OBEM 29/02

[LetsKateWin]

Have you got your tissues ready?

I couldn't find a thread so I thought I'd start one.

Maybe there's more to keeping Victor out than we know about

poor Victor

I'm actually doing a cats bum face here.

Well I hope you all had a lovely time.
I was doing a sodding essay.

I still havent finished it.

Ok. I'm the first to crash this thread and accuse people of being judgemental and bitchy, but I have to say, without apology that Olga was portrayed as being an absolute cow and a drama queen!

But she was Saggy.
The one I feel sorry for is Victor. He'd even bought new jeans and tshirt.
Wonder if he's managed to hold his DD yet?
Drugs are great BTW. I had an ELCS with GA. How many drugs was that

I can understand Olga not wanting her husband there. I get that (DH was with me every second but I couldn't have done it without him) but she was cruel when the baby had been born asking him to leave. Cruel.

You know, in the first series OBEM it seemed to be about celebrating women and this great achievement but lately it seems that it's about denigrating them, medicalising their births, reducing their power and achievement. It's just not as heart warming to watch anymore. I used to cry tears of joy at every birth after seeing the journey etc but now it's kind of horrifying and I get less and less emotional about each "procedure" as it seems to be now. I bet this series wouldn't win any prizes.

I agree.

And this series we've had the mixed race couple with questionable paternity, the language barrier couple, the disabled women, and it looks like next week will be the gay couple.

This programme is nothing about childbirth as interventions are not shared, nor the woman's journey.

I didn't watch the last series. How are they so different?

I didn't see the last series either.
FWIW I think that it's great to show how births are managed in this country. At least those watching without babies have an idea of what to expect. Seeing this programme could even influence the way they want to be treated.
I imagine lots of other women were filmed and the company responsible have chosen those with a bit of human interest.
Would Olga have been as 'interesting' if she hadn't been applying make up and chucking poor old Victor out?

I am going to disagree about Olga.
I would hesitate to call even the most OTT woman a 'drama queen' whilst in labour.

She doesnt speak english. We do not know how much information she has managed to access prenatally. We do not know what the norm is in her home country or family.

I think there are quite a lot of women who might want to say 'tell OH to leave now' but our culture makes that very difficult.
And dont forget that the nuances of speech are often lost in translation (and definately when reduced to subtitles).

I totally agree about the change in the series. The first one was very basic - it showed much more of the labour, it was more fly on the wall and interestingly there were no fanjo shots at all.

These series seem more like the later series of X factor where they have to find an angle and use that to make it more 'interesting'.

The compare and contrast thing dreadful IMO. I particularly disliked the way the lovely young mum who had a relatively easy birth kept getting compared with the older (equally lovely) mum who had tcc for longer and then had a very difficult birth.

I felt we were being told 'LOOK! Look at the young mum who falls pregnant just by looking at her feckless boyfriend. She fairly pops out that baby whilst that poor decent married woman almost dies'

Pissed me right off that did.

No, but I'm not really interested in Olga. I am interested in birth, birth choices and the birth process, which the last series portrayed better.

There was a lot more birthing behaviour of the women in the last series.

msrisotto I think you're right.

I watched the first series when I was pregnant with DD and felt really positive about the impending birth (which actually did end up as a typical cascade of intervention in a CLU following induction) but I was watching this series not having been through it before, I would feel pretty despondent about any hope of birth being a natural process.

The other thing that dawned on me when I watched this morning is that it seems easy to realise why the Birthplace Study came out with the results that it did for the higher rate of interventions for low-risk women giving birth in a CLU (compared to women of the same risk level in an MLU) if all CLUs operate like this one.

Virtually no encouragement to be active (other than the display on the wall Victor was standing in front of) seems to be the biggest thing - almost none of the women in this series have birthed their baby in any position other than lying on the bed. If pushing seems to be taking a while to shift baby, there''s no changing of position to use gravity to help - it seems as if the default setting is forceps. The only birth I can remember from the entire series that didn't have some sort of issue was the 'Disney couple' (remember them, they were fab!) and that was in the pool, very hands off, no lying on the bed)

If they were to film in a MLU then I think there would be a much more positive view of birth rather than 'oh, here we go, on the bed, epidural, forceps' which seems to be the recurrent theme this series.

And as for Vicky (was it Vicky last night) - she very clearly said she DIDN'T want forceps. Yet the doctor still went and got the forceps trolley and there was certainly no mention on the TV of the fact that they were Keillands forceps rather than Neville Barnes (although the label was visible on the metal tray). There is no way in hell I would knowingly consent to those.

This series has bored me rigid.

I agree about the forceps last night.. The lady said " I don't want forceps" and the Obs said " i'll just go and get the forceps trolly"

It portrays women to be utterly powerless. HCPs say something as if it is law and the women agree to everything. In that respect I think it is an accurate reflection of what tends to happen.

Withdrawn consent (forceps, VEs) are argued with and attempts to railroad the women regardless continue.

I was even a bit shocked at the midwives insisting the woman had pain to push with. It was only when she refused point blank that the midwife topped up the epidural.

Now I know it can often be better to feel to push but treat the woman as an individual and LISTEN to her ffs.

I can't help feeling that Vicky would have done a lot better if they had got her onto her knees, quietened down and halved the number of women in the room.

Treating her like a piece of meat, everyone hanging onto a limb whilst shouting at her and frightening her with stories of baby having enough is NOT the way to give birth IMO.

I didn't watch previous series so can't compare, is it possible that the next series will be in a mlu, so it then shows all types of births? Maybe a series on home births after that?

CH4 documentaries aren't great any more. It will be 'Big Fat Gypsy Childbirth' next. Then we can avoid 2 programmes at the same time.

DD was born looking up at the ceiling. I was very lucky and had no problem (apart from with the placenta) so I am confused as to the problem.

I have only just watched it and cried more for Victor. Those lovely flowers after spoilt brat Olga had kicked him out. Is there any follow up to see if he has been allowed near his baby yet??

Thanks for the comparison and explaining to me. I had such a weird time giving birth to DS (I have asked to go through my notes) that being on the bed, pushing, forceps etc are alien to me. It is good to hear other people's views.

I watched last night and the only thing I didn't like (until reading above) was there being so many people in the room with Vicky but I don't know any better.

I know nothing about Lithuanian culture but I am assumming that the norm tends to be for the father to not be involved in the birthing process or with breastfeeding either given that Olga told him to go away when baby was put to the breast.

That being said, I did wonder how she got pregnant when she appeared so prudish about everything!!!!

Victor said men were allowed with their wives when they were in labour in his country.