Channel 4 ,10.15pm Dispatches Home Education Programme.

[staydazzling]

An hour long programme about home education, and should councils have more power,authority in that area, I dont HE, but i know people who do. Its caused a lot of contention on twitter so I'll be watching.

I've missed watching a very interesting documentary about Walt Disney- to watch this crap.

Do you not record programmes to watch later?

Oh, and the Children's Commisioner is wrong when she says that parents can educated their any way they see fit. That is simply misleading.

Copied from Elective Home Education Service:

Parents have a responsibility to provide an education for their children. Section 7 of the Education Act 1996, states:

“The parent of every child of compulsory school age shall cause him to receive efficient full-time education suitable-

(a) to his age, ability and aptitude, and(b) to any special educational needs he may have, either by regular attendance at school or otherwise.”The duties of parents

It is the duty of each parent:

To ensure that your school age child is educated.To delegate that duty to a school, or carry it out yourself.To ensure the education provided is efficient and full time.To ensure the education is suitable to the child’s age, ability and aptitude.

I have a child at home. He has an ehcp but wasn’t coping at school. Been off for a couple of months now we haven’t seen anyone. Nephew was out of school a year. There’s nowhere for them to go..... no places. Safeguarding risk where he is, needs the lea to agree to special school. So he plays games all day. Completely disengaged. Trained professionals can’t get him to work. I sure as hell cant. What a fuck up

We HE. My DC have never been to school so are "invisible" to the LA. They did go to nursery & DC1 was diagnosed with ASD & it became clear v quickly that they wouldn't suit a normal school environment.

This programme isn't at all representative of the HE families I know. We go to groups every day, both HE specific groups & things like Beavers, etc. so they're seen by lots of different people both with me present & by themselves. That's typical of all my HE friends.

I've only heard of one family who give me cause for concern for their DC & have advised the person who told me about them to contact SS because that's what people should do when they have concerns for any child's safety. That's the system for protecting all children, regardless of where they're educated. There are already safeguarding procedures in place.

Parents shouldn't be forced into HE because schools are failing their children. That's awful, but it's not a HE problem - it's a problem with the school system. Let's sort that out, not demonise HE. If we start assuming HEed children could be at risk of abuse, where does it end? Some religious parents are abusive, let's monitor them all. Some parents are abusive, stick them on a register & check up on them... Whatever happened to "innocent until proven guilty"?!

the use of the words skipping school and invisible kids are a bit its not truancy and they're not missing!

plus someone I know brought this point up, where would all these kids go? schools are so oversubscribed as it is.

Well I don't think that's the issue I think that's irrelevant. A lot of people who are home educated did have a place it's just they were taken out for whatever reason. Others if they apply they would be found a place

This is not the place to grind your axe. For crying out loud report your post and ask them to take all these identifying details out. It's not fair on your daughter to do this.

It's also got sod all to do with home education!

1. Complain by Email info.request*@childrenscomm*issioner.gov.uk

1. Tweet your disapproval to @annelongfield and @childrenscomm and @c4dispatches @ofstednews

1. Children's Commissioner has a Facebook page where you can complain

now do it

wow summat went off here

A Fathers4Justice-type warrior with a massive axe to grind. Lots of identifying info so I reported it.

Back to the topic at hand...
The Children's Commissioner has got a guest post here, so do make your feelings felt: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/guest_posts/3499721-Guest-post-Home-education-is-a-contentious-issue-I-know-there-will-be-parents-who-may-be-upset-by-my-Dispatches-documentary

Oh thankyou Sethos

Hi. I watched this programme this evening. I was wondering if anyone who knows about home schooling can help. I live in Lancashire and a friend whose 3 children have never been to school.

They are taught at home by their Dad (not a qualified teacher) . They are a very religious family and they are taught very specifically from the bible.. and that they should be grow up to live their lives according to the scriptures. They can read and write but overwhelmingly the bible and faith are by far the strongest message.. about what is right and wrong . Some might say they are brainwashed .They socialise with children from the church but this is a particular denomination where all parents have exactly the same views. The children are physically well cared for but mentally I worry about them.

Is it just none of my business and it's up to them what they do? It would appear so from this programme. Thanks

seth

Home schooling isn’t in itself a concern, it’s the lack of oversight where the children may be already vulnerable. So if you have concerns about their welfare and feel they may be at risk of harm, contact social services. They won’t intervene purely on the basis that they don’t socialise outside of their faith community.

Family thanks

It's not just that but it's hard to articulate. They are learning about the world through one source only and it's very extreme. A friend who happened to see them in a park recently who works with autistic children thinks be of the children could be autistic, but this will never be recognised or picked up on if he doesn't go to school.

