this in Buffy - but here I’m puzzled by the witches’ inactivity until there was a fight going on. And only one shows up. Can’t remember the explanation in the books - but it’s a general problem in fiction.

EBearhug · 09/12/2019 13:46

I don't think the witches are all good. They get involved partly because of the likely effects on their own interests, not being all altruistic. Witches often don't have a positive press in fiction.

Also, I suspect LOTR had a rather bigger budget for animation compared with a BBC production.

mousemousse · 09/12/2019 13:56

Really not liking the daemons portrayal, like little sidekicks rather than wise souls. In the books you really got sense that the Daemon and person were one personality who sometimes suffered indecision but in this adaptation the human decides something and the Daemon just goes along with it - not a very equal partnership.

PP also used the daemons to enable female and male characters were exactly balanced, so when we don't hear from the female daemons so much (like with the gyptians) it can come across as too masculine

thecatsthecats · 09/12/2019 15:41

Also, I suspect LOTR had a rather bigger budget for animation compared with a BBC production.

That was decades ago. The technology was more expensive and less sophisticated. And the neanderthal documentary that only aired on BBC 4 will have had a far, FAR smaller budget than HDM!

CruCru · 09/12/2019 16:06

I’m loving this series but haven’t read the books. I was wondering whether my son would enjoy them - from what age do you think they can be enjoyed?

dementedma · 09/12/2019 20:16

I enjoyed this episode, and have a total girl crush on Serafina!
Ruth Wilson was brilliant, she way she subtly mimicked the movements of her monkey daemon in dropping out of the air hatch was very clever.
Love Lee Scorsby!

MoreSchnitzelPlease · 09/12/2019 20:59

It is winding me up that characters are frequently referred to by both first and last name, particularly when referencing Tony and Billy Costa. The audience isn't stupid, we don't need to be constantly reminded who people are.

The cliffhanger of the most recent episode was completely ruined by the 'coming up' clips at the end. Lyra didn't even look injured by the fall. There are no stakes for the next episode.

Unihorn · 09/12/2019 21:02

CruCru I read them aged about 12 I think. I had to reread them when out of my teens to get them a bit more though.

purpleme12 · 09/12/2019 21:15

It is strange I think that they show so much of the next episodes

ShinyGiratina · 09/12/2019 21:24

They did have the severed dæmons still in the cages being taken back to the gyptians. Presumably they weren't very responsive to travel themselves. In Bolvangar, Bridget's rabbit was shown repeatedly banging his head in a stress response, others were just lying around.

Just watched it again with the DCs. It is brilliantly acted throughout. I would just like to see more consistency of intimacy and connection in the dæmon relationships. Hester/ Lee is great along with Golden Monkey/ Mrs Coulter.

I knew DS1 would be full of questions and love the fighting scenes. He's just asked about Iorek killing the bear and why from a couple of episodes ago, so I think he'll be into next week's too. Because they're generation streaming/ box sets, it's the first time they've really had to wait a week of real time to get the next episode. How character building for them Grin

noblegiraffe · 09/12/2019 21:28

Characters are referred to by first name and last name a lot in the book. John Faa, Billy Costa, Serafina Pekkala, Lee Scoresby etc. It’s not for the show.

Footle · 09/12/2019 22:12

@SurpriseSparDay , I have the same difficulty with God.

AnotherEmma · 09/12/2019 22:17

Schnitzel agree about the teaser completely spoiling the cliffhanger. What's the bloody point?!

SurpriseSparDay · 09/12/2019 22:22

Ah, well - I’ve never had any expectations in that direction, Footle.

colouringinpro · 09/12/2019 23:04

pmk agreeing about the human daemon bond and especially the lack of hug when Lyra and Pan were reunited - really?! Loved Lee/Lin with the I'm responsible for her / love part Grin

Footle · 10/12/2019 15:04

@SurpriseSparDay Just as well, eh?

SurpriseSparDay · 11/12/2019 00:50

However, something must be working well - I’ve realised I’m wishing the days away until Sunday. Cannot remember the last time that happened.

And wondering more and more about the discrete life of an externalised soul. Has PP written anything about his purpose regarding daemons - or are we to draw meaning solely from the fiction? What is the nature of a daemon? Is it my internal monologue hopping along beside me or soaring overhead? Or my consciousness? Or ... what?