Page 3 | Three day nanny

nicestrongtea · 18/08/2015 22:12

In this case they needed a detached professional.

Sallyhasleftthebuilding · 18/08/2015 22:14

Cruel? Kids and parents desparate for a full nights sleep ... thats cruel. It worked. They wont remember crying like that, they learnt to sleep.

RabbitSaysWoof · 18/08/2015 22:26

But she wasn't letting the children cry because she was detached, she was letting them cry because she is an experienced professional and she was 100% sure that the cry was not one of distress.
I am certain the nanny will use the skills she has to determine her own baby's crying and let them learn the skills they need to go to sleep and stay asleep.
I was a nanny before dc and tbh I didn't find it that different I let my dc learn to self sooth at weeks old, absolutely not the same as crying it out at all, it would just look that way to anyone looking in.
mygoodparenting.com/2011/06/09/understanding-the-mantra-cry/

nicestrongtea · 18/08/2015 22:31

I meant vs a parent but I agree totally with what you have writtenRabbit

RabbitSaysWoof · 18/08/2015 22:41

Oh it wasn't a dig, just that I disagree with the post above that someone with childcare experience knows nothing about parenting.
It's still first hand experience, and I think sometimes the assumption is that a straight talking matter of fact nanny is cold and uncaring, but no one becomes a nanny because they don't like children it's not rewarding to hold a child back.
When I have been asked advice on aspects of behaviour in my job, and the only honest answer I can give sounds like a harsh instruction I always stress that I would do the same with my own child, and I'm not saying it because the child is not mine and matters less, I only ever give advice I would be willing to follow with my own child.

iAmSiri · 18/08/2015 22:46

I worked with children all of my career. It was still a huge shock when I had my own!

Original poster

fabuLou · 18/08/2015 22:47

The whole sleep thing did need to be done in this case. The family couldn't carry on.

I found it a bit worrying when the dh said wife was a strong independent wonen in her own business so he found it hard to support her now. Add libbi g of course.

My advice would be, put the girls in nursery for 1-2 days per week or get some other help with childcare.
Insist dh takes them out for at least half a day every weekend.
Use the buggy all the time as much as possible.
Do not take them shopping

OP posts:

DeandraReynolds · 18/08/2015 22:49

Yeah, a special kind of cry that means it's ok to let a tiny baby cry it out...

Gileswithachainsaw · 18/08/2015 22:50

they weren't tiny babies though

RabbitSaysWoof · 18/08/2015 23:08

No it's not a cry of distress, its distinctive. My dc's sounded like a rhythmic type cry, very much one tone, then went into a creaky throaty noise after a while, when he had practiced a few times he dropped the cry bit had a quick little throaty creak and he was sleeping within minutes he would make the throaty noise during the night for almost 6 months, then when you looked at him he would actually have he's eyes closed. It's not about shutting the door and fucking off when they are small it's about pausing and listening before acting it doesn't actually take long to determine the difference.

bostonkremekrazy · 19/08/2015 00:06

70 minutes of screaming borders on abuse in my opinion - no comfort at all.......it might work but at what cost - teaching a baby cry and nobody comes.

no preparing the children that the dummies and bottles will be going - just suddenly here is the dummy tree bye bye dummies. the confused little faces. at least spend some a few days preparing the girls for what will happen. just bizzarre. this was all about the parents needs not the girls.

Sallyhasleftthebuilding · 19/08/2015 08:43

I think with sleep, the girls will benefit from better parents. How they got there 2/3 nights of crying ... hardly a life lesson. On the slide, the girl learnt whinging was less fun than playing on the slide. She realised whining got her no where. Different if they are actually hurt.

AnotherTimeMaybe · 19/08/2015 09:06

70 minutes of screaming borders on abuse in my opinion - no comfort at all.......it might work but at what cost - teaching a baby cry and nobody comes

it'd be interesting to see how far the nanny was willing to go. Even if 70 minutes is no biggie for some parents, what about 3, 4 hours? She was luck in some respect that the girl stopped crying after 70 minutes
A girlfriend of mine was following this kind of advice with her two year old, only to wake up in the morning to find that her lips were blue as no one went to her when she was screaming in the night and she was obviously cold

I understand that nanny is a very experienced professional but it doesn't mean she gets it always right. Noone can guarantee that she will interpret the child's cry correctly 100% of the time

Lottapianos · 19/08/2015 09:15

'....., just that I disagree with the post above that someone with childcare experience knows nothing about parenting'

Absolutely right Rabbit

Gileswithachainsaw · 19/08/2015 09:17

It wasn't 70 mins.

I bet if people added up all the times their kids cried it would add up to the same or more.