With the welfare issue... I guess that's what I'm trying to establish. I suppose (though I don't agree with it) that there is not a welfare issue with teaching the children that the man is the ruler of the house and the woman should remain submissive, and that being gay is a sin etc .. however I do worry about how these children will ever lead a 'normal' life or know how to be'..

I am not anti Home schooling .. I just have big concerns about my friends children.

If she's your friend have you raised your concerns with her? The family obviously do socialise outside their church a bit as they know you. They may well use other books and resources that they haven't told you about. However, obvioulsy if you are concerned for their welfare you should contact SS.

Thanks.. I feel very torn as we are very close friends and I would really feel for her and the disruption to her life it would cause.. but when I think about the DCs I change my mind . Yes I am the only friend they see outside of the church. I have tried to talk to her but they are so deeply embedded in what they are doing and it's led mainly by him .. so that ties in with the man being the ruler of the house and final decision on everything being his.

Seth the law in this country is as follows, and the responsibility for the education of the child lies with the parents; it's just that most parents choose to use school to fulfil their obligations.

7: Duty of parents to secure education of children of compulsory school age: The parent of every child of compulsory school age shall cause him to receive efficient full-time education suitable—
a: to his age, ability and aptitude, and
b: to any special educational needs he may have,
either by regular attendance at school or otherwise.

Do you have welfare concerns about those children? Or do you just disagree with their faith and how they choose to live their lives?

Also, I don't really understand your statement A friend who happened to see them in a park recently who works with autistic children thinks be of the children could be autistic, but this will never be recognised or picked up on if he doesn't go to school.

Why wouldn't it ever be recognised or picked up on unless he's in school?

It is possible to contact the education authority with concerns on educational neglect for them to check, often with Education Welfare Services departments or similar. If you have a serious concern that the parents are not fulfilling their legal responsibility to ensure their children's right to education, that would be the route to take. It's in part why education authorities are meant to keep records of what we provide to them - to cover their and our butts when the education we provide is questioned.

Much like social services, they are cut to the bone at the moment and the only relevant case I've heard of involved concerns about educational provided by religious parents that as the children were still able to interact within their Orthodox community, it was deemed acceptable. It can be worrying, I know more than a few other ex-evangelicals who, due to the damage educational neglect dismissed under religious freedom had on their lives, have some harrowing stories and many working hard to help others in similar situations. However, other than continuing to be her friend and potentially reporting, I'm not sure what else can be done at this time.

Honestly, @Seth, I think you've got a better chance of helping the children to know that there's a world beyond their parents' religion by staying close friends with the mum (I'm assuming that you actually like her, if she's such a close friend), rather than alienating her completely by reporting her. She can't be that fundamentalist if she's got a close relationship outside the community, presumably? I'd just focus on being there in the background and modelling an alternative way of life to those children, and being a welcoming ear if they ever want to talk to you.

I very much doubt that social services/ the LA could or would do anything if there are no other welfare concerns.

Thankyou . I have remained close to her as I want to be exactly that. We have been v close friends since university and her seeing me every few months is the only break she gets (she works in a high level job and he is at home with the 3 DC) . If it all comes tumbling down at some point then she always knows she can confide in me/ come here with the DCs. Maybe it's none of my business but I have real concerns not about the DCs right now as they don't know any other life... but in the future. What life will they have ? How will
They be equipped to operate / take GCSE's / socialise .. I do see a marked difference as the DCs get older ) My friend is out at work all day and says she has no idea what the (v controlling) husband does with the kids or what he teaches them. I feel disloyal writing this but when I see them it bothers me. I'm not sure what the definition of Christian radicalisation is but I would imagine it's pretty close..,

Anyway it seems as if the services are all pretty stretched and even though there is no obvious physical abuse going on it doesn't seem from what you say I would get anywhere anyway. It's good to hear people's thoughts though, thanks

He is very fundamentalist. The combination of her submission to him as he is the man of the house and makes the decisions plus her being at work all day .. plus him having a very strong personality means that she just goes along with whatever he wants. She wouldn't challenge him and is in the think of it so maybe can't see it anyway.

But of your friend doesn't even know what her own children do all day how do you know?

Daisie
I guess that's my point. I don't know. I know him well enough (and things that he has told me that he has said / done) and his extreme posts on social media to be concerned though. I also see how he is with the DCs on the brief occasions where our paths cross. He rules by fear and thinks that discipline and good manners are the most important things in life.. ie a show if good parenting. Nothing else matters. Again I am thinking aloud here. I know that there are many more obvious and urgent cases that SS probably have to deal with, but this feels all wrong and very extreme in every sense.