4 men, 175 babies C4

[TheLastMermaid]

Anyone watching? Anyone else worried about the implications? The programme hasn't addressed any of the issues yet but hoping they will.

Blimey it's different, very stark TV. Felt strange watching Mark holding the toddler but she seemed fine with it. Wonder what people tell their children.

It's quite weird. One bit of me thinks "typical men, ego demands they spread their 'brilliant' genes around" Another but thinks they're rather selfless which is nice to see in a man.

Considering discussing it with DH, who has excellent genes! And I can't envisage being jealous. I've had my children and would be pleased to think of them having unknown half-siblings. What are your thoughts about this? Does this make me odd?

It's whether when they're 18 they somehow track down their halfsibs (your kids) and some sort of family ruckus ensues.

They must get off on it. They spend their own money on travelling and equipment. Wanking in the van in the street or someone else's bathroom. And "Mark" is obviously elderly and hasn't told his wife what he is up to.

If there is a demand for something then people will always take advantage.

What about siblings meeting in later life no idea they are related. Genetic faults too. It's horrible

I can't believe the second one's wife doesn't know!

Mostly, though, I just think having so many biological half siblings in a small geographical area is potentially disastrous. There are reasons why clinics restrict how many times a man can donate.

Sperm donor? BNP member? Not sure which is worse tbh...

Sorry Ledehe, cross posted.

These men are disgusting. Get to sow their wild oats with no responsibility whatsoever

Yeah they're coming across more and more creepy...
But I suppose there must be loads of much lower-key donors who just do one or two a year perhaps? But they wouldn't be interesting enough for tv!

How do they get a certificate to guarantee disease-free? Is that a normal thing to ask your GP for?

@TerfTerfTerf - there's no such thing (I'm a gp). The recipients will just have to go on trust that they have been tested.

Poor Clive's wife doesnt like him being a sperm donor. He doesnt care and is now telling the whole of Britain about it. Poor woman. And what about his children and grandchildren.

I think the women just need to trust they are disease free. Even if they have STI check certificates they could go out of date by the time they are issued.

I cant imagine being so desperate for a baby that Id risk one of these guys. Poor women 😢

Where would you get an STI certificate from if not your GP? (I'm learning a lot this evening!)

OK, DH is not even slightly interested, and gave me that "are you on glue?" look

It's uncomfortable viewing.

It all seems so seedy (no pun intended). The fact that they're happily letting strange men into their bathrooms to wank is bad enough without the STI risks. And that's having weeded out the men who are offering sleep as a way to get sex from desperate women.

I really can't get my head around the intention behind these men donating to so many women at their own expense. Is it a caveman like need to spread their genetics around or is it some sort of hero complex?

The fact that two of those men have done this in secret and one is still doing it despite knowing his wife is unhappy about it makes their reasons dubious imo.

And what happens from a legal perspective if/when each of those 'donor children' decide to find out who their donor parent is? As the lawyer said, each one has the right to inherit.

These men may feel that they're helping and are fulfilling their hero complexes and the women may feel that they've got what they wanted without the expense of a clinic, but I can't help but feel it's hugely risky and irresponsible from both sides.

Offering sleep....? I meant offering sex!! Doh

How many are men allowed to donate at an actual clinic?

How could they do this without knowing the mans health and other important information. I mean there is desperation and then there’s pure selfishness.

Some men do have a bit of a fetish going on about having a woman pregnant with their baby. It wouldn't surprise me if most of these "generous" men fall into that category.

I can see where the women are coming from though. Not everyone is lucky enough to meet someone to have children with. Finances might allow raising a child with the gradual bit by bit costs etc but not the money to afford multiple attempts at other solo routes before fertility runs out. This is a low cost alternative in their eyes!

That was one of the most disturbing things I have seen in ages.
These men are so irresponsible.

I agree it is hugely irresponsible. It is very concerning that so many siblings could live in a small area without knowing - but I'm not sure licensed clinics are any better in that regard now (though there is a limit on how many times a man can donate).

My ex recently discovered that he has a half sister, following his father donating sperm to a clinic in the 80s. His half sister was born and brought up in the same town as my ex and is only a couple of years younger than him. I was really surprised that the sperm wasn't used further afield to avoid potential issues! My ex is now left wondering how many other siblings he has and whether he's slept with any of them (unlikely but not 100% impossible!). She found their father via a 23and me DNA test - I suspect the prospector this will put men off donating 'officially' and result in more women using the services of bloke's like this, where there are no legal checks and balances at all.

A private clinic might offer a "certificate" but why would a nhs gp or clinic offer one? For any legitimate purpose no one needs to know the result apart from the patient, which would just be given verbally during a normal consultation, the same as any other test results. If you require any documentation that is not required for usual nhs purposes eg an insurance medical, a gp would usually charge a fee and it would be at their discretion. There is no way I would a provide a "certificate" so someone who told me they were an unlicensed sperm donor. It would be highly irresponsible, as the result would only be a snapshot in time, it cannot guarantee someone's sexual health. I suspect that there must be some unscrupulous private clinics doing them, or the men produce fake certificates, or the women just have to trust their word for it that they are safe.

OMG i'm glad i found this, just watching this on record. Am flabbergasted - and i was a surrogate so people assume this sort of thing sits okay with me. A lot of these blokes work within quite a small radius & yet donate on a huge scale. Scary stuff!

Re the STI checks, you can pay for them to be done as in depth as you want at a GUM clinic. You get written results posted to you within 10 days...but usually they would need redoing every 6 months so they are up to date!

To answer PP, when donating properly through clinics in UK, donors can be used for ten families but with an unlimited number of siblings within those families. But unless you are like the Radford's then that will be 2-3 per family at the most I guess.

You can also find out from the HFEA what half-siblings have been born - sex and birth year. This is supposed to help teens and adults when meeting partners to avoid relationships with half siblings. This wouldn't be possible for those using donors on this programme (and more risky with the high numbers!).

Interestingly with the development of websites like 23andMe it's becoming more of a risk for people like Mark to keep what they are doing secret. It would only take one of Mark's own children to register and find a half sibling for the whole other life of Mark's to unfold. And I expect donor conceived children may be more likely to register on something like that.

Reputable clinics encourage donors to be open with their own families, from as young as possible. The biggest damage coming from these situations is the lies, rather than the situation itself.

Just watching this on catch up. It's a bit worrying to think there's that many children fathered by the same few men. It would be awful in the future if they unwittingly started a relationship/family with a half sibling.

Would it be awful, though? I know it's a taboo, but if they never knew? The main risks from consanguinity are when it's repeated, so cousins marrying cousins marrying cousins, so very little genetic new material. A one off, due to unknown paternity, has probably happened since the bronze age, and a travelling trader might have had fun in each visited place. Or all those children of "the milkman."

I would guess that throughout history, there have been some prolific "seed sowers" , probably within limited areas, it's just now we know more because of dna testing.