It was like 40 mins to start but not constant. It was a tantrum not distress.

maybe if people weren't so afraid of a bit of crying they wouldn't need nannies to come and fix their kids sleep. do people really think. waking hourly and getting zero sleep is better than a one or two night session of a tantrum?

Shutthatdoor · 19/08/2015 09:25

Noone can guarantee that she will interpret the child's cry correctly 100% of the time

Can a parent interpret a child's cry 100% correctly 100% of the time.

Gileswithachainsaw · 19/08/2015 09:28

seems to me. parents can't interpret their child's cry at all.not if they jump at every single cry.

or they would not equate ignoring a temper tantrum with abusing a child and leaving a distressed kid to cry.

AnotherTimeMaybe · 19/08/2015 09:39

Can a parent interpret a child's cry 100% correctly 100% of the time.

No,not at all but I think its different if you have checked on the child to ensure they are not cold or thirsty and different if you just shut the door and see them in the morning

I didn't say she should have not let them cry, I guess I'm struggling with the Cry it Out rather than the control crying. I think the nanny raised some good points but left a few gaps exposed around minimum age and maximum duration of CC

Gileswithachainsaw · 19/08/2015 09:46

this was all about the parents needs not the girls

no not wasn't. The girls were being stopped from growing up. They were barely allowed to move even in a park where it's fenced off and had soft flooring.

they couldn't run jump climb or fall down like kids need to do to develop strength and coordination and understanding of the world.

and nothing wrong at all with addressing needs of parents. they are the ones driving in zero sleep. trying to work whilst exhausted.

how long do you think that mums anxiety could carry on for before it became seriously damaging to her health.

how do you thing shed feel when it clocked that she'd held her kids back so much they couldn't or didn't know how to join in play with lids at pre school because they couldn't climb steps up a slide or jump because mummy was always to scared.

There's no need for two year olds to be sucking on bottles

seems to me that keeping them.as babies is more about the parents needs than this was.

RuailleBuaille · 19/08/2015 09:48

I don't think it is child abuse, but there are much gentler ways of sleep training. The parents said it took 2 weeks for the nights to settle, not 2/3 nights. My little girl gets very scared if she wakes and cannot see us- proper sobbing, tears. She's the same in nursery- she just doesn't like to sleep on her own. If she sees us 9/10 times she will lie back down and go to sleep. I don't think the solution is to let her scream for 40mins, and then another 70mins in the night. At the moment we have compromised with a cot in our room; in the near future she will go into her own room and we will do gradual retreat.

Gileswithachainsaw · 19/08/2015 09:51

gentler training isn't always an option. and tbh stringing it out can sometimes make it worse.

nicestrongtea · 19/08/2015 10:54

I think the mum finally understood when the phrase about being separate from your DC was mentioned, that they were individuals with needs of their own.
So many parents cant allow their DC to be people in their own right and constantly apply their own needs/emotions to the situation.

If you constantly run in and take over the situation how will children ever get to learn.
Anger and falling over/ crying is part of life and so is learning to cope with that. "My job is to catch them when they fall,so they don't fall"

I have watched it again as I missed the beginning.
The whole family was miserable, the mum looked like she was about to breakdown and the DC were constantly whinging and unhappy.

She was going in 8 times a night to comfort the DC and they were NOT Happy anyway.

One thing I don't understand why the hell didn't she strap them in a pushchair ??

Gileswithachainsaw · 19/08/2015 11:08

I think we have lost sight of what's normal tbh. We are all guilty of using the company line in MN, myself included, of " they are so young" or "just a baby really" etc that things are being allowed to carry on way after they previously would have done many years ago.

night waking especially. I think the normalising of it being so frequent up until ever increasing ages is actually getting dangerous now.

People are more surprised at dummies, bottles, etc being taken away "so young" or being put into beds or night feeding being normal up til 3 or whatever, than they are at reception children being in nappies or collected in buggies (nt kids here obviously)

and the mere mention of a 10 year old going to the shops has posters suggesting SS.

I think it's good to see a programme like this to help remind people that there is no need to baby our children, that they can walk out the buggy or go through the night and actually be capable of doing things if we let them.

nicestrongtea · 19/08/2015 11:17

Mine self weaned from BF at 18/22 months, not sure why but few DC seem to self wean from dummies/bottles.

Not sure why that is ?

Sallyhasleftthebuilding · 19/08/2015 12:58

I had twins and a toddler round shops, they have legs... no shelf pulling ever... buggy went a 2 years, i was fed up carting it round. Years ago mom had one baby a year so couldnt physically jump to every cry.... it is constant pandering to their every whim that spoils kids. Dummy get rid before they can speak, bottles i chucked out at 1 year old as i was fed up cleaning them. Your baby your decision.