_________________________ROBERT WINSTON___________A CHILD AGAINST ALL ODDS______________

[RTKangaMummy]

TUESDAY 14 NOVEMBER

Documentary

A Child against All Odds

9:00pm - 10:00pm

BBC1 London & South East

VIDEO Plus+: 6443
Subtitles, widescreen

1/6 - Choosing Children

Professor Robert Winston's latest series about genetic selection is particularly challenging because it throws up all sorts of ethical questions about this contentious technology. This week's first, extremely affecting film follows three couples, each of whom want to choose which of their fertilised embryos is given a chance to live and which is left to die. That sounds shockingly callous, to say the least. But it's more understandable when you hear their reasons for using pre-implantation genetic diagnosis. Jill and Ian's seven-month-old daughter died from a rare inherited genetic condition. They want to ensure that if they have another baby, it won't have the killer condition, too. And who can blame them? Where the ethical pond gets muddier is with Andrea and Glenn. They already have four boys but desperately want a girl. Under those circumstances, is it right for them to select their baby's sex using PGD?

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He's has a lot more charm and good bedside manner than my consultant ever did.

Heard he pinches bottoms on the grape vine

well i'm not sure i'd like that. I don't like him in that way .

I've spoken to someone on a fertility website who has been to his clinic in Hammersmith (around the time he started doing his documentaries about 6 years ago?), and they reckoned that he was a complete arse and when they questioned him about part of their treatment, he got quite cross that they had dared to question him!!!

I used to work for a fertility charity and loads of people in the group I ran, went to hammersmith

He helped loads of them get preggars BUT it was the ones with more unusual problems that were seen by him

So in my eyes he is a genius

I meant INfertility support group

I know lots of people who work or have worked with him and agree that whilst he sounds pleasant (but vacuous and patronising in the extreme) on TV that does not necessarily reflect his true personality.

i agree the man is an arse

he says the most obvious things

"there is a difference between boys and girls"

cue pause where you are supposed to be aghast at this revelation

See there I was being tactful and naily just comes right out with it

you say it so much nicer/better than me tamum

Actually no, I think "arse" summed it up jolly well

I remember also watching a documentary about the history of IVF (I am very interested in these things as both my children were born because of IVF!!), and it went back to the time when Steptoe and Edwards were trying to pioneer IVF and how it all come about. Apparently Robert Winston originally pooh poohed the idea of IVF and even accused Steptoe and Edwards of messing with peoples lifes giving them false hope, while at the time he was also trying to 'promote' his own answer to infertility, repairing damaged fallopian tubes. Fast foward a couple of years when IVF became a success and Robert Winston jumps on the IVF bandwagon as well. Robert Edwards then told the story of when Robert Winston tried to apologise to Patrick Steptoe for dissing IVF to begin with and Patrick Steptoe told him where to go in no uncertain terms

My hats off to Robert Winston though as he is a genius and arse or not, he has helped many couples to have children, so that makes him okay in my book!!

I really wanted to give Natallie a good slap.

I am finding the series v hard to cope with for various reasons but am glued to it!

I couldn't stop crying last week at Maisy's parents - poor, poor people. At the end when they all hugged and the DH said "that's right Maisy love your Mummy" I just broke down

That woman who had 4 gorgeous boys - well I too thought she just wanted an accessory. Hope she's learnt the lesson that money can't actually buy you everything!

I felt bereft when the girl twin died last night I thought the parents were so, so brave and caring. They really 'chose' their words carefully and kept their dignity through it all.

Not sure about Natalie - think she has a point to prove too but tbh if I were in her position how would I feel - walking in people's shoes can make you change your mind. She will never be able to have children as a result - that can be hard for some people to live with.

Next week looks interesting too - dealing with male factor fertility issues.

PS - I like Prof Winston and do know people who have had treatment under him at Hammersmith (although as someone else said he tends to deal with the more difficult cases these days only - which isn't unusual for someone in his position). They had nothing but kind words and the utmost respect for him.

In fact loving the series so much I think I'll ask for the book for Xmas!

Message withdrawn

God YES Pruni

well put

I really think natalie should be allowed to use the embryos - in my mind, consent was given when the embryos were created. If a man suddenly decided after sex that he didn't want a baby, he can not force a woman to take the MAP - i realise this is becuase it would constitute an assault on the woman - but I feel the embryos are there now, and she should be able to use them. now if it was a frozen egg and frozen sperm, i think it would be different, but in my view the life has already been created.

So true tortoiseshell, but I can understand his point. At the time he thought they would be bringing their children up together, if he gives consent what part will he play in that childs life, I think she seems like she would be quite difficult to have a parenting relationship with.
I thought her answer to the scenario (ie ex-partener was infertile) she said she would give him half the embryos, not sure if I believe this, could you give up your embryos, I couldn't.

I understand that at the time they envisaged bringing them up together, but that would be the same whether the embryos were created through IVF or natural means - if they split up while she was pregnant, she couldn't be forced to have an abortion and nor would anyone suggest it.

I have to confess it is my view that the embryo is a 'beginning of life', which does influence my view on this.

TUESDAY 28 NOVEMBER

Documentary

A Child Against All Odds

9:00pm - 10:00pm

BBC1 London & South East

VIDEO Plus+: 8041
Subtitles, widescreen

3/6 - Make Me a Dad

Documentary series in which Professor Robert Winston takes a journey through the world of fertility treatment. Professor Winston looks at the amazing treatments that can help men become fathers. Football-mad Wayne only has a small amount of poor quality sperm, so must pin his hopes on an advanced form of IVF. Tom McLoughlin appears to have no sperm at all, so he braves an extraordinary operation to try and have a baby with fiancee Li.

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TUESDAY 05 DECEMBER

Documentary

A Child Against All Odds

9:00pm - 10:00pm

BBC1 London & South East

VIDEO Plus+: 3056
Subtitles, widescreen

4/6 - Cheating Time

Documentary series in which Professor Robert Winston takes a journey through the world of fertility treatment. He looks at why ageing is now the biggest single cause of infertility in the UK. At 35, Karen has the insides of a 50-year-old. Trying to beat her biological clock, she and husband Alex make a journey from Tunbridge Wells to Moscow, but things don't go to plan. At 41, career woman Suzanne may have left having a family too late. She tries a new IVF technique called assisted hatching.

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sure to make me weep!

I know what you mean