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Telly addicts

anyone watching Dispatches on c4?

25 replies

varicoseveined · 23/08/2010 20:28

Re: first cousin marriage in the Pakistani community

OP posts:
Meglet · 23/08/2010 20:31

Have turned over now (was watching snog, marry, avoid Blush).

TwoIfBySea · 23/08/2010 20:36

What if the government said that if you marry your first cousin then any children born from that who are disabled will not be entitled to benefits? Care by the NHS yet but not any financial benefits? It is crude but perhaps that might help...even a little?

Never realised it was such a problem but there you go. People are frightened to say anything against communities where they will be instantly shouted down as racist.

AlgebraRocksMySocks · 23/08/2010 20:36

I wanted to watch this but my DSD is staying and it didn't seem like appropriate viewing for a 12yo!

AlgebraRocksMySocks · 23/08/2010 20:38

so is it specifically about the pakistani community then, or about the general dangers of cousins having offspring as it does presumably happen in other cultures?

varicoseveined · 23/08/2010 20:44

Algebra - The Pakistani community has been looked at, they just featured a white English couple who are first cousins.

OP posts:
TheButterflyEffect · 23/08/2010 20:46

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

DinahRod · 23/08/2010 20:46

The biggest % in the UK is within the Pakistani community, hence the focus.

spacer · 23/08/2010 20:50

I just can't imagine marrying or being intimate with my first cousins. The fact that we share grandparents just makes it seem so wrong. We have asthma in our family and that is bad enough. There's already been a death in the family due to it. To put children at even more of a health risk is so wrong.

lisad123isgoingcrazy · 23/08/2010 20:50

watching it, very sad what those families go though and how torn they must be. :(

DinahRod · 23/08/2010 20:55

700 born every year with disability and no campaign. Presumably too sensitive within and without the Pakistani community?

SilveryMoon · 23/08/2010 20:56

I'll be watching on C4+1 after panorama

Rockbird · 23/08/2010 20:57

My cousin has just married her cousin. They didn't know each other as children, met as adults. No health issues, have researched everything till they were satisfied there were no risks.

Cousins marrying once is not the same as communities where families repeatedly marry each other.

AlgebraRocksMySocks · 23/08/2010 20:58

ah I see thanks. sorry to keep asking questions as I can't watch it for a few days but is it about forced marriage between cousins or spontaneous relationships?

lisad123isgoingcrazy · 23/08/2010 21:01

bit of both, some of it touches on forces marriages but mainly about cousins marrying and the risks to children.

Rock bird, the risks are the same as a one off if grandparents carry a gene problem as its likely both cousins would be the gene carriers, iyswim

CaptainKirksNipples · 23/08/2010 21:07

Watching now

missedith01 · 23/08/2010 21:12

Is there any everyday human tragedy that can't be cited as an excuse to withdraw benefits? Just as a matter of interest?

flibbertigibbert · 23/08/2010 21:30

Just watching it now. As someone who works with blind young people it made me Angry.

Not sure that withdrawing NHS treatment would help - it could just lead to horrible cases of people locking their children away and denying them health care.

traceybath · 23/08/2010 21:33

It has been a big unspoken subject though.

SIL is a dr and did part of her training in Bradford and said several years ago how it was becoming a big issue but everyone was too scared of being called racist to raise it.

Just very sad really - not sure what the solution is as it seems to be such an engrained cultural issue.

Casserole · 23/08/2010 21:37

Rockbird the number of conditions they can test for is very limited compared to the number of mutations that can occur. So whilst they can rule some things out, they can't rule everything out.

But yes, obviously in a family where generations have been intermarrying for many years it gets to be a smaller and smaller gene pool.

I watched it. It made me sad, angry, and hopeful. Sad because so many families are living under these burdens, and so many children born into suffering. Angry at those in positions of leadership within those communities who fail to heed the evidence. And hopeful that someone is at least speaking out. I used to work in a related field in an area with a high proportion of families in whose tradition marrying cousins was fine - many of those children had such awful problems; it was something that we all knew the cause of unofficially but no-one dared speak about officially.

I am thankful for that Muslim preacher they had on there who was speaking out about it in his congregation and whose own family had suffered - I hope someone somewhere with some clout saw him and snaps him up to do some national education.

Oh I really disagreed with the doctor saying the best way was to target families for genetic counselling rather than a public education campaign. Surely you need both? You need to work with the families where cousins are already married, to try and minimise their risk (but see above, you can only minimise it) but you surely also at some point need to try and educate the future generations, to turn the tide of this longer term?

(Oh. And lastly, withdrawing benefits would do nothing, except increase these children's and families' suffering)

YourCallIsImportant · 23/08/2010 21:40

I'm watching on C4+1. It is really interesting and shocking at the same time. 33% of children with recessive genetic disorders are born of pakistani/bangladeshi families, when pakistani/bangladeshis make up only 1.5% of the population.

It must be heartbreaking for the parents and devastating for the children. Worth a watch on 4OD if you missed it.

lily333 · 23/08/2010 22:03

Really good programme.
Though I'm unsure where the bit was where any withdrawal of benefits was mentioned??

Common sense should prevail here - it isn't a matter of racism - at the end of the day all statistics prove that if relatives marry they run a higher risk of hereditary genetic abnormalities. This is applicable no matter what the actual blood relationship. Obviously the closer the relationship, and the more often down the line this pattern is repeated then the more frequent the disabilities and abnormalities.Sad

WetAugust · 23/08/2010 22:32

The ignorance and denial that some on this programme showed when faced with medical facts was breathtaking - it made me very angry. Tradition placed well above sheer comon sense Angry

GothAnneGeddes · 24/08/2010 00:08

If you looked at the programme credits, you will have seen mostly Asian names listed, the programme makers were British Asian Muslims, so people are starting to be aware.

Also, there are enough British Pakistanis within the medical community to speak out against this and it is happening, but it will take time.

AS for denial, I watched The Hospital afterwards with people in denial about the cause of their liver problems, denial is problem one of the number one health problems, whatever the condition.

MumNWLondon · 24/08/2010 09:19

I watched it and was very saddened. TBH am totally Shock at idea of saying that any resultant children not entitled to NHS treatment.

The problems seemed to be:

a) can't do genetic testing as only 40% of conditions are even testable - although genetic testing has meant that the jewish community has eradicated tay-sachs link

b) seems to be deep cultural reasons for cousin marriages, when this happens over several generations then the gene pool becomes very small - the Koran neither encourages nor bans cousin marriages.

c) the genetic diseases when they strike cause much suffering and often more than one child per family affected.

TBH I knew about this a long time ago - my dad was GP in ibrox (glasgow) lots of pakistani patients, cousin marriages and rare genetic illnesses. Just shocked that still happening, my dad spoke of this more than 20 years ago.

MumNWLondon · 24/08/2010 09:35

If you draw it on a sheet of paper, you can work out that the first time it happens the cousins who marry have a set of grandparents in common but they each have another set as well.

If it happens a second time eg within that family and the children from the first cousin marriages then marry their first cousins, its possible that they share one set of grandparents and the 2nd set are siblings of the first set - meaning that all 8 greatgrandparents are common, so genetically not so different between siblings marrying.

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